Big Rangers Administration/Liquidation Thread - All chat here!

[dooglew]

Happy 4th of July, a day when millions celebrate the expulsion of Union Jack waving royalist oppressors and venture into an uncertain future but a future that is their own.

In other news, there will be a vote about newco Rangers later today..

[Harp Hotel]

Would rather have an emptier stadium than that gruesome lot infesting my town.

Really true. And just think of the amount of money you save on Dettol?

[Ric]

So that will be a yes.

No, it's a why should I spend time doing something you should have done in the first place?

It's not my fault you are too lazy to include a link to the source, no matter how questionable or biased that source may be. You have a lot to learn about posting on forums.

[flyingscot]

Don't know how much has been explained on here but I found the St Mirren meeting was interesting tonight even if I didn't like what I heard. I fully understand the position our club is in, and that we need to look after our club, make sure we get by and get what we need from a new set-up.

I accept the bashing other supporters are going to give us for our chairman stating what option was best for our revenues despite it being made clear it is not an ideal option.

What should be made clear for all those saying, how would we survive relegation, no OF games and why are we reliant on another club. Relegation isn't an issue for the club as we'd know it was coming, costs would be cut and £275K savings can be made. Players are on 2 year deals mostly and nearly all have relegation clauses. We can cope with the drop no problem. Visits from the OF are not an issue to our budget. Gate money is vastly outweighed by commercial revenue and we have max 2400 away fans- not the 6000+ others have. On being so reliant on another other club thing we're reliant on league commercial deals, which when drying up leaves a hole in the budget. We budget for 11th and it is unrealistic to suggest any directors would budget 12 months in advance for commercial deals vaporising overnight. Same as ITV digital in English League, Setanta for Blue Square. We'd be woefully uncompetitive if we relied on gate money solely.

I think from the meeting tonight I thought you could see the toll this is taking on our directors, they and others are sick of the whole thing. If the SPL report from commercial sponsors is to be believed we and others are in big trouble. I think the clubs most at risk are us, Killie, Motherwell, Inverness and poss Ross County / Dundee United.

I'm annoyed that the Rangers and the commercial situation has, through no fault of our club, started to harm us. Reading between lines it seems the SPL are overdue on a payment to us which we'll get. 300 season books haven't been renewed yet we should have had bumper sales after a good year last year.

I'm scunnered with the whole thing now. Never nice to hear we're struggling and that we could end up in admin. Whatever happens, D1, D3, admin, I'll still be there for my club and forever hate what Rangers have done to football in this country.

[Vambo57]

Too lazy to Google??

http://www.telegraph...il-July-12.html

I was at that Shareholders meeting and I can categorically state that the quote attributed in the newspaper report, is just lazy journalistic pish. There was no reporter from the Telegraph there. Of course Administration was discussed, in the worst case scenario it would not affect SMFC for at least a season

[cowden0]

Ludicrous idea but is there any examples of models where all football clubs are nationalised?

Franco effectively nationalised Real Madrid.

[Harp Hotel]

Don't know how much has been explained on here but I found the St Mirren meeting was interesting tonight even if I didn't like what I heard. I fully understand the position our club is in, and that we need to look after our club, make sure we get by and get what we need from a new set-up.

I accept the bashing other supporters are going to give us for our chairman stating what option was best for our revenues despite it being made clear it is not an ideal option.

What should be made clear for all those saying, how would we survive relegation, no OF games and why are we reliant on another club. Relegation isn't an issue for the club as we'd know it was coming, costs would be cut and £275K savings can be made. Players are on 2 year deals mostly and nearly all have relegation clauses. We can cope with the drop no problem. Visits from the OF are not an issue to our budget. Gate money is vastly outweighed by commercial revenue and we have max 2400 away fans- not the 6000+ others have. On being so reliant on another other club thing we're reliant on league commercial deals, which when drying up leaves a hole in the budget. We budget for 11th and it is unrealistic to suggest any directors would budget 12 months in advance for commercial deals vaporising overnight. Same as ITV digital in English League, Setanta for Blue Square. We'd be woefully uncompetitive if we relied on gate money solely.

I think from the meeting tonight I thought you could see the toll this is taking on our directors, they and others are sick of the whole thing. If the SPL report from commercial sponsors is to be believed we and others are in big trouble. I think the clubs most at risk are us, Killie, Motherwell, Inverness and poss Ross County / Dundee United.

I'm annoyed that the Rangers and the commercial situation has, through no fault of our club, started to harm us. Reading between lines it seems the SPL are overdue on a payment to us which we'll get. 300 season books haven't been renewed yet we should have had bumper sales after a good year last year.

I'm scunnered with the whole thing now. Never nice to hear we're struggling and that we could end up in admin. Whatever happens, D1, D3, admin, I'll still be there for my club and forever hate what Rangers have done to football in this country.

Solid post. It's the continuing sense of entitlement that just really riles. And no amount of craven, lick-spittle little political "apologies" from Murray will count for anything. You know those words are an empty vessel and they couldn't give two flying ones.

[Ric]

I'm scunnered with the whole thing now. Never nice to hear we're struggling and that we could end up in admin. Whatever happens, D1, D3, admin, I'll still be there for my club and forever hate what Rangers have done to football in this country.

I'm absolutely sickened by the whole affair, from the infighting the backstabbing, the lies and the conjecture. While I have hardly been the most regular attendee to games, and to be fair for the vast majority of my life I've lived hundreds of miles away from Paisley and for the last 18 months or so I've not even been in the same country, but this summer has finished any desire I have for watching any SPL games let alone St Mirren ones. I have no idea if Rangers Sevco fans feel happy about that sort of reaction from a diddy fan like myself but I just don't care any more, they can have their gloat all they want, in the end their previous and possible future successes are massively tainted. However they haven't killed the game in Scotland, instead it's the collective actions of others around them that allowed them (and Celtic) to get away with the sickening duopoly in the first place.

As Burke said, "All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing", that certainly seems apt in these times. Even if it is a massive bit of hyperbole it's by no means any worse than the sort of hyperbole coming from our mainstream media.

Edited July 4, 2012 by Ric

[cowden0]

Don't know how much has been explained on here but I found the St Mirren meeting was interesting tonight even if I didn't like what I heard. I fully understand the position our club is in, and that we need to look after our club, make sure we get by and get what we need from a new set-up.

I accept the bashing other supporters are going to give us for our chairman stating what option was best for our revenues despite it being made clear it is not an ideal option.

What should be made clear for all those saying, how would we survive relegation, no OF games and why are we reliant on another club. Relegation isn't an issue for the club as we'd know it was coming, costs would be cut and £275K savings can be made. Players are on 2 year deals mostly and nearly all have relegation clauses. We can cope with the drop no problem. Visits from the OF are not an issue to our budget. Gate money is vastly outweighed by commercial revenue and we have max 2400 away fans- not the 6000+ others have. On being so reliant on another other club thing we're reliant on league commercial deals, which when drying up leaves a hole in the budget. We budget for 11th and it is unrealistic to suggest any directors would budget 12 months in advance for commercial deals vaporising overnight. Same as ITV digital in English League, Setanta for Blue Square. We'd be woefully uncompetitive if we relied on gate money solely.

I think from the meeting tonight I thought you could see the toll this is taking on our directors, they and others are sick of the whole thing. If the SPL report from commercial sponsors is to be believed we and others are in big trouble. I think the clubs most at risk are us, Killie, Motherwell, Inverness and poss Ross County / Dundee United.

I'm annoyed that the Rangers and the commercial situation has, through no fault of our club, started to harm us. Reading between lines it seems the SPL are overdue on a payment to us which we'll get. 300 season books haven't been renewed yet we should have had bumper sales after a good year last year.

I'm scunnered with the whole thing now. Never nice to hear we're struggling and that we could end up in admin. Whatever happens, D1, D3, admin, I'll still be there for my club and forever hate what Rangers have done to football in this country.

Aye your right, your club will suffer, so let them in as it's only integrity we're selling here. Look out for number 1eh!

[Harp Hotel]

Aye your right, your club will suffer, so let them in as it's only integrity we're selling here. Look out for number 1eh!

Get your flute-loving little chairman to come out and renounce the fact he continued to hold bucket loads of shares in the old RFC before you start throwing self-righteous stones around?

[flyingscot]

Aye your right, your club will suffer, so let them in as it's only integrity we're selling here. Look out for number 1eh!

Were did I say we should let them in? What I am saying is that whatever the decision here a number of good people and clubs are going to get caught up with collateral damage through no fault of their own. Not a good situation.

[cowden0]

Get your flute-loving little chairman to come out and renounce the fact he continued to hold bucket loads of shares in the old RFC before you start throwing self-righteous stones around?

My team are dead to me already as I'm pretty sure how we will vote. And as for being self righteous, if never watching my team, that I have supported for 47 years, ever again then I am guilty as charged. E-mailed club but you know and I know that won't matter to him. So don't dare think he speaks for the majority of Cowdenbeath supporters.

[cowden0]

Were did I say we should let them in? What I am saying is that whatever the decision here a number of good people and clubs are going to get caught up with collateral damage through no fault of their own. Not a good situation.

Not a good situation for anyone. They have destroyed football in Scotland. I was really surprised at you 75% in favour of Div 1 tonight though.

[Ric]

They have destroyed football in Scotland.

By "they" I hope you mean the whole of Scottish football who have allowed the duopoly to continue unchallenged not just over the last 4 months but for the last century.

[GirondistNYC]

1341363886[/url]' post='6398583']

"The main sticking point is the situation with regard the SPL central sponsors. There are 14 or so of these who contribute between them around £17m of money into the Scottish game.

The SPL has met with all of these organisations and discussed the possibility of Rangers moving to SFL 3.

Almost every partner has a clause in their contract that allows them to terminate or re-negotiate based on a scenario of either or both of the old firm clubs leaving the Scottish game. These clauses were put there in good faith as both clubs had previously indicated a wish to play in England or in a European league.

Late last weeks the SPL clubs were issued with a report outlining worst and best case scenarios for loss of commercial revenue should Rangers end up in SFL 3.

The SPL was not permitting clubs to discuss individual sponsors and their exact positions but some had said they would remain whatever happened and some said they would terminate, some said they would re-negotiate.

The estimated loss to St.Mirren based on the figures in this report would be between £600k and £1.1 in lost revenue based on last year's earnings (St.Mirren finished 9th in the SPL)."

This bit to me explains a great deal. If the SPL just got around to sending out firm details on sponsor reactions last week to clubs, I can see where new facts on the ground might be concentrating minds and causing some backsliding and second thoughts. If the response from sponsors was much worse than anticipated the flip from loud no votes to pushing division 1 makes a lot more sense, and it's hard to blame (at least from a purely financial perspective) clubs in a precarious position from having second thoughts.

Two questions: 1) how much would this be minimized if the prize money was split more progressively (something most Celtic fans seem accepting of) and 2) why the HELL did the SPL not extract answers from sponsors on this question earlier?

[Harp Hotel]

Dear Whatever You're Now Called

Look at these figures and weep, ya glory-hunting twats. This is why you will never ever reach the level of your beloved brethren in the East End who support their club through thick and thin and quite rightly claim the title of "Best Fans Ever In The Whole World....Ever" and which we all unreservedly concur with.

Thingummy attendance figures.....Avg/Low

1985/1986

25,119

12,731

1984/1985

21,723

8,424

1983/1984

22,476

7,500

1982/1983

18,123

8,500

1981/1982

19,089

6,000

1980/1981

20,457

7,000

1979/1980

23,131

7,655

1978/1979

24,887

6,000

Edited July 4, 2012 by Harp Hotel

[Ric]

This bit to me explains a great deal. If the SPL just got around to sending out firm details on sponsor reactions last week to clubs, I can see where new facts on the ground might be concentrating minds and causing some backsliding and second thoughts. If the response from sponsors was much worse than anticipated the flip from loud no votes to pushing division 1 makes a lot more sense, and it's hard to blame (at least from a purely financial perspective) clubs in a precarious position from having second thoughts.

Two questions: 1) how much would this be minimized if the prize money was split more progressively (something most Celtic fans seem accepting of) and 2) why the HELL did the SPL not extract answers from sponsors on this question earlier?

Perhaps we should boycott those sponsors who are willing to reduce their involvement in the league because Sevco were not in it. After all, the Sevco loyal were willing to take that route and you do wonder how much that has affected the desire for the league sponsors to be involved and this clause seems to be a perfect way for them to exit (either partially or fully).

[Harp Hotel]

My team are dead to me already as I'm pretty sure how we will vote. And as for being self righteous, if never watching my team, that I have supported for 47 years, ever again then I am guilty as charged. E-mailed club but you know and I know that won't matter to him. So don't dare think he speaks for the majority of Cowdenbeath supporters.

You sup with the devil...

[GirondistNYC]

1341368755[/url]' post='6398620']

Perhaps we should boycott those sponsors who are willing to reduce their involvement in the league because Sevco were not in it. After all, the Sevco loyal were willing to take that route and you do wonder how much that has affected the desire for the league sponsors to be involved and this clause seems to be a perfect way for them to exit (either partially or fully).

Wouldn't be surprised if the loudly proclaimed (if not much honored) boycotts by the bears didn't help. However, if everyone else boycotted departing sponsors the medium term result would be the business community deciding that Scottih football was so factionalized that they were likely to generate bad publicity to offset any good and to conclude they're better off sponsoring Rugby or a team in England (this is why OF shirt sponsorships tend to cover both). A show of loyalty to sponsors that stayed would be better at improving things.

question remains - how much was the report "spun" by the SPL and how likely is the "worst case" in reality? There may be new sponsors who might quite like an SPL with one half of the OF missing to mitigate some of the losses, for example.

[The_Craig]

Totally lost track of this thread over the past couple of weeks and as a result, there's loads I've missed.

Tomorrow is the beginning of the end in that the league season is almost upon us and those in charge of the game can't put the decision off any longer. And because of that, we are going to end up with some half-cocked league reconstruction and the teams in the top league having a real wake up call financially (And I include my own club in that.)

But when the dust settles, the way the game is governed in Scotland has to be ripped up and started again with the empty suits and auld pals acts kicked to f**k.