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Independence - how would you vote?


Wee Bully

Independence - how would you vote  

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The main reason is because of the language and the way the yes voters obnoxiously turn their noses up and shout down no voters.

Not just on here but on any televised debate that I have seen. This is very unappealing for me. True visionaries don't spend their time attacking they show their vision.

If the yes vote was a no brainier then why aren't the people of Scotland getting the argument?

In a nutshell I am concerned about job security, being able to cope alone and being led by salmond who I have no time for.

Simply attacking Westminster won't convince me to change you need to tell me why change is better.

I think the snp has failed in their duty to do this, this is my opinion. They seem more interested in sneering at the no campaign and labelling any no voters as idiots. There's no hope in hell they will turn people into yes voters if they keep going down this path.

As I have said nothing would please me more than a fully independent scotland that was full of jobs and becoming a great place to live but I don't see it and think that gambling on oil prices during a recession is not the time to do it.

Ten years ago might have been better, I stand by my comment that the snp only got in as a protest against labour.

We will see shortly if that is the case, I doubt the snp voters will have the bottle to be honest.

This is interesting, because it's actually the "no" camp which I've found to be the ones that are more inclined to put people down for disagreeing with them. You've obviously met different people from me.

I do believe there is much to be gained from the yes vote and I believe the arguments are becoming clearer and clearer, especially looking at the manner in which smaller nations have recovered from problems.

I disliike Salmond too, but we will have an election. Independence does not mean President Salmond.

You say attacking Westminster won't do it for you, but if Westminster was working then there'd be no need for independence. A big argument for independence is that we can build a better, fairer society. Westminster has epically failed to deliver such a society.

Like I say, I think your getting your campaigns mixed up - the Yes campaigns latest push has been publicising the difference in GDP and deficit figures between Scotland and the UK. The No campaign has been busy interpreting their own meaning from Swinney's leaked document. Only one of these sounds like sneering to me.

Yup, the SNP probably did get in as a protest vote to Labour, but they got in 2nd time because they did a good job first time. This has nothing to do with the indy debate though.

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If this one is close and a yes we get on with it. Would be interesting to see what everyone's position afterwards will be though, there will be a lot of 'we were closet Nats' as they try and salvage a career out of the wreckage of the no campaign.

If this one is close and a no and we get nowhere like the powers we want, next time round it would be a 60/40 yes.

I'm happy with devo max, in fact once I start canvassing proper I'm going to love it.

You wanted devo max but you weren't given what you wanted, and you trust Westminster to deliver it after a no vote???

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When you grow up.

Aww, can I just check which of us uses childish insults? Which of us drops in swearwords because it makes him sound clever? Which of us has been caught out lying time and time again? Which of us flat out refuses to admit he is wrong? Which one of us is fundamentally intellectually dishonest?

And to clarify, which one of us do you feel needs to grow up?

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What is certain is that the rules of the bailout would've been different: I doubt Scotland could or would nationalise the bank on it's own cogniscance - and it would have put the rUK in a bind: Required to protect their savers interests in a foreign bank, unable to nationalise it either.

You can protect savers without bailing out a bank. The UK government already had in place a savers protection scheme (up to 30K I think).

It would have been an utter disaster for Scotland, if independent, to have 2 enormous banks, flagship companies for the country, ready to fail. There would have to be requests to rUK and the EU for bailouts, in exactly the same way Ireland had to.

The Irish banks were multinational also. They nearly crippled the Irish economy though.

rUK would have contributed heavily to the bailout, but it couldn't have nationalised RBS in the way it did.

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็็็Hi HB, I never ran away from your question, some have to work and observe.

I work together either, with many EU people, like you and me they will always be closer than the US..

ps had a beer

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็็็Hi HB, I never ran away from your question, some have to work and observe.

I work together either, with many EU people, like you and me they will always be closer than the US..

ps had a beer

I don't even remember asking you a question.

What was it?

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pull the other one ad-lib, you have taken part in hustings and spoken at party conference.

and if you haven't been 'spotted', then the libs are bigger idiots than we all thought.

I haven't taken part in hustings... I've run the Glasgow Youth wing for half a year, spoken at a Uni event against party policy on Independence in connection with a campus event and spoken at Conference as a critical friend who actually knows what he's talking about on the constitutional question. As it happens, speaking at Conference in the Lib Dems doesn't mark you out as exceptional... we all like the sound of our own voices.

People know who I am but I have no interest in making a career as a politician.

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I haven't taken part in hustings... I've run the Glasgow Youth wing for half a year, spoken at a Uni event against party policy on Independence in connection with a campus event and spoken at Conference as a critical friend who actually knows what he's talking about on the constitutional question. As it happens, speaking at Conference in the Lib Dems doesn't mark you out as exceptional... we all like the sound of our own voices.

People know who I am but I have no interest in making a career as a politician.

No, you're right. Being a Scottish Lib Dem alone is exceptional. There is nothing exceptional about both of you speaking. :P
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People know who I am but I have no interest in making a career as a politician.

sensible. to be a politician, you have to swallow having no life, no real friends, and certainly very little time to yourself.

You have to be ruthless / sociopathic enough to focus on the needs of politics above all else. That means walking away from friendships / relationships of over thirty years standing, without a backward glance, if needs be.

Politics can be very exciting in short bursts, but is ninety percent boredom and, once elected, relentless six and three quarter days a week unrelenting toil. You're never away from work.

Sure, if elected, there are financial rewards and susidised perks, but on balance, not really a life to be recommended to anybody.

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sensible. to be a politician, you have to swallow having no life, no real friends, and certainly very little time to yourself.

You have to be ruthless / sociopathic enough to focus on the needs of politics above all else. That means walking away from friendships / relationships of over thirty years standing, without a backward glance, if needs be.

Politics can be very exciting in short bursts, but is ninety percent boredom and, once elected, relentless six and three quarter days a week unrelenting toil. You're never away from work.

Sure, if elected, there are financial rewards and susidised perks, but on balance, not really a life to be recommended to anybody.

What you are saying, in a nutshell, is that you have to be a total c**t and a complete w****r to want to be a politician.

And I agree with this completely. Career politicians should be banned. Stand for office twice and then f**k off forever. And do it for free.

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Phillip Hammond up today to make a speech debunking Scotland's defence post independence. 'join the Scottish navy and see the Clyde' he will mock, adding that 'high calibre' recruits will be difficult to obtain owing to a lack of 'opportunities'.

I'll be interested to hear what he has to say on the make up of planned UK defence forces in Scotland- that being one air base, Faslane and a couple of barracks. This with a background of poor recruitment to Scottish regiments, down on numbers and filled with foreign troops. I can't see that being eased with the news that 1 scots will be based in Northern Ireland (although the families can apply to stay in Edinburgh).

He also implies that we won't be getting any equipment as a percentage share of independence. 'half a destroyer....is no good to anyone'. So, will we build our own ships? So much for the end of Shipbuilding on the Clyde in that case.

I see the Irish defence force has had no shortage of applicants as they look to increase their numbers by 600 to 9,500. This looks like another attempt to muddy the waters based on the usual. We'll see......

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Phillip Hammond up today to make a speech debunking Scotland's defence post independence. 'join the Scottish navy and see the Clyde' he will mock, adding that 'high calibre' recruits will be difficult to obtain owing to a lack of 'opportunities'.

I'll be interested to hear what he has to say on the make up of planned UK defence forces in Scotland- that being one air base, Faslane and a couple of barracks. This with a background of poor recruitment to Scottish regiments, down on numbers and filled with foreign troops. I can't see that being eased with the news that 1 scots will be based in Northern Ireland (although the families can apply to stay in Edinburgh).

He also implies that we won't be getting any equipment as a percentage share of independence. 'half a destroyer....is no good to anyone'. So, will we build our own ships? So much for the end of Shipbuilding on the Clyde in that case.

I see the Irish defence force has had no shortage of applicants as they look to increase their numbers by 600 to 9,500. This looks like another attempt to muddy the waters based on the usual. We'll see......

This will no doubt be missed. Fact is that any Scottish defence force is going to be based on our own little patch of the Atlantic and North Sea. We don't need to f**k about around the world.

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Sortof. Though the Irish were in Kosovo. There will still be a Blue Hat requirement for New Scotland's armed forces.

It is one of the good reasons for Independence though, without a doubt. It's one that i find persuasive. It's expensive.

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Phillip Hammond up today to make a speech debunking Scotland's defence post independence. 'join the Scottish navy and see the Clyde' he will mock, adding that 'high calibre' recruits will be difficult to obtain owing to a lack of 'opportunities'.

I'll be interested to hear what he has to say on the make up of planned UK defence forces in Scotland- that being one air base, Faslane and a couple of barracks. This with a background of poor recruitment to Scottish regiments, down on numbers and filled with foreign troops. I can't see that being eased with the news that 1 scots will be based in Northern Ireland (although the families can apply to stay in Edinburgh).

He also implies that we won't be getting any equipment as a percentage share of independence. 'half a destroyer....is no good to anyone'. So, will we build our own ships? So much for the end of Shipbuilding on the Clyde in that case.

I see the Irish defence force has had no shortage of applicants as they look to increase their numbers by 600 to 9,500. This looks like another attempt to muddy the waters based on the usual. We'll see......

Great cut them up for scrap and dish out the cash,as he obviously thinks ruk are only geting half a destroyer aswell

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This will no doubt be missed. Fact is that any Scottish defence force is going to be based on our own little patch of the Atlantic and North Sea. We don't need to f**k about around the world.

Not too sure we would just stay at home all the time, here a list of countries involved in Afghanistan

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Participants_in_Operation_Enduring_Freedom

edit for better link

http://www.isaf.nato.int/troop-numbers-and-contributions/index.php

you can click on each country & it tells you how many troops are the ground

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Great cut them up for scrap and dish out the cash,as he obviously thinks ruk are only geting half a destroyer aswell

As long as it's the hull then at least we can stick some oars on it and row the fucker.

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Phillip Hammond up today to make a speech debunking Scotland's defence post independence. 'join the Scottish navy and see the Clyde' he will mock, adding that 'high calibre' recruits will be difficult to obtain owing to a lack of 'opportunities'.

I'll be interested to hear what he has to say on the make up of planned UK defence forces in Scotland- that being one air base, Faslane and a couple of barracks. This with a background of poor recruitment to Scottish regiments, down on numbers and filled with foreign troops. I can't see that being eased with the news that 1 scots will be based in Northern Ireland (although the families can apply to stay in Edinburgh).

He also implies that we won't be getting any equipment as a percentage share of independence. 'half a destroyer....is no good to anyone'. So, will we build our own ships? So much for the end of Shipbuilding on the Clyde in that case.

I see the Irish defence force has had no shortage of applicants as they look to increase their numbers by 600 to 9,500. This looks like another attempt to muddy the waters based on the usual. We'll see......

I don't see any negatives in any of this.

take our place in the UN and NATO and take part proportionally like other small european nations do.

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