Big Rangers Administration/Liquidation Thread - All chat here!

[Chazza1910]

Can we just be clear about something. Every SPL chairman will vote to permit direct entry to a newco. Each and every one of them.

They won't.

Have you seen what Hibs and Celtic have been saying?

Stuff Kilmarnock (I mean their chairman).

In fact, you wanna bet? All winnings go to Rangers Fighting Fund.

[WaffenThinMint]

Kenny Shiels in today's Sun talks a different game.

The Rugby Park gaffer pleaded for children in the town to come and follow a club where bigotry and prejudice don't exist.

This club is free from prejudice, racism and bigotry.

"We're a West of Scotland club with no baggage. If you're a good parent and want to bring your children up in a way where they understand good values and also morals, they can come and have a fun time and enjoy it here.

"It doesn't stink of external influences and if those parents want to send them to Kilmarnock, it would be a very good choice, I'd have thought. I want us to be better, bring better people into the club and go on in a better manner.

What a breath of fresh air that man is, unafraid to tell it like it is, even if leaves the old firm fans spitting out their cornflakes.

I hope Michael Johnston is watching tonight. I wonder if he will change tack when he finds out more details about the EBTs? That wasn't Craig Whyte. Right enough though, it was done by a previous regime so why punish the newco for, what, ten years of cheating? Let's all just pretend that 2001-2012 never happened and give the nice men from Govan every possible help to get a fine institution back on it's feet. If you want to kill your club Johnston, then do just that because as well as alienating your own fans, no b*****d will come to visit you.

There's another way of looking at it, Shiels and Johnston both firing the first shots off for those Ayrshire based Orcs who are shortly about to be left without a team to watch.

Johnston on the one side sucking up to them (knowing full well they're dead and so can be as toadying as he likes) in the hope of getting some of the action from all those piling on the platform at Kilmarnock station on Saturdays to Glasgow or whatever other part of the country the Orcs are despoiling that weekend. To him it's all about bums on seats.

Shiels on the other hand, as someone from Northern Ireland especially, knowing exactly the sort of fans they are likely to atttract from the muppet element that see Killie as somehow fellow travellers (Willie Waddell, Ian Durrant, Ratface McLean, Fat Sally, etc) is making his pitch as one with far more public standing that Kilmarnock's chairman (and thus more influence) in making it clear that Kilmarnock is no home for bile-spewing neanderthal bigots who need the reflected glory from a football club to give meaning to their sorry little lives. He more than Johnston has grasped that those they do pick up are likely to try and turn Kilmarnock into a facsimile of what they left behind by weight of numbers.

The parts about "good values and also morals" and "It doesn't stink of external influences" as you say will get a lot of those choking that deserve to choke. Shiels is saying what every SPL club chairman and manager ought to be saying, but won't - if you come to start supporting us, it won't be to pick up where you left off.

[Green&White Zebra]

Again, I have to ask, who is the driving force behind Newco ? If they are not folk with Rangers' best interests at heart, then they're in it for the money. That means they are using the only bargaining tool, i.e. ownership of the stadium, as a means for making a profit from those that finally inherit the Newco.

But those who seem to have had the best interests of Rangers are the ones who have been clutching at straws in some misguided belief that the club will avoid liquidation. And the point that supersedes absolutely all other factors at present is that the timescale for getting Newco up and running in next season's SPL has passed.

As soon as the club went into administration, it was pretty evident that liquidation was inevitable. It is at that point that the likes of the Blue Knights should have been anticipating that event and making the right manouvres to set up the Newco. They would have got stick for it, but it was their only realistic option, and they would have raised funds. Under pressure the administrators would have scuttled the ship by now. Whyte would have been bought out effectively and a viable proposal would have been on the table for the SPL already.

As things stand, there will be no Rangers next season. The club will liquidate soon and the ownership of the ground will be settled in courts between the various scrambling creditors. The Newco will take time to be set up and they will not have a stadium to play in.

Clearly, no Rangers is a nightmare scenario for Michael Johnston (for his own legitimate reasons). It seems that the prospect of a world without Rangers is inconceivable for some, and therefore, all plans have been made with them included. It is self-delusion.

But then again, what would happen at Kilmarnock ? I suspect that there would be a fan takeover, and that other clubs will follow suit. Maybe fan power is one of things that people like Johnston really dread. His comments smack of contempt for his own supporters.

[black sapper]

Snip...........

Despite all this "plastic paddy" branded at our fans, i can honestly say i've yet to meet a scotsman who considers himself Irish first. I'm not saying they don't exist. but i've never crossed paths with these individuals

Enrico, I enjoy your contributions to this thread (not to mention your excellent avatars).

But really...........I take it you don't make many visits to Maryhill then as it's full of them. Very trendy amongst certain sections of the community.

Every club (including my own) have their share of morons within the support, but the thing that differentiates the OF is that they manage to attract morons from all across Scotland (and Ireland) - Rangers even more so than Celtic.

It's the concentration of half-wits that surround these clubs that increases the scale of the problem.

I've got plenty of friends - good, decent people - who support one or other of the ugly sisters, but there's no denying that the OF have the most obnoxious and largest groups of undesirables following them.

Life would be so much sweeter without either of the OF..

[Chuckinho]

So the Kille manager has buckled to the big blue meanies and St Johnstone are making a stand.

The e-mail boxes must be filling, but what Aberdeen have said worries me - namely that the club will do what is in the best interests of itself and Scottish Football. I'm worried that the finanical imperative is going to override what is actually good for the game and that with that caveat the chairmen will have a clear conscience and empty stadia.

I was almost physcually sick when I read that Rangers were planning to head to Belgique and sign a hearts player. Surely these things cannot be a priority even for these deluded bigots. Bruges is nice place - although those Catholic churches are probably an impediment.

[shiltrum]

Sent to the club this morning:

Dear Mr Johnston,

I have been a Killie fan for all my life. I first attended RP in season 1970-71, and have attended as many games as I can in the ensuing four decades. This has varied from not missing a game for three and a bit seasons in the early '80s to managing half a dozen or so matches a season now (work, family, cost and distance considerations). I've seen us losing to East Stirling and Brechin, I've seen us win national trophies, I've seen us score 8 at Meadowbank and lose 8 at home to Rangers. I've seen us play in Europe, the Anglo-Scottish Cup and the Ayrshire cup. I've watched Killie play in every available level of Scottish senior football, as a full-time club and as a part-time club. At NO time did I believe the club wanted anything other than success for Kilmarnock Football Club.

I have, in common with the vast majority of Scottish football fans, been following the developing crisis at Rangers with interest. I will confess, also in common with others, a hint of schadenfreude at the situation. The prevailing opinion amongst those I talk to, and all over the Scottish football websites which I read, is that Rangers deserve to be punished, and punished fairly, for any and all wrongdoing over the last few years.

Recently, you were quoted on the BBC as having said that financial considerations MAY take precedence over sporting integrity when decisions on Rangers' future are voted upon. I have not seen any retraction or denial of this statement from you, so I think I can assume that you did say this. Now, I see another quote from yourself:

"I am a solicitor by profession and in terms of the distinction between a CVA and a newco, it can become quite complicated but at the end of the day, from a creditors' point of view, there is maybe no difference," he said.

"In terms of how it affects a sporting competition, I do share the view and I think the football authorities have traditionally taken the view, that a football club is not to be identified 100% with the people that own it, or the corporate entity that owns it.

"A football club has its own identity which consists of various components the history of the club, the stadium, the players but most importantly, the supporters. So you have got to be careful if you are trying to protect a football club which is a very long-standing and historical institution.

"You have got to be very careful not to come in too heavily with penalties and points deductions or financial penalties going forward which actually put people off investing in that club and trying to make it healthy. After all, it's not the new owners who have done the damage, it is the previous owners."

I'm sorry, Mr. Johnston, but this goes way beyond considering the financial implications of Rangers losing their SPL place. I expect you, and anyone connected with Kilmarnock, to strive for the best outcome for Kilmarnock especially, and Scottish football in general. I do not believe these interests would be well served by kowtowing to this "long-standing and historical institution". Are we really supposed to be happy to accept the crumbs falling from the "big" teams' table? Should we be happy to provide the opposition in warm-up games for the Old Firm's annual assault on Europe? As I said above, I have followed Killie through good and bad but always in the faith that the team would do their best, and that the club had nothing but the most honest ambitions for Kilmarnock Football Club who, I shouldn't have to remind you, are a more long-standing institution than either of the Old Firm. We have always taken pride in being Scotland's oldest professional club. However unrealistic, we should be striving to be the best team in our league, and we will NEVER achieve that if we continue to allow the Old Firm to grab the lion's share of the money available in the SPL.

There is no doubt that the loss of Rangers would change the landscape in Scottish football. Rather than bemoan the short-term loss of an arguable amount of cash, why are you, and your colleagues in the SPL, not seizing an opportunity for change? You refer to Rangers as an "institution" a description which could also apply to slavery, and I don't think we miss that, do we? What is in front of us at the moment, Mr. Johnston, is a one-off deal. Rangers have got themselves into a mess which would cause any "normal" company to cease to exist. Should they be allowed to continue because of some "special" status? A status of being a beacon for some of the least attractive aspects of Scottish society, of protectionist business policies, of arrogance towards their peers, of a willingness to leave their country of origin for financial gain? I can still remember the Old Firm apologists telling us a few years ago how Scottish football would "prosper" if they left for pastures new, and yet now we're told by the same "experts" that the game will die if Rangers go to the wall. I don't claim to have the answers, but I would love to find out.

I am pleased to see that you have re-signed Mr. Shiels as team manager. Might I suggest you think about the following quote from him he appears to be more in tune with the support than yourself.

"We're a West of Scotland club with no baggage. If you're a good parent and want to bring your children up in a way where they understand good values and also morals, they can come and have a fun time and enjoy it here.

"It doesn't stink of external influences and if those parents want to send them to Kilmarnock, it would be a very good choice, I'd have thought. I want us to be better, bring better people into the club and go on in a better manner."

"Go on in a better manner", Mr. Johnston. If you choose to do so, I will remain a loyal supporter of Kilmarnock Football Club. If you prefer my club to "know their place" and accept what scraps are thrown to them, then I want no part of it. Neither do many other supporters. It is unfortunate that you have made the statement quoted above. Did you pause to think that this statement reflects on the entire club, INCLUDING those of us who only wish to see Killie to compete on as level a playing field as possible? Did you pause to consider that you were representing OUR club when you said this, or the effect on peoples' perceptions of our club and, by extension, the fans?

I and many other Killie fans are angry and upset at your statements, Sir. I ask you to do the right thing in any upcoming vote and remember that you are representing a proud, venerable and above all HONEST club while doing so. You are Chairman of KILMARNOCK Football Club, and should owe no allegiance or favouritism to any other club.

Yours Sincerely,

(last season, approximately£130 kits, £300 tickets, £60 pies/drinks, £150 assorted merchandise - not a lot in the grand scheme, but it might well not be there next season)

What can i say in reply not much I think you have summed up how every decent fan feels reguarding the mess up here in Glasgow which reverberates throughout the whole of Scottish Football. All fair minded fans want this delt with quickly and see it for what it is a potential whitewash springs to mind. I as a Celtic supporter would want the rules applied if it happened at Parkhead and there are some who are holding off buying season tickets until this mess is sorted, you cant blame them.Your letter is one of the best I've read so far I hope you get what you want and you Chairman takes you views into account the fans are the lifeblood of any club and should not be ignored I doff my cap to you sir hear hear.

Edited May 23, 2012 by shiltrum

[Steve McQueen]

One chairman says Rangers shouldn't be punished, one say they should.

One is on the back page, one is tucked away inside another story.

Can you guess which one's which?

[Homer Thompson]

Unless i'm massively mistaken here i understand some SPL chairmen feel Rangers have been punished enough by the SFA and won't be too harsh on newco Rangers?

Well this rule isn't getting made up for Rangers is it?

It's meant to be made up for any SPL club who wants to cheat.

Here's the shock news for the SPL, not every team that uses the newco route will have been punished by the SFA for tax avoidance so you'd better draw up some sanctions or the SPL will shortly be a newco league.

That is a remarkably good point.

Those aren't the comments of a Rangers fan. Embarrassingly, that's what the chairman of my club had to say about it.

And a solicitor, too, no less

[Desert Nomad]

This thread has gained 300 pages since I last posted two & a half weeks ago. In that time all I can see that's happened is that this character Green is involved & the SFA have stuck to their guns over the disciplinary measures handed out. Anybody any clue what's on this BBC programme tonight?

Edited May 23, 2012 by Desert Nomad

[Claymores]

Good Herald piece starting to ask ever more pressing questions of H&D as well as Green and his funding:

What is the true colour of Green's money?

What will happen next at Rangers?

Charles Green, like Bill Miller before him and Craig Whyte 12 months ago, is currently filling the role of saviour at Ibrox, but the coming days could restore a sense of crisis. A Panorama documentary on BBC Scotland tonight, made by the respected journalist Mark Daly and the same team who exposed Whyte's controversial business background, will investigate the club's use of Employee Benefit Trusts under Sir David Murray. The content is expected to be highly critical, however Herald Sport understands that greater consequences could arise from the programme's other material.

It focuses on Whyte's takeover and, crucially, the administrators, including the role of David Grier, who is a business partner of the Duff & Phelps accountants, Paul Clark and David Whitehouse, and who previously advised Whyte. Herald Sport also understands that the programme, called The Men Who Sold The Jerseys, might significantly call into question the work of Duff & Phelps, although legal action may be threatened in response to some of the material that is planned to be broadcast.

A number of the previous bidders for the club have been critical of the administrators and in theory it is possible for creditors to challenge their appointment. That would require a petition to court, and new administrators being put in place, all of which takes time. Yet in seven days the club's money will run out, leaving it on the brink.

Some sources also continue to believe that Green's consortium does not have sufficient funds to complete the purchase, although the administrators say they have seen proof of the £8.5m offer having been lodged in Green's lawyers' account, and also proof of funds to cover running costs from June 1, when the players' contracts revert back to full value. This requires an immediate injection of around £5m.

Green has been approaching Rangers-supporting businessmen seeking investment, and some have met him at Ibrox to hear his plans. Not all have been impressed. Green initially claimed his consortium contained 20 investors, while admitting that some are only prepared to put money into the club if it exits administration through a Company Voluntary Arrangement, but he has already conceded that only "five or six" have supplied funds. He also claimed to fans last week that he has raised £20m, which makes approaches to potential investors seem unnecessary.

Amid all his talk of CVAs, numerous investors, and a bullish – if gruff – turn of phrase, there are causes for wariness. Green's plan was to send a CVA proposal to creditors last Monday, detailing how much each would receive from his £8.5m offer, and giving notice of a creditors' vote on June 6. Monday's deadline was missed, which Green suggested would happen in a meeting with fans last week, and it will be Friday at the earliest before the proposal is sent out, meaning the creditors meeting will not be before June 8, since 14-days' notice must be given.

Rangers would still be able to exit administration by a CVA ahead of the start of next season, but the delays do not provide cause for comfort among fans. Speaking last Friday, Green emphasised the work Duff & Phelps are putting into the CVA proposal, claiming they would not engage in such an expensive task if they did not believe a CVA was possible. Yet one financial expert points out that the proposal "is not that complex" a document, and the administrators have generated much higher fees in the work they have carried out up to now. If Green's bid was to fail, though, the work done on the proposal could be carried on by new owners.

Negotiations are always complicated, but some issues remain pressing. While Duff & Phelps have always maintained that Whyte's floating charge is not valid, because he used money borrowed from Ticketus to pay off Rangers' £18m debt to Lloyds when he bought the club last May, that opinion has yet to be confirmed. Although Green claims to have a binding agreement with Whyte to buy his 85% shareholding, it remains possible for Whyte to block a CVA if he is not listed among the creditors and believes he is legitimately owed money, with the floating charge holder receiving payment in full ahead of other creditors.

The CVA proposal will reveal the administrator's approach. If Whyte is listed among the creditors, they will have to include a value of how much he is owed. If he is not, they must have received legal advice that he cannot be considered the floating charge holder, in which case Whyte could scupper the CVA during the 28-day cooling off period following the creditors' vote by challenging it. This would require further legal action.

The announcement by Mike McDonald, the former Sheffield United chairman, that he would not be taking up the opportunity to become involved revealed something of the consortium's plans. Had the Scottish Football Association's 12-month registration embargo not been upheld on appeal, McDonald would have provide the funds for transfers, in return for a share of the profits of future sales. This seems a disadvantage to Rangers, who would be denied income, but also again calls into question Green's claim to have £20m to hand. Why would he then need McDonald's money?

For Rangers fans, the questions carry as much weight as the promises Green has made. They are beleaguered, but there may be more dramas to come

http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/football/what-is-the-true-colour-of-greens-money.17671567

[Desert Nomad]

Cheers Claymores

[chrismcarab]

It's taken me a week to write this, several redrafts and some strong coffee, but for what its worth......sent to Tannadice this morning.

Dear Mr. Thompson,

I do not envy your position as the chairman of the club I have supported for over 30 years and as an integral member of the SPL Board in the matter of the forthcoming vote on SPL sanction and rule changes. I am sure the days have become much longer and darker since you have found yourself torn between what is unquestionably the correct decision on sporting and moral grounds and the possible impact in financial terms. Your family's dedication to Dundee United in both respects was never more evident than when your late father Eddie was vying for control of the club.

The outcome of the current situation regarding Rangers Football Club has many unknowns which will shape the future of Scottish football for many years to come affecting all member clubs. For Dundee United, a club that is loved by many, I believe it has greater consequences than others.

Dundee United are recognised and respected across Europe not only for the teams that have graced the jersey and challenged the greats of football, but also for its fans; rewarded for their sense of fair play by UEFA, something all United supporters are rightly proud of. I have yet to see a greater accolade of this anywhere in world football than the Fair Play Stand at Tannadice.

You will be privy to far more information than the ordinary fan and will be aware of the growing discontent amongst all fans of all clubs. Should the SPL clubs ignore these feelings in favour of commercial interests it sends a clear message to hard working patrons about the priorities that drive the Scottish game. Even before a decision is made, the talk of boycotts from fans, including those of Rangers should they still exist in some form, will have an unknown impact. There is no doubt this is a watershed moment for Scottish football.

Speculation is rife with very few hard and firm facts being offered that the SPL clubs can base a decision on. Other than the findings of the SFA which must be paramount in any decision making process.

The television deal has not been signed, with no confirmation of any proposed alternative offer without Rangers involvement at SPL level. I and many other fans, across a wide variety of forums, cannot see how an informed decision can be made without knowing this. It seems a vote is to take place with assumptions of intangible income from this revenue stream.

Dundee United have always been a selling club, that is what the club has done to survive. For years we have watched the best talent at Tannadice leave, usually for a fee considerably less than the players worth and more often than not to the very sides that cream the lions share of the SPL revenue. Selling to survive, becoming less competitive in the process and all the while strengthening the grip on a leveraged system from institutions that have made it abundantly clear in the recent past that they hold no fear of deserting the SPL should the opportunity arise.

If Dundee United have to sell our top players to reduce the wage bill and cut the cloth in order to maintain sporting integrity and common moral decency they would not be alone, all clubs, save Celtic, would find the going to be tough over the coming seasons. Many fans are prepared to make that sacrifice and put their hard earned money into helping the clubs through this difficult time.

My brother and I have followed Dundee United over many years - into Europe from the highs of Barcelona 87, to countless losing cup finals, in meaningless end of season fixtures. Our love of Dundee United will always remain. Our willingness to support a system that knowingly perpetrated one of the greatest sporting crimes in world football history is now in the hands of you and 10 SPL chairmen. To have a monument to sporting integrity called the Fair Play Stand and fail to act accordingly would be the beginning of the end for Scottish football. I implore you to do the right thing.

Yours sincerely

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

[Magnethead]

It's obvious to me and the majority of non-Rangers fans that there is absolutely no chance if this matter being dealt with in an impartial manner. Anyone who has a decision to make is directly or indirectly involved in the Rangers fiasco which means, unfortunately that there's only one way things are going to pan out, you know it, I know it, everyone knows it.

I still expect this programme tonight to be pulled for some reason, hope I'm wrong though.

Anyway, I think the SFA should step in, scrap the SPL as it's obviously corrupt to it's foundations and start a national league with pre-defined punishments for ALL eventualities, not the make it up as you go along nonsense that has presented itself recently.

Rangers have been dealt with lightly so far and I don't expect that to change, every effort is being made behind the scenes to protect Rangers from their own wrong doings, which is wrong and makes a mockery of Scottish Association Football.

The fairest way to deal with this situation surely would have been to bring in officials from an external association who would be able to act impartially and impose the relevant punishment. It has been quoted that Rangers committed the 2nd worse offence in football so really they should be punished accordingly.

In a court, if someone commits the second worse crime on the books they are punished accordingly. The judge does not say I'd jail you but I'll let you off with a warning because you've a wife and ten kids that depend on you, there can be no indirect influence. If you break the rules you should be punished without the influence of third party knock on effects.

Corrupt to the very core, the game should be banned in this country.

[WaffenThinMint]

An Open Letter From Football Chairmen

Dear customers,

Of late we have seen a rise in poorly spelled, illegible letters and e-mails to our secretarial staff. God knows what's in them as we don't actually read them or care, but our in-boxes are getting clogged and our waste baskets need emptying more. Please stop sending us your drivel.

It has however come to our attention over a number of years that the little people who squeeze through the turnstiles seem to be labouring under the delusion that the clubs belong to them. Let us make this clear - these businesses are ours, bought and paid for. Many are trinkets to be shown off like trophy wives, some are family heirlooms and others are convenient tax dodges. Do the fat fucks filling their faces in MacDonalds every day imagine the company to be theirs? Do they imagine they can start dictating business strategy to MacDonalds? Of course not and similarly, the clubs are ours and if we have to hear any more whining shit from the customers, there's going to be big changes.

Do you think it's easy running a business where income through the gates varies so much from season to season, game to game? What sane company accountant could fail to notice that tv income is predictable, steady and (Setanta apart), safe. Plans are in place already to get rid of direct paying customers. The tv companies assure us that CGI can create a full stadium with ease so no more security staff, no more police costs, no more smelly dog-food pie stands.

So shut the f**k up little people. We decide what is best for us. If we decide we want to keep one of our commercial partners in business, that's for us grown ups to decide.

Yours in sport

ps - Get your season ticket money out now, we've got bills to pay.

Dear Chairmen,

Football is an entertainment, like many others. If we don't like it, or feel we're not getting value for money, we go watch or do something else. This is 2012, not 1912 where it was take it or leave it.

Have you heard of Auchinleck Talbot, Edinburgh City, Gretna, Irvine Meadow, Linlithgow Rose, Preston Athletic, Sauchie, Spartans? Well okay, you ought to have heard of the Lilywhites and the Anvils, unless you've been sleeping the last ten years (which is always a possibility). Do you know they've all got lovely seated stadiums (and some terracing - some people miss that you know), with lovely hot food, and it all costs a fraction of what it costs to go to a Premier League match. As they start an hour earlier, fans also have time to toddle off home or to the pub after and enjoy the best English Premier League and Championship matches live on the gogglebox after - and let''s be honest they wipe the floor with ours. No wonder you were so willing to accept Sky's contract with any ludicrous terms and conditions.

And before you're tempted to say the Junior and East Of Scotland Leagues don't offer a standard of football anywhere near as good as that of the SPL, Auchinleck came within a whisker of putting out the club that went on to win this year's Scottish Cup. Sorry, no one's swallowing that shite anymore you tell us is chocolate ice cream.

The world of commerce is littered with the graves of those that thought themselves too big to fail and that people would always come because of who they are. Remember Woolworths? Ratners? Habitat? What about all those supermarkets that once sponsored the Scottish Football League? Rangers are just another of them. But if you try to bend the rules to keep them alive, it will be you instead.

If you think we'll all just grumble and trudge back to watch a bent league because you are determined to keep your "big team" in, we'll just go have our jollies elsewhere. We can always go and watch the Glasgow Warriors. They may be crap, but at least their cheerleaders have smaller boobs than those of the 30 something journeyman striker you sign or take on loan at ludicrous wages every close season to keep us in the SPL just so you can get your Corporate Box hospitality at Ibrox with "the big kids".

Yours In Sport,

Joe Punter.

P.S. That lassie of yours with the bleached hair and teeth making an arse of herself in the Daily Record thinking she's going to be a model - only for Airfix dear, only for Airfix.

[Drooper]

They won't.

Have you seen what Hibs and Celtic have been saying?

Stuff Kilmarnock (I mean their chairman).

In fact, you wanna bet? All winnings go to Rangers Fighting Fund.

They will.

You can bookmark this if you feel the urge.

There is absolutely no question that they'll circle the wagons as I suggested the other day.

Edited May 23, 2012 by Drooper

[7-2]

Will the votes on newco sanctions and admitting a newco into the SPL be held in secret or not?

They will be in secret if the numbers can't be manipulated in a manner that prevents Celtic voting no.

[graeme_p]

It's taken me a week to write this, several redrafts and some strong coffee, but for what its worth......sent to Tannadice this morning.

Dear Mr. Thompson,

I do not envy your position as the chairman of the club I have supported for over 30 years and as an integral member of the SPL Board in the matter of the forthcoming vote on SPL sanction and rule changes. I am sure the days have become much longer and darker since you have found yourself torn between what is unquestionably the correct decision on sporting and moral grounds and the possible impact in financial terms. Your family's dedication to Dundee United in both respects was never more evident than when your late father Eddie was vying for control of the club.

The outcome of the current situation regarding Rangers Football Club has many unknowns which will shape the future of Scottish football for many years to come affecting all member clubs. For Dundee United, a club that is loved by many, I believe it has greater consequences than others.

Dundee United are recognised and respected across Europe not only for the teams that have graced the jersey and challenged the greats of football, but also for its fans; rewarded for their sense of fair play by UEFA, something all United supporters are rightly proud of. I have yet to see a greater accolade of this anywhere in world football than the Fair Play Stand at Tannadice.

You will be privy to far more information than the ordinary fan and will be aware of the growing discontent amongst all fans of all clubs. Should the SPL clubs ignore these feelings in favour of commercial interests it sends a clear message to hard working patrons about the priorities that drive the Scottish game. Even before a decision is made, the talk of boycotts from fans, including those of Rangers should they still exist in some form, will have an unknown impact. There is no doubt this is a watershed moment for Scottish football.

Speculation is rife with very few hard and firm facts being offered that the SPL clubs can base a decision on. Other than the findings of the SFA which must be paramount in any decision making process.

The television deal has not been signed, with no confirmation of any proposed alternative offer without Rangers involvement at SPL level. I and many other fans, across a wide variety of forums, cannot see how an informed decision can be made without knowing this. It seems a vote is to take place with assumptions of intangible income from this revenue stream.

Dundee United have always been a selling club, that is what the club has done to survive. For years we have watched the best talent at Tannadice leave, usually for a fee considerably less than the players worth and more often than not to the very sides that cream the lions share of the SPL revenue. Selling to survive, becoming less competitive in the process and all the while strengthening the grip on a leveraged system from institutions that have made it abundantly clear in the recent past that they hold no fear of deserting the SPL should the opportunity arise.

If Dundee United have to sell our top players to reduce the wage bill and cut the cloth in order to maintain sporting integrity and common moral decency they would not be alone, all clubs, save Celtic, would find the going to be tough over the coming seasons. Many fans are prepared to make that sacrifice and put their hard earned money into helping the clubs through this difficult time.

My brother and I have followed Dundee United over many years - into Europe from the highs of Barcelona 87, to countless losing cup finals, in meaningless end of season fixtures. Our love of Dundee United will always remain. Our willingness to support a system that knowingly perpetrated one of the greatest sporting crimes in world football history is now in the hands of you and 10 SPL chairmen. To have a monument to sporting integrity called the Fair Play Stand and fail to act accordingly would be the beginning of the end for Scottish football. I implore you to do the right thing.

Yours sincerely

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Excellent. I hope many other fans are making their feelings known to their Chairmen. We don't support a business we support a football club who compete with others. All our clubs have been disadvantaged by the cheating of Rangers. The ethos of fair play must be put ahead short sighted business decisions.

[Hipster Dufus]

It's taken me a week to write this, several redrafts and some strong coffee, but for what its worth......sent to Tannadice this morning.

Dear Mr. Thompson,

I do not envy your position as the chairman of the club I have supported for over 30 years and as an integral member of the SPL Board in the matter of the forthcoming vote on SPL sanction and rule changes. I am sure the days have become much longer and darker since you have found yourself torn between what is unquestionably the correct decision on sporting and moral grounds and the possible impact in financial terms. Your family's dedication to Dundee United in both respects was never more evident than when your late father Eddie was vying for control of the club.

The outcome of the current situation regarding Rangers Football Club has many unknowns which will shape the future of Scottish football for many years to come affecting all member clubs. For Dundee United, a club that is loved by many, I believe it has greater consequences than others.

Dundee United are recognised and respected across Europe not only for the teams that have graced the jersey and challenged the greats of football, but also for its fans; rewarded for their sense of fair play by UEFA, something all United supporters are rightly proud of. I have yet to see a greater accolade of this anywhere in world football than the Fair Play Stand at Tannadice.

You will be privy to far more information than the ordinary fan and will be aware of the growing discontent amongst all fans of all clubs. Should the SPL clubs ignore these feelings in favour of commercial interests it sends a clear message to hard working patrons about the priorities that drive the Scottish game. Even before a decision is made, the talk of boycotts from fans, including those of Rangers should they still exist in some form, will have an unknown impact. There is no doubt this is a watershed moment for Scottish football.

Speculation is rife with very few hard and firm facts being offered that the SPL clubs can base a decision on. Other than the findings of the SFA which must be paramount in any decision making process.

The television deal has not been signed, with no confirmation of any proposed alternative offer without Rangers involvement at SPL level. I and many other fans, across a wide variety of forums, cannot see how an informed decision can be made without knowing this. It seems a vote is to take place with assumptions of intangible income from this revenue stream.

Dundee United have always been a selling club, that is what the club has done to survive. For years we have watched the best talent at Tannadice leave, usually for a fee considerably less than the players worth and more often than not to the very sides that cream the lions share of the SPL revenue. Selling to survive, becoming less competitive in the process and all the while strengthening the grip on a leveraged system from institutions that have made it abundantly clear in the recent past that they hold no fear of deserting the SPL should the opportunity arise.

If Dundee United have to sell our top players to reduce the wage bill and cut the cloth in order to maintain sporting integrity and common moral decency they would not be alone, all clubs, save Celtic, would find the going to be tough over the coming seasons. Many fans are prepared to make that sacrifice and put their hard earned money into helping the clubs through this difficult time.

My brother and I have followed Dundee United over many years - into Europe from the highs of Barcelona 87, to countless losing cup finals, in meaningless end of season fixtures. Our love of Dundee United will always remain. Our willingness to support a system that knowingly perpetrated one of the greatest sporting crimes in world football history is now in the hands of you and 10 SPL chairmen. To have a monument to sporting integrity called the Fair Play Stand and fail to act accordingly would be the beginning of the end for Scottish football. I implore you to do the right thing.

Yours sincerely

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Nice one.

That's a lot of kisses at the end though

[topcat(The most tip top)]

And before you're tempted to say the Junior and East Of Scotland Leagues don't offer a standard of football anywhere near as good as that of the SPL, Auchinleck came within a whisker of putting out the club that went on to win this year's Scottish Cup. Sorry, no one's swallowing that shite anymore you tell us is chocolate ice cream.

Wasn't actually at the Auchinleck cup tie Post IMO

[chico]

@markdaly2: Biggest EBT beneficiaries named, did Whyte really "dupe" Sir David and questions over the administrators. Tonight at 8 http://t.co/GGLkvTvt

Popcorn required I reckon.