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4 hours ago, Bring Back Paddy Flannery said:

Nothing major, just a daft comment about fans shouting keep the ball on the deck or some pish, having a bit of a pop at them. 

He had a mumble on the pitch about it as well and shouted back into the stands when people including myself shouted to keep it down.

It doesn’t take an expert to realise that when the wind kicks up at our ground you cannot play hoof ball, it’s that simple.

I find it crazy that our players aren’t told this or learn. Tbh they did start to realise after 3/4 more hoofs.

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On 31/10/2021 at 00:34, Nowhereman said:


Did Clydebank not manage to develop Holm Park because they received assistance from West Dunbartonshire Council?

WDC did help pay for renovations that paid the bulk of it, but the stuff to get over the line like toilets, refs changing rooms and other infrastructure was paid for by fans/sponsors and other means. The sums involved are no where near the assistance that John McFall provided the move from boghead to the rock, indeed our new local MP doesnt seem interested in football except for a photo op (as indeed do many in the SNP in the west). We put a case to the council because we formed a structure to provide facilities (along with yoker) which are independently managed taking the burden away from the council in terms of staffing it etc where there was an already significant lack of provision. Its also not just about our first team football, we now have an academy structure led by Uefa accredited coaches from age 5-first team, even with a sunday amateur team and an under 19’s which has produced 5 first team players in a couple of years, a strong womans side and even provision for refugees to play football etc too. Its not a simple case of getting a hand out the work that went into putting all of that into place was a massive undertaking and one which is paying off with both the progression into first teams etc and the 100+ academy members who now come along to our first team matches and go mental every week. 

On 01/11/2021 at 19:43, Nowhereman said:


It certainly is. The fact that a chairman and three directors who were supporters have all quit is clearly concerning. Pushed out?

Im quite worried watching from the outside, seems like a significant development, are these people contractually obliged to not give their reasons for resigning? Are Sons fans starting to organise away from P&B because it does just look to be a whole lot of discussion and ‘lets hope for the best’ type chat about hypothetical new grounds when you should really be hammering your board/trust everyone you can for answers and commitments? Maybe a time for you guys to get organised before it gets too late?

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10 minutes ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

Its also not just about our first team football, we now have an academy structure led by Uefa accredited coaches from age 5-first team, even with a sunday amateur team and an under 19’s which has produced 5 first team players in a couple of years, a strong womans side and even provision for refugees to play football etc too. Its not a simple case of getting a hand out the work that went into putting all of that into place was a massive undertaking and one which is paying off with both the progression into first teams etc and the 100+ academy members who now come along to our first team matches and go mental every week. 

How the f**k do you pay for all that as a part time WoS club?

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2 hours ago, The Moonster said:

How the f**k do you pay for all that as a part time WoS club?

Its all grass roots. Our board/volunteers have spent the past 20 years working in the community. One of the first people attracted to the club when we reformed in the juniors is a young guy who got really behind it and developed an interest in coaching etc, he did all his coaching badges up to A licence and has basically designed a full academy structure with the help of the other coaches, the ethos and interlinking of it all is excellent. Obviously the clubs self fundraise but they also get help and support from the club/trust in loads of ways and every single kid from all the 100’s who play for the team are encouraged to be part of the organisation as a whole. They get the benefit of the integrated academy structure with our 19’s and 17’s regularly invited to train with the first team, first team players and coaches help out the younger kids too and the result of that is an incredibly secure thriving structure.  
 

As someone who didnt ever really think about these things before its actually quite staggering how impressive it all is. Our under 19’s regularly play on friday nights, have their own social media strategy, match sponsors/sponsored man of the match and get crowds that some wosl clubs would be happy with. Our womans team has pretty much every single player sponsored and the girls are every bit a Bankies first team player as their male equivalents. Lots of folks just devoting hundreds of hours of their own time to make it work. Commercially as a club we’re improving every single year and I know that we arent even in the top half of wosl clubs, most is just dedicated volunteers. Dumbarton could quite easily achieve this too, we have the buses leaving the town for the two arse cheeks just the same as you, its just about getting more organised and maybe becoming a wee bit more militant than you’ve been before? Protesting, organising in the community, every year we sell Bankies merch in the run up to xmas in the shopping centre, fans volunteering to do it and it helps engage people, Dumbarton could do that, plenty space in the high street. Basically what im getting at is you guys need to stop seeing yourself as only fans and now seeing yourself as custodians of your clubs history to preserve it for your kids. Every club at our level to your own needs to do that, owners come and go, you guys are forever (lets face it you have to be to be a Bankies or Sons fan, we dont do it for the european glamour ties) you just have to start seeing it that way. Because that wee bit of engagement that you guys as a trust or fans do could attract the fan who in 10/15 years time builds your youth academy or something similar?

I hope that doesnt come across the wrong way, grew up in Dumbarton and went to school with a lot of guys who I think are now Dumbarton fans and have a real soft spot for the club. But in 21 years of living there before I moved away never had a single bit of pr to get along to any game, ive been offered more Albion Rovers tickets living/working in Dumbarton than Dumbarton tickets? 

Edited by Inanimate Carbon Rod
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1 hour ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

Its all grass roots. Our board/volunteers have spent the past 20 years working in the community. One of the first people attracted to the club when we reformed in the juniors is a young guy who got really behind it and developed an interest in coaching etc, he did all his coaching badges up to A licence and has basically designed a full academy structure with the help of the other coaches, the ethos and interlinking of it all is excellent. Obviously the clubs self fundraise but they also get help and support from the club/trust in loads of ways and every single kid from all the 100’s who play for the team are encouraged to be part of the organisation as a whole. They get the benefit of the integrated academy structure with our 19’s and 17’s regularly invited to train with the first team, first team players and coaches help out the younger kids too and the result of that is an incredibly secure thriving structure.  
 

As someone who didnt ever really think about these things before its actually quite staggering how impressive it all is. Our under 19’s regularly play on friday nights, have their own social media strategy, match sponsors/sponsored man of the match and get crowds that some wosl clubs would be happy with. Our womans team has pretty much every single player sponsored and the girls are every bit a Bankies first team player as their male equivalents. Lots of folks just devoting hundreds of hours of their own time to make it work. Commercially as a club we’re improving every single year and I know that we arent even in the top half of wosl clubs, most is just dedicated volunteers. Dumbarton could quite easily achieve this too, we have the buses leaving the town for the two arse cheeks just the same as you, its just about getting more organised and maybe becoming a wee bit more militant than you’ve been before? Protesting, organising in the community, every year we sell Bankies merch in the run up to xmas in the shopping centre, fans volunteering to do it and it helps engage people, Dumbarton could do that, plenty space in the high street. Basically what im getting at is you guys need to stop seeing yourself as only fans and now seeing yourself as custodians of your clubs history to preserve it for your kids. Every club at our level to your own needs to do that, owners come and go, you guys are forever (lets face it you have to be to be a Bankies or Sons fan, we dont do it for the european glamour ties) you just have to start seeing it that way. Because that wee bit of engagement that you guys as a trust or fans do could attract the fan who in 10/15 years time builds your youth academy or something similar?

I hope that doesnt come across the wrong way, grew up in Dumbarton and went to school with a lot of guys who I think are now Dumbarton fans and have a real soft spot for the club. But in 21 years of living there before I moved away never had a single bit of pr to get along to any game, ive been offered more Albion Rovers tickets living/working in Dumbarton than Dumbarton tickets? 

Your posts have been very interesting and in parts quite inspiring but at present there is no direct comparison between our two football clubs.

As a co-founder of the Sonstrust, myself and a colleague became tangentially involved in the efforts to preserve the Bankies as a senior club.  That ultimately failed and whilst that was a grimly painful experience, it allowed the people who really cared about having a football club in the town to forge their own future, something which has been achieved with great distinction.

Turning to Dumbarton FC, relocation to the site at The Rock in 2000 has now proven to be much more of a curse than a blessing, and whilst we regularly appear on websites and in books about iconic football grounds, the sad truth is that the club has also become a magnet for chancers who wish to use it as a relocation vehicle to make money from  speculative land sales.  This process started around ten years ago with a Faustian pact between the then club Board and a consortium of businessmen with no previous experience of delivering such a development.  That adventure eventually imploded on the refusal of Planning Consent; meanwhile a football club has somehow managed to struggle on.

As things now stand our majority shareholder is the last man standing from the Brabco consortium who has enlisted a Norwegian business associate to the cause.  I am a current member of the Trust Board and myself and a colleague have now spoken with the latter (a Director of DFC), and we are poles apart on the future affairs of Dumbarton FC.  The majority shareholder keeps a lower profile but he produced the lyrics for the hymn sheet.

All these years of fantastic visions, promises, meetings, presentations, assurances and ultimately repeated failure to prise us away from our iconic location has had a debilitating effect on the club's standing in the local community and a measure of the current situation is the recent resignation of the club Chairman, Company Secretary and two Associate Directors who have been important sponsors.  There is still hope of better days, but like the Bankies, the best route to that will be when DFC is in the control of the local community. 

 

Edited by O'Kelly Isley III
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Great couple of posts from OKI and our Bankie friend there. 

I dream of a stadium in the direct centre of town fully engaged with a youth academy, over 40s, disability football, walking football and a multi facetted sports club (from chess and athletics to bowls). Then we would have real community engagement and it would be near impossible to die with that many people invested in it. 

That takes money and or the local council involvement. I can but dream. 

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1 hour ago, the snudge said:

 

I dream of a stadium in the direct centre of town fully engaged with a youth academy, over 40s, disability football, walking football and a multi facetted sports club (from chess and athletics to bowls). Then we would have real community engagement and it would be near impossible to die with that many people invested in it. 

Would you be able to pay by card at the turnstile? If so count me in.

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21 hours ago, O'Kelly Isley III said:

Your posts have been very interesting and in parts quite inspiring but at present there is no direct comparison between our two football clubs.

As a co-founder of the Sonstrust, myself and a colleague became tangentially involved in the efforts to preserve the Bankies as a senior club.  That ultimately failed and whilst that was a grimly painful experience, it allowed the people who really cared about having a football club in the town to forge their own future, something which has been achieved with great distinction.

Turning to Dumbarton FC, relocation to the site at The Rock in 2000 has now proven to be much more of a curse than a blessing, and whilst we regularly appear on websites and in books about iconic football grounds, the sad truth is that the club has also become a magnet for chancers who wish to use it as a relocation vehicle to make money from  speculative land sales.  This process started around ten years ago with a Faustian pact between the then club Board and a consortium of businessmen with no previous experience of delivering such a development.  That adventure eventually imploded on the refusal of Planning Consent; meanwhile a football club has somehow managed to struggle on.

As things now stand our majority shareholder is the last man standing from the Brabco consortium who has enlisted a Norwegian business associate to the cause.  I am a current member of the Trust Board and myself and a colleague have now spoken with the latter (a Director of DFC), and we are poles apart on the future affairs of Dumbarton FC.  The majority shareholder keeps a lower profile but he produced the lyrics for the hymn sheet.

All these years of fantastic visions, promises, meetings, presentations, assurances and ultimately repeated failure to prise us away from our iconic location has had a debilitating effect on the club's standing in the local community and a measure of the current situation is the recent resignation of the club Chairman, Company Secretary and two Associate Directors who have been important sponsors.  There is still hope of better days, but like the Bankies, the best route to that will be when DFC is in the control of the local community. 

 

Thank you, O'Kelly. Could you expand on how the Trust sees the future affairs of  the club and how we could make that a reality?

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20 minutes ago, cremola foam said:

Thank you, O'Kelly. Could you expand on how the Trust sees the future affairs of  the club and how we could make that a reality?

Well, the contributions from ICR above pretty much outlines what can be achieved when the supporters and the wider local community are invested, literally and metaphorically, in their football club.  However, as I've written above that situation only ever came about following the effective extinction of the original Clydebank FC, and I'm not fully convinced that should the same situation arise at Dumbarton that there would be sufficient commitment or enthusiasm to match the Bankies effort.

I would hope never to have to find out, but to answer your question directly control of the club would need to wrested away from the current ownership.  That's an ownership which in my opinion has no intrinsic interest or background in football, never mind Dumbarton FC; an ownership which has no track record in delivering the type of development on which they are now embarked, and which incidentally has already failed; an ownership intent on using DFC as a vehicle for financial acquisition thro land speculation.

As I said, only my opinion, and not one I think is shared by what remains of the DFC Board.  Worrying.

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20 hours ago, O'Kelly Isley III said:

Well, the contributions from ICR above pretty much outlines what can be achieved when the supporters and the wider local community are invested, literally and metaphorically, in their football club.  However, as I've written above that situation only ever came about following the effective extinction of the original Clydebank FC, and I'm not fully convinced that should the same situation arise at Dumbarton that there would be sufficient commitment or enthusiasm to match the Bankies effort.

I would hope never to have to find out, but to answer your question directly control of the club would need to wrested away from the current ownership.  That's an ownership which in my opinion has no intrinsic interest or background in football, never mind Dumbarton FC; an ownership which has no track record in delivering the type of development on which they are now embarked, and which incidentally has already failed; an ownership intent on using DFC as a vehicle for financial acquisition thro land speculation.

As I said, only my opinion, and not one I think is shared by what remains of the DFC Board.  Worrying.

We only have three board members left. I don't know the Chairman but surely Colin and Stephanie must share your opinion. Given that the owners aim since they took over from Neil Rankine has been to make money from the club I fail to see how anyone could not share your opinion.

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I thought Henning, his wife and that Neil Dermybobs character from Four Architects were on the board too? I'm sure that's how it was announced when they took over, that Henning and his wife were the football masterminds and Dermybobs was the genius architect ready to turn water into wine, but their names aren't listed as club officials on the website. 

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12 minutes ago, The Moonster said:

I thought Henning, his wife and that Neil Dermybobs character from Four Architects were on the board too? I'm sure that's how it was announced when they took over, that Henning and his wife were the football masterminds and Dermybobs was the genius architect ready to turn water into wine, but their names aren't listed as club officials on the website. 

Dumbarton have 6 directors according to Companies House:

Neil Dermott, Colin Hosie, Henning Kristoffersen, Neil Mackay, Stephanie Park and John Steele.

I'm not clear on what exactly an "associate director" is that the two guys resigned from last month? It certainly wasn't a legal directorship position.

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1 hour ago, Skyline Drifter said:

Dumbarton have 6 directors according to Companies House:

Neil Dermott, Colin Hosie, Henning Kristoffersen, Neil Mackay, Stephanie Park and John Steele.

I'm not clear on what exactly an "associate director" is that the two guys resigned from last month? It certainly wasn't a legal directorship position.

Cumpany's Hoose huzny been updated yit. 

Oot o' the frame is Steeley and Lynchy as cumpany secratury.

Wi' Lynchy jumpin' ship, the update is still pendin'.

 

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49 minutes ago, Skyline Drifter said:

Dumbarton have 6 directors according to Companies House:

Neil Dermott, Colin Hosie, Henning Kristoffersen, Neil Mackay, Stephanie Park and John Steele.

I'm not clear on what exactly an "associate director" is that the two guys resigned from last month? It certainly wasn't a legal directorship position.

John Steele has resigned along with Stephen Lynch who were official directors. Andy Gordon and Graham Casey were associate directors who resigned shortly after the former two. It was a "made up" position, they were involved in just about everything the club did but didn't have any official position so John Steele made them associate directors to give them some recognition for the work they'd done. I thought Henning's wife was on the board too but obviously not. 

I would hope Colin, Stephanie and Neil MacKay are standing up to any pish from Henning and Dermybobs, but O'Kelly's posts worries me that might not be the case. 

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11 minutes ago, The Moonster said:

John Steele has resigned along with Stephen Lynch who were official directors. Andy Gordon and Graham Casey were associate directors who resigned shortly after the former two. It was a "made up" position, they were involved in just about everything the club did but didn't have any official position so John Steele made them associate directors to give them some recognition for the work they'd done. I thought Henning's wife was on the board too but obviously not. 

I would hope Colin, Stephanie and Neil MacKay are standing up to any pish from Henning and Dermybobs, but O'Kelly's posts worries me that might not be the case. 

Stephen Lynch isn't a Director. He's the Company Secretary. And still is according to Companies House, though I appreciate per @start the war above it may simply not have been updated yet. Documents are supposed to be lodged within 14 days so they are cutting it fine although it's not unusual for such docs to be lodged significantly late with little consequence to be honest.

A Daniel Stephen Lynch of Dundee was a director from November 2004 to March 09 and was clearly something to do with National Cash Registers at the time. Same guy? Even if it was he hasn't been a director for over a decade.

Appreciate the local knowledge is likely clearer regarding Steele but the club statement on 27th October didn't actually say he was resigning as a Director, merely that he'd stepped down as Chairman in favour of Neil Mackay. It could be perceived that the offer of "Honorary President" was an indication that he was stepping off the Board entirely though. Has he definitely done so?

Edited by Skyline Drifter
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