Sons' sorrow

[super-son]

If we are not allowed in the ground for a home game we aren’t going to get in to the bar. And we won’t be able to stream away games as that will be down to the home club

Restaurants and bars are allowed open with social distancing rules in place.

Just open the community suite and it should be treated as a bar not a football ground.

[O'Kelly Isley III]

If it comes down to streaming, as looks increasingly likely, then pricing and reliability become key. The urge to charge what a live game costs at the gate should be resisted in favour of what people are likely to pay for viewing at home - I would suggest £10 - £12 and no more than that. I take it ST holders would get a key code or similar ?

[Boghead ranter]

Where football is struggling here, I think, is the aftertaste/effect that the Aberdeen 8 and Bolingoli have left behind them. Because they were the first breaches of football protocol, they were made high profile, and football is now suffering because of the ill feeling left behind with the Scottish Govt and their advisers.

Scot Gov would probably be looking a lot more sympathetically at football if those incidents hadn't occurred.

Especially galling that Bolingoli has now been moved on, Celtic and Aberdeen can now continue to play, yet the teams from the lower 3 divisions are now being put under greater pressure than even before because of it. 

[Boghead ranter]

[pleslie99]

Apparently some WOS/LL teams have had bars open with social distancing in place so not entirely sure why we couldn't do so?

This isn't really the place for political point scoring so having digs at government etc isn't helping anyone. The virus is here, decisions are made whether we agree with them or not. There seems to be this whole comparison to pubs being open and fans in football grounds, anyone listening properly to sturgeon last week would have taken away from it that she wasn't happy that hospitality was remaining open but she couldn't close it as the UK government needed to provide the funds to help them, if they done that then I'm sure she would close pubs pronto.

Fwiw I think we should be allowed in to lower league grounds, there is plenty scope for social distancing to happen at most grounds and we need the support to stay afloat the same as everyone in the hospitality industry, arts and every other struggling industry. 

I know of people that have been moved on from a public park standing 40ft away from an amateur game with noone near them, that to me is bordering on ridiculous!

[The Moonster]

Good luck to Lewis. Didn't work out with us but he gave his all and I hope he does well.

[peternapper]

Dont think streaming is going to save the season, we streamed a friendly the other week using the new equipment which with a few wee glitches went ok. We are getting it free as part of our season ticket but to be honest would not be thinking of paying other clubs to watch. Its  like a poor version of the present live games so would not think there would be a big enough take up to make it worthwhile. It seems the decision whether to play a league season has been delayed to the last minute with clubs handing out contracts to players that may not be needed, if as looks likely supporters are not going to be allowed in to grounds then hibernation may have been better if done early enough. Would think by the noises coming from even some Premier clubs a number of them will not see the season out relying on streaming cash.   

[BallochSonsFan]

26 minutes ago, peternapper said:

Dont think streaming is going to save the season, we streamed a friendly the other week using the new equipment which with a few wee glitches went ok. We are getting it free as part of our season ticket but to be honest would not be thinking of paying other clubs to watch. Its  like a poor version of the present live games so would not think there would be a big enough take up to make it worthwhile. It seems the decision whether to play a league season has been delayed to the last minute with clubs handing out contracts to players that may not be needed, if as looks likely supporters are not going to be allowed in to grounds then hibernation may have been better if done early enough. Would think by the noises coming from even some Premier clubs a number of them will not see the season out relying on streaming cash.   

Fans will make a decision when all of the information is out there. Some folk will want to watch football and the fact that its via a paid stream won't put them off. I don't often go to away games with the hockey these days unless it's Dundee away so the streams from Belfast, Sheffield, Manchester, Cardiff and Coventry have been a good way to watch a game that I wouldn't otherwise have gone to. Are fans going to do that in enough numbers to keep football afloat? I'm really not sure. I'd have liked to have seen far more joined up thinking and collective action from Scottish football before committing to a 20/21 season. I think that the football authorities should have done some proper research into whether or not fans would pay for streams. If there's no market for it then the season isn't going to be viable and clubs will be in trouble with player contracts. If there's an appetite for it then it would be good to get a consistent approach to cost per game and the number of users that the streaming platform can support. If it's going ahead then we should have seen every club stress testing their set-up to make sure that it has been properly configured for fans to buy streams and to watch in acceptable quality. I think the biggest concern that I have is that Scottish football seems to have gone into this with so little preparation. The consideration for streaming games seems like a panicked plan B when it first looked like supporters may not get back into grounds. That didnt stop teams assembling squads but right now there has to be a significant doubt over whether or not we'll have a completed league will all teams finishing the season? If fans don't buy into the idea of paid streaming and clubs can't find ways to make up for lost ancillary revenues from matchday activities then the game is in serious trouble. We're barely a few weeks away from the start of competitive football and we still have practically no information about whats going to happen. Thats a criticism of football as a whole rather than any individual club. Right now I have to say that whilst I have a massive amount of sympathy with Dumbarton, I have some serious concerns that we're still some way from really understanding how we're going to try to make streaming work, whether or not there's a market for it amongst Dumbarton fans and how we'll make up for the loss of all other matchday income.

We really need clarity and we need it soon.

[Silverton End]

1 hour ago, peternapper said:

Dont think streaming is going to save the season, we streamed a friendly the other week using the new equipment which with a few wee glitches went ok. We are getting it free as part of our season ticket but to be honest would not be thinking of paying other clubs to watch. Its  like a poor version of the present live games so would not think there would be a big enough take up to make it worthwhile. It seems the decision whether to play a league season has been delayed to the last minute with clubs handing out contracts to players that may not be needed, if as looks likely supporters are not going to be allowed in to grounds then hibernation may have been better if done early enough. Would think by the noises coming from even some Premier clubs a number of them will not see the season out relying on streaming cash.   

So your quite happy to watch Peterhead's home stream which is included in your season ticket, which is a good deal btw, but wouldn't pay....say (us) Dumbarton £9.99 to watch Peterhead away at our place?

I'd pay £9.99 to watch Sons at up at Peterhead via stream.

Tight Teuchter Minter 

Edited September 26, 2020 by Silverton End

[lorenzo71]

12 minutes ago, Silverton End said:

So your quite happy to watch Peterhead's home stream which is included in your season ticket, which is a good deal btw, but wouldn't pay....say (us) Dumbarton £9.99 to watch Peterhead away at our place?

I'd pay £9.99 to watch Sons at up at Peterhead via stream.

Tight Teuchter Minter 

Whether the stream is good or not fans are kinda going to have to pay as it will be the main income source for clubs when lockdown comes again.If they pay 40 quid to watch 4 games a month say ,then that equates to paying to get into 2 home games.If they go with children then its even more of a bargain.It is what it is and in some cases might be the difference between surviving and not.

[Silverton End]

2 minutes ago, lorenzo71 said:

Whether the stream is good or not fans are kinda going to have to pay as it will be the main income source for clubs when lockdown comes again.If they pay 40 quid to watch 4 games a month say ,then that equates to paying to get into 2 home games.If they go with children then its even more of a bargain.It is what it is and in some cases might be the difference between surviving and not.

Tell that to Teuchternapper 

[lorenzo71]

3 minutes ago, Silverton End said:

Tell that to Teuchternapper 

LOL I was but doing it subtly and non-belligerently by posting it to a 3rd party 

[RGD89]

Was watching highlights from last weekends efl games and seen they had a selection of teams who where aloud 1000 socially distanced fans into grounds.

Surely ST holders should be aloud into scottish lower league stadia. You would imagine a large majority of the stadiums would in the lower leagues could comfortably accommodate ST holder numbers.

In theory sons fans could enter and exit the stadium without using the internal part of the stadium as we could enter/exit using the gates at either end of the ground ?

The only stumbling block to that would be access to toilets etc.

Also seen non league teams down south which i imagine run on a similar budget / model to scottish lower leagues teams and stadia have crowds of up to 600 so why cant we have something similar.

[BallochSonsFan]

8 hours ago, RGD89 said:

Was watching highlights from last weekends efl games and seen they had a selection of teams who where aloud 1000 socially distanced fans into grounds.

Surely ST holders should be aloud into scottish lower league stadia. You would imagine a large majority of the stadiums would in the lower leagues could comfortably accommodate ST holder numbers.

In theory sons fans could enter and exit the stadium without using the internal part of the stadium as we could enter/exit using the gates at either end of the ground ?

The only stumbling block to that would be access to toilets etc.

Also seen non league teams down south which i imagine run on a similar budget / model to scottish lower leagues teams and stadia have crowds of up to 600 so why cant we have something similar.

Ask Jason Leitch and the first minister. We could all meet up in the Stags Head but couldn't go down to the ground to watch the game.

[peternapper]

11 hours ago, Silverton End said:

So your quite happy to watch Peterhead's home stream which is included in your season ticket, which is a good deal btw, but wouldn't pay....say (us) Dumbarton £9.99 to watch Peterhead away at our place?

I'd pay £9.99 to watch Sons at up at Peterhead via stream.

Tight Teuchter Minter 

Folk have missed my point, i would not want to  get used to watching  games by that method as at the end of the day dont think it will be financially viable , i have Sky & Bt coverage of top games but find have lost quite a bit of interest in watching coverage.  Cost is not my worry i just feel that we are liable to try streaming & quickly find clubs running out of cash long before completing the season. Watching the Andrew Marr show just now he has some Tory minister on who was asked about support for football, basically said the big clubs should help the small ones but unlikely any thing would come from government. Unlike many supporters i prefer to attend games home & away & until that becomes possible again worry for teams surviving.

[The Moonster]

15 minutes ago, peternapper said:

Watching the Andrew Marr show just now he has some Tory minister on who was asked about support for football, basically said the big clubs should help the small ones

At the start of the outbreak every Bundesliga side in Germany created a fund to be put aside to ensure no small club went out of business. In Scotland we had clubs take each other to court because they didn't get what they wanted. We're basically fucked if our only way out is all clubs coming together.

[BallochSonsFan]

17 minutes ago, peternapper said:

Folk have missed my point, i would not want to  get used to watching  games by that method as at the end of the day dont think it will be financially viable , i have Sky & Bt coverage of top games but find have lost quite a bit of interest in watching coverage.  Cost is not my worry i just feel that we are liable to try streaming & quickly find clubs running out of cash long before completing the season. Watching the Andrew Marr show just now he has some Tory minister on who was asked about support for football, basically said the big clubs should help the small ones but unlikely any thing would come from government. Unlike many supporters i prefer to attend games home & away & until that becomes possible again worry for teams surviving.

Clubs have signed players so if we can't have fans in grounds then streaming has to work because there is no other option. 

[Sergeant Wilson]

4 minutes ago, BallochSonsFan said:

Clubs have signed players so if we can't have fans in grounds then streaming has to work because there is no other option. 

What do you say is "work". In my view it can only mitigate losses. It will not be profitable in terms of replacing all the lost income from gates, commercial, lies etc. Every club will have a different breaking point.

[BallochSonsFan]

19 minutes ago, Sergeant Wilson said:

What do you say is "work". In my view it can only mitigate losses. It will not be profitable in terms of replacing all the lost income from gates, commercial, lies etc. Every club will have a different breaking point.

Work means bringing in enough money to pay wages. Scottish football can't sustain losses. If we lost more than a small 5 figure sum then we'd be looking at oblivion. We need streaming to bring in as close to normal matchday income as possible or Scottish football is screwed. We could have mothballed the season before clubs started building squads. Not an option now. 

Either we get as many fans as possible paying to stream games and we find a way of mitigating for the loss of ancillary revenue from matchday or we watch the club die. It has to work or the club is screwed and we finally make Ian Wilson's dreams come true. 

[Sergeant Wilson]

1 minute ago, BallochSonsFan said:

Work means bringing in enough money to pay wages. Scottish football can't sustain losses. If we lost more than a small 5 figure sum then we'd be looking at oblivion. We need streaming to bring in as close to normal matchday income as possible or Scottish football is screwed. We could have mothballed the season before clubs started building squads. Not an option now. 

Either we get as many fans as possible paying to stream games and we find a way of mitigating for the loss of ancillary revenue from matchday or we watch the club die. It has to work or the club is screwed and we finally make Ian Wilson's dreams come true. 

The only way that works is to go almost completely amateur. Streaming won't bring in that kind of money.