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https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-derbyshire-52514444
#StevieAitkenTacticalGenius might be more free to take Full Time management soon.  St Johnstone beckons?
I wouldn't wish that on him. When I saw the news about Wright, it reminded me of when he had a go at Jim Duffy at the start of the season. I suppose being a part time manager would be better than being an out work one.
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Quite enjoyed the whole player of the year awards thingy, fair play to all involved. 
 
God bless wee Joe McKee, an injustice he left empty handed IMHO. 

Fair play to Jack, it as absolutely excellent. There’s a career in events hosting for him if he fancies it imo!

Agreed on Joe. Nobody can argue with Hutton winning a fair chunk but McKee deserved some recognition. He’s such a classy player.

Delighted for wee Rico getting young player. Hope he takes a lot of confidence from it and keeps kicking on whenever next season starts.
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Just watched the awards, a good wee video as has been mentioned. I do hope when all this is over we're in a position to keep a lot of these guys together, they seem to have a really good team spirit between them, something I think we've missed for a few seasons now. 

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Would like to echo the sentiments above about the virtual awards.Great video and really enjoyable to watch.Congrats to Jack and all  those who made it happen as well as thanks to the players, Jim Duffy and all the contributors.Congrats also to the winners.

Couple of points to make.Firstly i thought Jim came across as really positive about the future and it  seemed genuine.While we are far from out of the woods as right now the size of the wood is unknown but it would seem there is no immediate impending doom.Its important that we keep promoting and contributing to the crowd funding  page as right now its our lifeline.But so far so good.

Now reconstruction and government policy decisions  will have a big say on  our future but these are things that are out of our hands.What i think we should seriously be looking at is a live match feed (  east fife have it, why can't we?) and a potential sale of virtual season tickets.I think it would be attractive and would catch the attention of sons fans who cannot attend every home game.It would also allow away fans to watch their team as well.It  must at least be discussed as  mass gatherings are unlikely this year but football will probably  return before then.I for one would snap it up as its a great way to contribute and keep cash coming into the club.Would also catch sons fans living abroad or away fans living abroad who want to watch their team.

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10 hours ago, lorenzo71 said:

Would like to echo the sentiments above about the virtual awards.Great video and really enjoyable to watch.Congrats to Jack and all  those who made it happen as well as thanks to the players, Jim Duffy and all the contributors.Congrats also to the winners.

Couple of points to make.Firstly i thought Jim came across as really positive about the future and it  seemed genuine.While we are far from out of the woods as right now the size of the wood is unknown but it would seem there is no immediate impending doom.Its important that we keep promoting and contributing to the crowd funding  page as right now its our lifeline.But so far so good.

Now reconstruction and government policy decisions  will have a big say on  our future but these are things that are out of our hands.What i think we should seriously be looking at is a live match feed (  east fife have it, why can't we?) and a potential sale of virtual season tickets.I think it would be attractive and would catch the attention of sons fans who cannot attend every home game.It would also allow away fans to watch their team as well.It  must at least be discussed as  mass gatherings are unlikely this year but football will probably  return before then.I for one would snap it up as its a great way to contribute and keep cash coming into the club.Would also catch sons fans living abroad or away fans living abroad who want to watch their team.

The main issue with that at the moment is skills and equipment. Livestreaming a game to the quality that East Fife and the likes do it won't come cheap, and will require a decent amount of manpower. I know a few people who could help - but we'd also need to spend a hefty chunk of money on equipment, and I'm not sure that's money we have.

Agreed that I'd love to see it happen given the likely lengthy ban on gatherings though.

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1 hour ago, Jan Vojáček said:

The main issue with that at the moment is skills and equipment. Livestreaming a game to the quality that East Fife and the likes do it won't come cheap, and will require a decent amount of manpower. I know a few people who could help - but we'd also need to spend a hefty chunk of money on equipment, and I'm not sure that's money we have.

Agreed that I'd love to see it happen given the likely lengthy ban on gatherings though.

No doubt it will be a challenge financially and logistically but it's something that we may HAVE TO do if public gatherings are banned but football resumes.Another scenario being touted is stadiums operating at 30 percent capacity( although unlikely until towards the end of the year if that ).In our case a maximum of 600 fans.Would that be sustainable?viable? I don't know really and i suppose a lot will depend on the outcome of the reconstruction talks and what sort of teams could be visiting us next season.

A lot of questions and not many  answers i suppose but i think looking into the live stream option is essential .Football will restart and it will almost certainly be behind closed doors.That means we will have the expense of wages but virtually no income.I  can't see any other route other than virtual season tickets.

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13 minutes ago, lorenzo71 said:

No doubt it will be a challenge financially and logistically but it's something that we may HAVE TO do if public gatherings are banned but football resumes.Another scenario being touted is stadiums operating at 30 percent capacity( although unlikely until towards the end of the year if that ).In our case a maximum of 600 fans.Would that be sustainable?viable? I don't know really and i suppose a lot will depend on the outcome of the reconstruction talks and what sort of teams could be visiting us next season.

A lot of questions and not many  answers i suppose but i think looking into the live stream option is essential .Football will restart and it will almost certainly be behind closed doors.That means we will have the expense of wages but virtually no income.I  can't see any other route other than virtual season tickets.

I'd say that we could probably survive on crowds of 600, aye. It obviously wouldn't be ideal - but it's also not far off our average and might convince people to buy a season ticket to guarantee them entry.

The big question about livestreaming is where would we get a few grand for equipment for. Unless fans were all happy to chip in towards it - but we've already got them to put their hands in their pockets a fair amount this season.

Manpower wise I'd be more than happy to get involved and know other people who have worked on other club media channels who I could rope in, so I don't think that would be a problem - but the initial costs would be pretty sizeable, and I can't see many businesses being in a position to sponsor it at the moment.

Anyone from Raith/East Fife (Falkirk I think do it too?) on here and able to give us rough set up costs for a live stream?

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6 minutes ago, Jan Vojáček said:

I'd say that we could probably survive on crowds of 600, aye. It obviously wouldn't be ideal - but it's also not far off our average and might convince people to buy a season ticket to guarantee them entry.

The big question about livestreaming is where would we get a few grand for equipment for. Unless fans were all happy to chip in towards it - but we've already got them to put their hands in their pockets a fair amount this season.

Manpower wise I'd be more than happy to get involved and know other people who have worked on other club media channels who I could rope in, so I don't think that would be a problem - but the initial costs would be pretty sizeable, and I can't see many businesses being in a position to sponsor it at the moment.

Anyone from Raith/East Fife (Falkirk I think do it too?) on here and able to give us rough set up costs for a live stream?

If we were talking 10 grand say  then im sure that could be raised or found.Its not the sort of amount to bankrupt you.And then again what is the alternative?I can't see one to be honest.It would be something that could then still be used as an extra income stream when this whole terrible affair is over.I imagine the main cost is the start-up one.I think volunteers to do commentary, graphics etc could be found amongst the SONS faithful who have been excellent up to now.

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The problem I have with streaming games as a solution, is how viable is it in terms of income?  I'm really not sure how many people would opt to use it, in relation to those who go through the gate on a Saturday.  You also have the potential of people "sharing" a game.  If a family or group usually watch the games together, how many of them will watch a streamed game together - and only end up paying for one?

Apart from the lack of additional match day revenue (hospitality etc) the price could also be a factor.  Raith TV charged £5 a game last season, if we were to replicate our gate price for example, we would be more than tripling the price. 

I just cant see how it can work for clubs in the lower leagues.  Certainly without the landscape of footballers wages completely changing.  I cant see how clubs will raise anywhere near enough money to pay players any kind of similar wages.  Granted it would effect everyone, so could level the playing field.  Possibly a short term solution with a few to the season starting properly after a few games, but I cant see this being workable in any kind of long term.

It also wouldnt just be Dumbarton, or Raith Rovers or East Fife.  I'm sure some clubs will at least have or can get the facilities in place.  But this has to be a solution that all the clubs in Scotland can afford to implement, run and generate enough income to make their clubs viable. I can't see it , sadly.

The alternative may well have to be that Lower League Football is put in some kind of state of deep freeze until it's safe to continue it close to a normal manner.  I can see more clubs surviving that, than having to retain and pay players on a fraction of an already limited income.

Edited by CALDERON
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4 minutes ago, CALDERON said:

 

The alternative may well have to be that Lower League Football is put in some kind of state of deep freeze until it's safe to continue it close to a normal manner.  I can see more clubs surviving that, than having to retain and pay players on a fraction of an already limited income.

This seems to me the most likely way forward.

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There is no way that the lower leagues will play behind closed doors. The only way most clubs will survive is the govt furloughing players wages until their contracts run out Dumbarton are fortunate in only having one player who will still be in contract. Other clubs with players on two year deals have more of a problem as they have ongoing costs. Even the premier teams will struggle playing behind closed doors. And anyone who listened to radio Scotland on Saturday when the sfa medical officer went through the difficulties of playing behind closed doors will realise that there is a lot more to it than you might first think.

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2 hours ago, Jan Vojáček said:

I'd say that we could probably survive on crowds of 600, aye. It obviously wouldn't be ideal - but it's also not far off our average and might convince people to buy a season ticket to guarantee them entry.

The big question about livestreaming is where would we get a few grand for equipment for. Unless fans were all happy to chip in towards it - but we've already got them to put their hands in their pockets a fair amount this season.

Manpower wise I'd be more than happy to get involved and know other people who have worked on other club media channels who I could rope in, so I don't think that would be a problem - but the initial costs would be pretty sizeable, and I can't see many businesses being in a position to sponsor it at the moment.

Anyone from Raith/East Fife (Falkirk I think do it too?) on here and able to give us rough set up costs for a live stream?

We wouldn't have to buy the equipment though. If we go down this route, can it be hired as needed? What about the media colleges - they are always looking for real life situations for the broadcast students to gain experience - there are 19 institutions offering media studies in Scotland. I would have thought 90-100 minutes every second week at the Rock might fit their needs.

Edited by Sons FC
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2 minutes ago, Sons FC said:

We wouldn't have to buy the equipment though. If we go down this route, can it be hired as needed? What about the media colleges - they are always looking for real life situations for the broadcast students to gain experience - I would have thought 90-100 minutes every second week at the Rock might fit their needs.

True, but you'd need to find one with the right equipment to do a live outside broadcast - and with the manpower.

At UWS we had the tie up with St Mirren, which seemed to work relatively well, but their club media officer (full-time role) co-ordinates a lot of it, along with two full-time professional Uni technicians, three full-time lecturers (a former journalist and two ex TV producers) and an army of people from journalism and broadcast production. No idea if there's a possibility of us tying up with Clydebank College or if they have the equipment and staff to help - but if they did then that could be a solution.

I know everyone involved with setting it up, so if anyone from DFC wanted a bit of advice on that from those who basically founded St MirrenTV then they can give me a shout. It also wouldn't be an issue for me to find people for the broadcast side of it, so even if they just wanted to produce it then I know a decent number of people with experience in commentary and presenting who would be happy to get involved at the moment.

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53 minutes ago, Sons FC said:

We wouldn't have to buy the equipment though. If we go down this route, can it be hired as needed? What about the media colleges - they are always looking for real life situations for the broadcast students to gain experience - there are 19 institutions offering media studies in Scotland. I would have thought 90-100 minutes every second week at the Rock might fit their needs.

Hiring gear is extremely expensive and we’d be lucky to be able to afford it for one game nevermind a full seasons worth of games. 
 

The only real viable option is tying in with a University or a college who have all the equipment, expertise and time to make it happen. It’s something I’ve suggested before in terms of highlights and I can only see it being a win win for everyone involved. Invaluable experience for students and a very handy service for ourselves. 

 

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2 hours ago, George Parr said:

This seems to me the most likely way forward.

For deep freeze i read death.You may be right but clubs have expenses other than wages and cannot simply survive 'on hold' i am guessing.

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Live streaming is expensive. There are equipment costs. There are software costs. There are costs involved in setting up a platform to accept payments and offer restricted stream access. Some UK ice hockey teams stream games at £10-£15 per match. I'm not sure on subscriber numbers but the likes of Coventry and Manchester aren't doing it at a loss. Neither are Belfast, Sheffield or Cardiff. Hull used to do it too. Theres definitely a conversation to be had as to whether or not closed door/web streaming games is an option. It may well be for some clubs but others would certainly need significant support. It's an area that the governing body and league board should be looking at and one where I'd expect there to be help available to support clubs if this is the only route that we can go down. Its certainly not something that the club can go into blind. There are consequences for getting it wrong and we really can't afford costly mistakes.

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I have no idea how much the equipment etc would cost but let’s just look at one cost, wages. To put a game on we would need something in the region of 25 people at an absolute minimum. It would likely be more but let’s say twenty five. If they were being paid an average of £250 per week that is £6250 a week so about £25000 a month. We have two home games a month so we need £12500 a game from subscriptions. At the absolute max we might get 200. So they would need to pay £62.50 per game just to cover wages. And that is before we consider all the costs of broadcasting and of maintaining and opening the stadium. Streaming games live is not an option for Scottish football at our level or to be honest at any level

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21 minutes ago, Nowhereman said:

I have no idea how much the equipment etc would cost but let’s just look at one cost, wages. To put a game on we would need something in the region of 25 people at an absolute minimum. It would likely be more but let’s say twenty five. If they were being paid an average of £250 per week that is £6250 a week so about £25000 a month. We have two home games a month so we need £12500 a game from subscriptions. At the absolute max we might get 200. So they would need to pay £62.50 per game just to cover wages. And that is before we consider all the costs of broadcasting and of maintaining and opening the stadium. Streaming games live is not an option for Scottish football at our level or to be honest at any level

I would be surprised if you would need anywhere like 25 people and not all will need a salary.

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