Sons' sorrow

[Sons Fan]

7 minutes ago, Thommo90 said:

Just received a link to watch the AGM tonight.  Will tune in to that.

Latest betting odds - Farrell to have over 9.5 excuses for the on field performances = 1/6

It just feels weird to have Farrell there tonight, dare I say it’s almost Barry Ferguson type behaviour. 
 

Meet the manager type events are good at the start of the season/end. Not when your on a terrible run and flinging excuses out left right and centre. He should do his talking on the touch line/dressing room rather than in a room full of fans IMO.

[Guest]

On 29/03/2022 at 08:17, O'Kelly Isley III said:

It's a bit ad-hoc but members can submit questions by PM to me on here and I will pass them on.  Due to Covid I won't be in attendance myself.

Sorry for the short notice on questions, but here goes...

For the trust...

1. What input, if any, does the trust representee on the board have with regards to decision making regarding playing matters.

2. At any point since our horrific run of form began late last year (2021) Has there actually been a meeting of the board to discuss what action should have been took? Or did we all just close our eyes and hope for the best? 

3. Is there any way in which, in the future, the money we donate through trust organised funraisers, managers funds, charity nights etc etc can be donated to the club but in receipt of buying shares to pave a way towards fan ownership. 

4. Has the trust considered ways to improve its communication with its members as opposed to the seldom updates we currently receive which very rarely give us any insight towards what is happening at the top of our club. 

For the manager...

1. If he was a season ticket holder at the team of his choosing at which point over the last 6 months would he have decided that a managers time was up. 

2. You talk about training out the mistakes and trying to keep ourself in the game for longer yet we seem to fail at doing this almost as terribly as we do when we try to take the game to opposition. Is this a case of poor signings or poor management in terms of not recognizing what suits us best. 

3. As a manager, you are all to aware that football is a results driven business. What results do you believe we have shown that merits you still being the manager of this football club. 

4. You mention individual errors being our downfall. However the number of sending off's this season have been inexcusable at any level. So without blaming officials, why are so many of our players so ill disciplined ? Are they frustrated by results or by the way they are being asked to play?

5. We are consistently poor from set pieces, yet this was our biggest threat last year. In the last 4 months ive seen us look a threat on four occasions and all 4 of them were from Joe Mckee set pieces. Can you explain the reason behind Joes lack of game time and also the inability to make substitutes until the game is away from us and we are already two or three down with 15 minutes to go. 





I Would appreciate any answers to any of the above questions. I however wish I was there in person as I would have no issue asking any of the above. I understand that these might not be other peoples views however that is the beauty of personal opinion. 

As always I will be honest in my replies should anyone want to reply to me on here too. 

Have a good night folks and I hope anyone going along tonight gets the chance to ask and hear the answers they are looking for at a long overdue AGM! Aw the best 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Thommo90 said:

Just received a link to watch the AGM tonight.  Will tune in to that.

Latest betting odds - Farrell to have over 9.5 excuses for the on field performances = 1/6

Can you share this... I thought all trust members were sent one but I cant seem to see it 

[BallochSonsFan]

14 minutes ago, DobbiesAgent said:

Sorry for the short notice on questions, but here goes...

For the trust...

1. What input, if any, does the trust representee on the board have with regards to decision making regarding playing matters.

2. At any point since our horrific run of form began late last year (2021) Has there actually been a meeting of the board to discuss what action should have been took? Or did we all just close our eyes and hope for the best? 

3. Is there any way in which, in the future, the money we donate through trust organised funraisers, managers funds, charity nights etc etc can be donated to the club but in receipt of buying shares to pave a way towards fan ownership. 

4. Has the trust considered ways to improve its communication with its members as opposed to the seldom updates we currently receive which very rarely give us any insight towards what is happening at the top of our club. 

For the manager...

1. If he was a season ticket holder at the team of his choosing at which point over the last 6 months would he have decided that a managers time was up. 

2. You talk about training out the mistakes and trying to keep ourself in the game for longer yet we seem to fail at doing this almost as terribly as we do when we try to take the game to opposition. Is this a case of poor signings or poor management in terms of not recognizing what suits us best. 

3. As a manager, you are all to aware that football is a results driven business. What results do you believe we have shown that merits you still being the manager of this football club. 

4. You mention individual errors being our downfall. However the number of sending off's this season have been inexcusable at any level. So without blaming officials, why are so many of our players so ill disciplined ? Are they frustrated by results or by the way they are being asked to play?

5. We are consistently poor from set pieces, yet this was our biggest threat last year. In the last 4 months ive seen us look a threat on four occasions and all 4 of them were from Joe Mckee set pieces. Can you explain the reason behind Joes lack of game time and also the inability to make substitutes until the game is away from us and we are already two or three down with 15 minutes to go. 





I Would appreciate any answers to any of the above questions. I however wish I was there in person as I would have no issue asking any of the above. I understand that these might not be other peoples views however that is the beauty of personal opinion. 

As always I will be honest in my replies should anyone want to reply to me on here too. 

Have a good night folks and I hope anyone going along tonight gets the chance to ask and hear the answers they are looking for at a long overdue AGM! Aw the best 

I can probably answer number 3 (cash for shares) for you, and I'm not currently a trust board member.

There are only 2 ways that anybody can buy shares in Dumbarton. Either they buy shares from an existing shareholder or the club issues some of it's unissued share capital and makes those shares available for general sale. Option 1 means no money going to the club. The money goes to the existing shareholder.

 

Option 2 is the interesting one. The previous owners made it absolutely clear that they would block any attempts by the club to raise funds in a way that put their shareholding at risk or that obliged them to buy new shares to maintain their shareholding. I don't see how the current owners would view things any differently. Any new shares issued would risk diluting their influence at the club unless they bought new shares to maintain their percentage share holding. I doubt that the current owners would want to be in that position and that makes the issuing of new Dumbarton shares exceptionally unlikely. They're not going to vote for something that potentially dilutes their position of having overall control of the club.

 

[O'Kelly Isley III]

Looks like the link has gone down.

[Thommo90]

16 minutes ago, O'Kelly Isley III said:

Looks like the link has gone down.

Aye, bit disappointing 

[FifeSons]

Anyone know if its coming back up?

[Guest]

45 minutes ago, FifeSons said:

Anyone know if its coming back up?

my wife asked a similiar question at the weekend

[FifeSons]

Interested to hear what Farrell was asked and had to say.

[Bring Back Paddy Flannery]

8 minutes ago, FifeSons said:

Interested to hear what Farrell was asked and had to say.

I’ll be honest, I’m more interested in the stuff surrounding the owners and the club. I have nae real interest in what Farrell has to say, absolutely nothing he says will change my mind on him or his team. I really hope his attendance didn’t distract from the other issues that needed discussed.

[FifeSons]

5 minutes ago, Bring Back Paddy Flannery said:

I’ll be honest, I’m more interested in the stuff surrounding the owners and the club. I have nae real interest in what Farrell has to say, absolutely nothing he says will change my mind on him or his team. I really hope his attendance didn’t distract from the other issues that needed discussed.

So am I. I’m still quite curious how it went, though.

[BallochSonsFan]

Stevie understandably asked for a bit of common sense around reporting what was discussed. There have been events recently where other managers comments were fed back on social media without context and perhaps not entirely accurately and where it put those managers in an awkward and unfair position.

All I'll say on the Farrell part of the meeting is that he was very honest with what he said and a lot of it was very fair. It was certainly an interesting and engaging part of the meeting and I think those in attendance appreciated what he said, even if folk will still have their own views at the end of it.. Everybody will have their own views on his comments, but nobody could fault him for honesty or fairness. It certainly wasn't a distraction and was done at a very appropriate part of the meeting, after the trust business had been conducted and a robust Q&A session was held.

I did say earlier on the thread that I'd rather the club chairman was there because I think that we need to do something to address the disconnect that exists between the fans and the club board. I stand by that. I think that the club board have questions to answer and that in turn the owners have questions to answer too. There's a big picture right now with Dumbarton that makes the issue of Farrell and our current league position seem like the least of our concerns. There's an absolutely massive amount of work to be done in addressing some of the underlying issues at the club and the huge concerns we all have regarding our owners. Hopefully we see people focus on the bigger picture and the significant worries that we should all have about our current situation.

[Bring Back Paddy Flannery]

3 minutes ago, BallochSonsFan said:

Stevie understandably asked for a bit of common sense around reporting what was discussed. There have been events recently where other managers comments were fed back on social media without context and perhaps not entirely accurately and where it put those managers in an awkward and unfair position.

All I'll say on the Farrell part of the meeting is that he was very honest with what he said and a lot of it was very fair. It was certainly an interesting and engaging part of the meeting and I think those in attendance appreciated what he said, even if folk will still have their own views at the end of it.. Everybody will have their own views on his comments, but nobody could fault him for honesty or fairness. It certainly wasn't a distraction and was done at a very appropriate part of the meeting, after the trust business had been conducted and a robust Q&A session was held.

I did say earlier on the thread that I'd rather the club chairman was there because I think that we need to do something to address the disconnect that exists between the fans and the club board. I stand by that. I think that the club board have questions to answer and that in turn the owners have questions to answer too. There's a big picture right now with Dumbarton that makes the issue of Farrell and our current league position seem like the least of our concerns. There's an absolutely massive amount of work to be done in addressing some of the underlying issues at the club and the huge concerns we all have regarding our owners. Hopefully we see people focus on the bigger picture and the significant worries that we should all have about our current situation.

Whilst I would agree that some issues are ranked higher than others in terms of importance and severity, I’d absolutely hate to see our support just accept shite on the park because we have bigger issues off it. I appreciate the two are connected but at the same time the main reason any of us support the club is for the football, not the politics. I think people should be focussed on both issues, we don’t just need to ignore one because other stuff is worse.

[FifeSons]

9 minutes ago, BallochSonsFan said:

Stevie understandably asked for a bit of common sense around reporting what was discussed. There have been events recently where other managers comments were fed back on social media without context and perhaps not entirely accurately and where it put those managers in an awkward and unfair position.

All I'll say on the Farrell part of the meeting is that he was very honest with what he said and a lot of it was very fair. It was certainly an interesting and engaging part of the meeting and I think those in attendance appreciated what he said, even if folk will still have their own views at the end of it.. Everybody will have their own views on his comments, but nobody could fault him for honesty or fairness. It certainly wasn't a distraction and was done at a very appropriate part of the meeting, after the trust business had been conducted and a robust Q&A session was held.

I did say earlier on the thread that I'd rather the club chairman was there because I think that we need to do something to address the disconnect that exists between the fans and the club board. I stand by that. I think that the club board have questions to answer and that in turn the owners have questions to answer too. There's a big picture right now with Dumbarton that makes the issue of Farrell and our current league position seem like the least of our concerns. There's an absolutely massive amount of work to be done in addressing some of the underlying issues at the club and the huge concerns we all have regarding our owners. Hopefully we see people focus on the bigger picture and the significant worries that we should all have about our current situation.

Thanks for the feedback.

Will there not be any further footage available than where the stream cut?

[FifeSons]

3 minutes ago, Bring Back Paddy Flannery said:

Whilst I would agree that some issues are ranked higher than others in terms of importance and severity, I’d absolutely hate to see our support just accept shite on the park because we have bigger issues off it. I appreciate the two are connected but at the same time the main reason any of us support the club is for the football, not the politics. I think people should be focussed on both issues, we don’t just need to ignore one because other stuff is worse.

For me, being closer to the SPFL trapdoor has a strong correlation with what happens off the park going forward. Dropping into the Lowland League would only further fuel the supporter apathy and disinterest in the club and make it easier for the club to be chopped up and sold for scrap.

[Boghead ranter]

1 hour ago, DobbiesAgent said:

my wife asked a similiar question at the weekend

Not to me, she didn't.

[microdave]

Stevie said that when he was interviewed last summer, he mentioned to the board that there's been a lack of player continuity over the past decade and that's why we have signed (some) players on two year deals and that he hopes to do the same this summer.

That got me thinking about it so I've done a wee check to see how many players have played in two consecutive seasons since 2011/12. I've decided only to include players with five or more appearances in their (at least) second season. It also includes guys who have left in the summer and then returned the following January.

11/12 8
12/13 7
13/14 11
14/15 14
15/16 5
16/17 8
17/18 7
18/19 6
19/20 4
20/21 9
21/22 4.

I think Faz has a point and that it's no coincidence that the only two seasons in double figures are arguably our most successful in the past decade.

[The Moonster]

Not sure what point the link cut out for those online but I thought David Brownlee and a certain audience member (I won't name him in case he doesn't want it on here) were brutally honest tonight and I would hope the Sons fans eyes are now open to the huge shit we are in. 

Essentially Cognitive Capital have taken out loans against sections of our land in order to pay Brabco for the club. If that is true then we're looking at over a million quid in debt secured against the stadium. I don't think it needs explaining what happens if that debt is called in and CC can't/won't pay. Henning is full of shit and if there is one thing that should be abundantly clear it is that Andy Hosie is an absolute poison and all of our efforts should be concentrated on removing him and his hingers on from the club. We really cannot progress until they are gone. This is where the current board need to address things - just how have we arrived at this mess and what have they been doing to safeguard the future? There is more than a worry amongst the trust board that the DFC board are sleepwalking a bit here, so I think the trust and support as a whole really need to apply pressure there. We have a bunch of crooks in ownership right now, none of them have the past or future of this club in mind. Interesting to note that the move to Dalmoak may be dead but if anything it creates more questions. Board and owners need to put themselves in front of fans as Faz did tonight. 

So, onto Faz, it was pretty much as I expected. He accepts full  responsibility for what's happened but did try to explain the reasons behind the season as best he could. He's honest, hard working, humble and has a terrific spirit for community and local involvement, if he could get the results on the pitch he would be the perfect manager for a club of our size. I actually don't think the fans and Faz are too far apart in our assessment of the season, where the fans deviate from Faz is in believing we can still stay up. He was pretty brave in saying the target is a minimum of 8 points in our remaining games and he thinks that keeps us safe from any play offs, 9 a definite. So for me we need to win on Saturday, against Peterhead and against Clyde on the last day. If he pulls that off and keeps us safe I think most Sons fans will eat humble pie, it's just hard to see it at this point. 

[Guest]

42 minutes ago, BallochSonsFan said:

Stevie understandably asked for a bit of common sense around reporting what was discussed. There have been events recently where other managers comments were fed back on social media without context and perhaps not entirely accurately and where it put those managers in an awkward and unfair position.

All I'll say on the Farrell part of the meeting is that he was very honest with what he said and a lot of it was very fair. It was certainly an interesting and engaging part of the meeting and I think those in attendance appreciated what he said, even if folk will still have their own views at the end of it.. Everybody will have their own views on his comments, but nobody could fault him for honesty or fairness. It certainly wasn't a distraction and was done at a very appropriate part of the meeting, after the trust business had been conducted and a robust Q&A session was held.

I did say earlier on the thread that I'd rather the club chairman was there because I think that we need to do something to address the disconnect that exists between the fans and the club board. I stand by that. I think that the club board have questions to answer and that in turn the owners have questions to answer too. There's a big picture right now with Dumbarton that makes the issue of Farrell and our current league position seem like the least of our concerns. There's an absolutely massive amount of work to be done in addressing some of the underlying issues at the club and the huge concerns we all have regarding our owners. Hopefully we see people focus on the bigger picture and the significant worries that we should all have about our current situation.

So just to check the first part of your reply there…

 

what your saying is if your unfortunate enough to have missed tonight meeting through one circumstance or another then you won’t be privy to anything that was said during it. 
 

another prime example of the lack of clarity and communication between all trust members. honestly why bother at all 

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, The Moonster said:

Not sure what point the link cut out for those online but I thought David Brownlee and a certain audience member (I won't name him in case he doesn't want it on here) were brutally honest tonight and I would hope the Sons fans eyes are now open to the huge shit we are in. 

Essentially Cognitive Capital have taken out loans against sections of our land in order to pay Brabco for the club. If that is true then we're looking at over a million quid in debt secured against the stadium. I don't think it needs explaining what happens if that debt is called in and CC can't/won't pay. Henning is full of shit and if there is one thing that should be abundantly clear it is that Andy Hosie is an absolute poison and all of our efforts should be concentrated on removing him and his hingers on from the club. We really cannot progress until they are gone. This is where the current board need to address things - just how have we arrived at this mess and what have they been doing to safeguard the future? There is more than a worry amongst the trust board that the DFC board are sleepwalking a bit here, so I think the trust and support as a whole really need to apply pressure there. We have a bunch of crooks in ownership right now, none of them have the past or future of this club in mind. Interesting to note that the move to Dalmoak may be dead but if anything it creates more questions. Board and owners need to put themselves in front of fans as Faz did tonight. 

So, onto Faz, it was pretty much as I expected. He accepts full  responsibility for what's happened but did try to explain the reasons behind the season as best he could. He's honest, hard working, humble and has a terrific spirit for community and local involvement, if he could get the results on the pitch he would be the perfect manager for a club of our size. I actually don't think the fans and Faz are too far apart in our assessment of the season, where the fans deviate from Faz is in believing we can still stay up. He was pretty brave in saying the target is a minimum of 8 points in our remaining games and he thinks that keeps us safe from any play offs, 9 a definite. So for me we need to win on Saturday, against Peterhead and against Clyde on the last day. If he pulls that off and keeps us safe I think most Sons fans will eat humble pie, it's just hard to see it at this point. 

Thanks for the update and the clarity…something others on here could learn from