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Scottish Football Reconstruction


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It was mentioned on Radio Scotland . One of the panel said if a team won the 3rd teir they would not get promoted if they did not have 6000 capacity. Gordon Smith replied they would maybe have to look at it again. 6000 capacity is what was said but did not say 6000 seated

I got the impression he was talking about 6000 seats.

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This latest "idea" from Hampden has to take the biscuit for the most ill-conceived plan in Scottish football history, and that is going some.

Needless to say, the fans continue to be ignored.

A smarter man than me once said that insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. Welcome to the new 12 team league........

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What are the incentives for all of the clubs in Divisions 2 and 3(except Rangers), Cowdenbeath, Airdrie and Dumbarton? They will almost certainly all be in a division of 18 where only 1, and possibly 2, teams will get promoted, or in a division of 8 where 1, and possibly 2, teams get relegated. So they will have the choice of being in the hardest league in Europe to get out of, or one of the hardest to stay in. What are their incentives to vote for this new system? The current 3rd division teams will get another season with Rangers, but after that, then what? They will be cut adrift, just as the 1st division was when the SPL was setup.

If this 18 team division was in a normal league setup, then the top 2 would be promoted, the next 3 or 4 teams would go into a playoff, the bottom 2 would go down and the 3rd bottom would possibly end up in a playoff. This could mean 9 or 10 teams teams would be competing for the top 5 or 6 places, and 5 or 6 could be fighting out the bottom 2 or 3 positions. Thats a possibilty of 14 to 16 teams with something to play for throughout the entire season.

But this 18 team "National" division of ours aint like that, is it. No, next season you will have 17 teams starting out a season in the hope that they will get a single playoff spot. You could quite possibly have a situation, where by the turn of the year, 10 or 12 teams will have nothing to play for.

Now, who said we cant have too many meaningless games in a league, if you dont want it to become stale and boring?

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It's probably the TV deal thats dictating this proposed league structure! Why on Earth do they want to do this split near the end of the season again? The fans abhor it!! I am hoping the teams in the league dont vote for this new set up, but no doubt they'll be blackmailed into doing so.

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The problem with "fan discussion" is that they aren't giving us enough information upon which to base a truly educated opinion and statements like Longmuirs yesterday about fans not being able to grasp it only exacerbate the situation and automatically turn fans off and diminish support.

Maybe if they gave us more details about the financial pros and cons of each option, how money would be split, how the leagues would be marketed etc. then fans wouldn't feel so left out in the cold about the decisions being made. As well as generating further understanding, it might also increase "buy-in" and support......in other words, real and meaningful fan engagement.

For me, we're at the stage where we have to try something different because the status quo is stale and unappealing....and if larger top league can't be agreed upon, then I'll (reluctantly) suck it and see with the 12-12 to 8-8-8 idea. I don't have enough info to make an educated decision on how good, bad or indifferent it will be and neither do most others on here....we can only guess at it....but it can't be much worse than the situation we have now!!!

Why should they? We are just supposed to turn up and be "entertained".

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When clubs talk about not being able to compete with lower league English clubs, it is usually in terms of keeping their best players.

You'd need to have been walking about with your eyes and ears shut for the last 5 or 6 years not to have noticed the number of SPL (and SFL) youth products who have been sold to English clubs which can afford to treble their wages.

Thats certainly what I was talking about.

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For me the problem isnt the way the leagues are set up. Its finances plain and simple. The only thing that is going to save the Scottish game is a major cash injection for every/most club in the 4 tiers of our game. This way the teams can keep the players they bring through, make more marquee signings etc and I think this will get more bums in seats.

This will inevitably make the game more competitive also as there will be a better spread of quality players throughout the leagues and each game will be a real battle. Looking at the EPL there is only 3-4 realistic title challengers, a few more looking to get a european place, a few fighting relegation and the rest just landing somewhere about the middle but every club gets decent attendance figures as their club makes decent signings every year as they all get/have a decent amount of money to play with.

Edit: I should say I'm not putting this out there as an actual option to save our game I just think its the only thing that will give our game a boost. This league reconstruction could just be another way of distributing the exact same stuff year in year out.

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the splitting into three leagues of 8 is going to render a lot of clubs with meaningless games, starting from scratch or not

the top section will have an OF team winning the league, even starting the points system from scratch wont make a difference as celtic (and probably rangers in the future) will be the only clubs with the resources to improve their squads in time for the second part of the season, look at this transfer window, every scottiash story is either celtic going for someone or other clubs losing players or managers

hell there is even talk that joint second place and this seasons champions league qualifier participants motherwell will lose their starting 11 GK

the middle 8 again will have 4 teams with SPL finances behind them, and then 4 teams with SFL finances behind them, on a one off game we may get a surprise but over 14 games we wont get too many surprises

as for the bottom 8, look at the tables just now, falkirk would be the highest placed team in the bottom 8 as of now, they are a clear 13 points ahead of dumbarton and 10 ahead of airdrie, and thats not including 2 teams from the SFL 2, just how good will falkirks second part of the season be if they knew they only had teams worse than them to play

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Over the last few years I have grown more and more disenchanted with Scottish football. In the main due to the complete mismanagement at every level of my own club, however the wider game doesn't fill me with enthusiasm either.

A number of years back I would sit at the start of the season, work out the fixtures against my shifts and arrange for time off to go to the games. Up until the demise of Airdrieonians this was the case, but the events leading up to the death of the club, the formation of Airdrie United, the refusal of entry to the league by the other clubs to "set an example" (which they threw out the window when the rangers scenario arrived), and the birth of a new open club which soon reverted to type on the chairmans receipt of an establishment blazer, have all combined to make me question why I bother at all.

Over the last number of years I have pretty much given up attending matches, as in my opinion what I'm getting in return for my money isn't good value. It's far too expensive per match and with the amount of fixtures on the go, against the same teams over and over, is an unjustifiable expense. I'll pick and choose when I go.

I no longer plan on attending any games during winter. The whole "game on/game off" rigmarole is tiresome, add that to the fact I no longer want to sit in a freezing cold stadium, or drag my kid along to what becomes more an endurance excercise than a day out.

I detest play offs. As an Airdrie supporter that's understandable. But the idea that a team that is consistently bad over a season gets a second bite at the cherry while a team you has performed well is then asked to overcome higher league opposition over two legs to gain promotion is a nonsense. As with cup ties, the "wee team" may have a chance over one leg, over two is usually (but not always) too much.

As for league splits, I'm not a fan, and the proposed one could possibly see no promotion or relegation at all.

From the above I'd say I'm looking for:

Less games

More value for money

Summer football

No play offs/splits.

Of all the points above though, the one which would have the least effect on whether or not I go to a game is the league format. I would imagine that for all the comment made about this subject that would be true for most others.

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It's probably the TV deal thats dictating this proposed league structure! Why on Earth do they want to do this split near the end of the season again? The fans abhor it!! I am hoping the teams in the league dont vote for this new set up, but no doubt they'll be blackmailed into doing so.

Come back in 2016 when your new club has been in existence for the 4 years it will take before it is eligible to vote or even listened to on such matters. whistling.gif

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It was mentioned on Radio Scotland . One of the panel said if a team won the 3rd teir they would not get promoted if they did not have 6000 capacity. Gordon Smith replied they would maybe have to look at it again. 6000 capacity is what was said but did not say 6000 seated

There aren't enough clubs with 6000 seats in the scottish league to fill 2x12 team leagues. I presume only the top flight will have this pre-condition. Details are a bit sketchy and this makes me suspicious.

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Just throwing this out there.... Sorry if it has been posted before or I have misunderstood something.

When the 2 leagues of 12 split into 3 leagues of 8 for a 14 game finale, there is a huge problem.

The top league and bottom league are fairly easy, presuming everyone keeps their points total from the previous 22 games (FWIW I hate this idea in the top/bottom 8 as well, but at least it works mathematically). However...

In the middle 8, you will have 4 teams which earned all their points playing the top 8 (Sellik, Hearts etc) and 4 teams which earned theirs against the bottom 8 (Alloa, Ayr etc). These points clearly cant be compared if the intention is for them to compete in a league as they have been earned against entirely different opposition / standard - the points would need to be cleared and a 14 game mini league would follow.

If, 10 games into the leagues of 12 teams it becomes fairly obvious who at least 2 of the bottom 4 (or top 4 in the other 12) will be, what is the incentive for these teams to actually win games? After all, the points would HAVE to be scrubbed when the split comes in order to make the leagues of 8 fair.

Surely the teams are better rewarded by ensuring their first team stay reasonably sharp and injury free ahead of the 14 game play off league?

What interest / value for money is there for fans of these clubs?

If by chance, your team were 12th and your last 3 games were against 11th, 10th and 9th (who are in the same boat), why would any supporter in their right mind want to pay to watch that knowing that the result is completely meaningless?

What of the team finishing in 8th are so far adrift of 6th or 7th after 22 games, but are safe of relegation? They can simply stop all effort on the park as there is nothing to complete for?

An end of season split in the same league is bad enough, but mashing 2 leagues into one halfway through the season... oh dear! I stopped watching SPL football a few years ago and cant really ever see me going back in any situation.... but this plan is total dross!

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Also expense.

Tickets often pricier than here; longer distances; 46-game seasons.

Arsenal charging £64 for a game - no wonder the game is fecked won south as well. Did anyone see the attendances at the much lauded FA Cup games - shocking at times.

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The whole thing is a shambles. The fans are being completely ignored as always.

We don't like the SPL split? Let's add in more splits!

We don't want teams playing each other four times? Tough, they still are.

The SFA and SPL are going to kill our game if they press on with this, clearly Longmuir has been bullied into signing up for their plan because he gets a lot of smaller wins (merging league bodies, fairer wealth distribution etc). They can say all they want that the TV companies insist on four Old Firms a season. There won't be a TV deal if there are no fans to watch the games and the fans will continue to be driven away if everything they ask for is ignored.

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This proposed system has already been tried in Austria and Switzerland and was soon discarded. Would be interesting to find out why?

The lack of 4 games against Austria's big two seems to be the primary reason.

http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/aberdeen/201526-spl-reconstruction-plans-identical-to-really-boring-austrian-experiment/

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The lack of 4 games against Austria's big two seems to be the primary reason.

http://sport.stv.tv/...ian-experiment/

Although as an explanation that doesn't seem entirely convincing.

Afterall, both countries moved to 10-team Premiers playing 36-games... 'clubs 3-8' saw no change, 'clubs 9-10' played them x4 not x2, and 'clubs 11-12' didn't play them at all instead of x2.

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Having suffered the summer of Sevco, and listened to utter bullshit from the Cockwomble, Regan, Longmuir, Jardine, McCoist, Green, Traynor, and the majority of club chairmen.... here's my considered view on their 12-12-18 proposal....

I couldn't give a fcuk. I've got my Wembley tickets for the Jaguars v 49ers, and Steelers v Vikings. Hotels and flights are booked.

Scottish football can go fcuk itself.

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