Homer Thompson Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 (edited) I am aware of draft systems in American sport where there is no relegation in place. Are there any such examples in Europe where we have a hierarchical merit-based system rather than a franchise-based one? Of all the holes to pick in the draft model, I think thats by far the smallest. As I said, just give the first pick to the newly promoted team. If a team is relegated with any draftees in the side, then they either remain at the club in the SFL or they are transferred to an SPL team. Im pretty sure when the NFL expanded they gave the new franchises first picks. Edited May 9, 2012 by Mr X 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pozbaird Posted May 9, 2012 Author Share Posted May 9, 2012 Obviously the prospect of Rangers actually 'doing a Third Lanark or Abercorn FC' isn't reality yet. It may or may not be as bad as that. However, IF it ends up as bad as that, I genuinely believe that there will be a group of people, possibly containing Graeme Spiers, Jim Traynor, Mark Hateley and Sandy Jardine, who will come on the telly or the newspapers and say 'this makes it difficult to sign new players for next season, this is bad...'. I think the state of denial in certain individuals could actually see some of them placed on suicide watch. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross. Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 If I remember correctly, the French run or ran a national football acadamy of some kind, can't quite remember the name of it though. Anyone know how that works/worked? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin M Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Of all the holes to pick in the draft model, I think thats by far the smallest. As I said, just give the first pick to the newly promoted team. If a team is relegated with any draftees in the side, then they are remain at the club in the SFL or they are transferred to an SPL team. Im pretty sure when the NFL expanded they gave the new franchises first picks. I think the point craigkillie is making is that the concept of the draft is at odds with football's meritocracy system in general. Not that I think it's inherently a bad idea or anything - I think perhaps a variant on it could be researched where clubs collectively "produce" young players. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayrmad Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 3rd 1st Division forum for this pish 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~~~ Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Hong Kong Rangers got swallowed up by Fourways Athletic. They changed the name this season to Biu Chun Rangers. Biu Chun are a watch manufacturer and the current sponsors, and Hong Kong Rangers were originally the Biu Chun works team. Getting to games from Ibrox over to the Tsing Yi might be the cause of plentee ploblems however. They probably won't touch it unless they rename the stadium the Orange Wok anyway. Rangers already tried to get into China, Guess the outcome of that venture. . 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pansypotterthedirtyrotter Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 I disagree the guy went all the way to being preferred bidder and does not seem to have had any clue about football, Rangers or their financial position. He had access to a 'data room' prior to being appointed preferred bidder and should have known then. He just speculated on Rangers for me and didn't even pay the exclusivity fee to show he was serious. Furthermore I don't buy that he didn't have a passport. He runs an international business and probably takes 'vacation' overseas. that was just an excuse for not coming to Scotland any time soon. Someone with his money can probably get a passport in 24 hrs if needed. And I know Man Utd are a much more prestigious club, the point I was making is that successful businessmen are not that thin skinned that they would let a couple of folk with a banner scare them off. Though I accept that the emails sent him seem to have been totally out of order. Its all about the money with these guys. how about he had a rough idea that things were worse than dumb and dumber were portraying them but certainly wasn't going to pay half a million to have it confirmed. with not a hope in hell of anybody coughing up to see the books they allowed him a peek for free, and with the face contortion of someone who's just clicked on the wrong porn link he slammed the books shut and went and scrubbed himself clean in a cold shower. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drooper Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Obviously the prospect of Rangers actually 'doing a Third Lanark or Abercorn FC' isn't reality yet. It may or may not be as bad immeasurably wonderful as that. However, IF it ends up as bad joyously stupendous as that, I genuinely believe that there will be a group of people, possibly containing Graeme Spiers, Jim Traynor, Mark Hateley and Sandy Jardine, who will come on the telly or the newspapers and say 'this makes it difficult to sign new players for next season, this is bad...'. I think the state of denial in certain individuals could actually see some of them placed on suicide watch. Fixed 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Thompson Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 I think the point craigkillie is making is that the concept of the draft is at odds with football's meritocracy system in general. I dont see how its any different to a franchise model. The "weakest" team gets the best pick. Why does it matter if the "weakest" team is a new franchise or a side promoted from another league? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBadSaint Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 I am aware of draft systems in American sport where there is no relegation in place. Are there any such examples in Europe where we have a hierarchical merit-based system rather than a franchise-based one? Drafting - ahh would be nice to think all teams would get a chance at being decent in everyone's lifetime through a fair system but apart from the the fact we don't have the set up for it...... Who decides draft position? Media...Fans.....I reckon given recent goings on in our Media shows that I wouldn't trust them to vote tactically to place their idea of best player at exactly the right position for the OF to pick .....same with a fans vote. League winners Celtic 12th pic Runners up Rangers (if they exist) 11th pick New 16 year old Messi/Rooney emerge in the years draft ....erm i don't think they're as good as people believe - I'll put them around 11th/12th maybe...that Crawford Baptie's lad is my #1 pick 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broken Algorithms Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 If I remember correctly, the French run or ran a national football acadamy of some kind, can't quite remember the name of it though. Anyone know how that works/worked? France has twelve academies, spread out across different regions. The most famous is probably Clairefontaine, which has seen the likes of Anelka, Henry, Gallas and Saha pass through. The academies are supervised by the French Football association, and players usually move onto bigger clubs in France after. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claymores Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Top tip for the Baron Knights - "Tax Free" is running in the 15.05 at Chester races. With odds currently @8/1, if they put their reported £1.5m on it and their kuddy comes up trumphs, then they could afford to get back in the bidding again! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin M Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 I dont see how its any different to a franchise model. The "weakest" team gets the best pick. Why does it matter if the "weakest" team is a new franchise or a side promoted from another league? Because the notion of a meritocracy implies that each club sources all their own players in the first place. In such a system we cannot (or perhaps just should not) view the SPL in isolation from the rest of the structure, or indeed from other countries. There may be barriers to it from FIFA/UEFA (unless it works that way in other countries). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Rangers as a company ARE insolvent, Duff & Phelps are trying to hide this to keep taking cash out. HMRC will do what they have always done to companys in this situation and serve a winding up notice so they have first dabs on all assets, and they will sell them for the most they can, and if that involves taking £5 or 6 million for Ibrox for land value and the same for Murray park they will, they will sell the players, the computers the club cars the club shredder machines. This is standard procedure for all at Portcullis house when the administrator cannot get the revenue the full value or good return with a proper payback plan agreed for the rest outstanding. This has happened to many companys in Scotland and wider UK in the last 36 months Do they get priority over secured and floating creditors after a winding up order? I realise there are serious doubts about the status of Craig Whyte and Ticketus, and probably ordinary debenture holders too, but I thought the HMRC just got a share out of the leftovers with the other unsecured creditors.. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VodkaTap Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Would you have honestly preferred it if Gretna had stayed financially prudent in the Junior Leagues, and not had that insane roller coaster ride? (I'm not making any comparison to the Rangers situation there, just curious about Gretna) Gretna were financially prudent when they first admitted to SFL3. They were 6th then 3rd in the first 2 seasons in Div 3. It all started to go wrong sometime after Mileson got involved. I have no idea when he first started his financial meltdown of the club. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Thompson Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Drafting - ahh would be nice to think all teams would get a chance at being decent in everyone's lifetime through a fair system but apart from the the fact we don't have the set up for it...... Who decides draft position? Media...Fans.....I reckon given recent goings on in our Media shows that I wouldn't trust them to vote tactically to place their idea of best player at exactly the right position for the OF to pick .....same with a fans vote. League winners Celtic 12th pic Runners up Rangers (if they exist) 11th pick New 16 year old Messi/Rooney emerge in the years draft ....erm i don't think they're as good as people believe - I'll put them around 11th/12th maybe...that Crawford Baptie's lad is my #1 pick The order of selection is determined by league position. The club then picks whoever they want. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross. Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 France has twelve academies, spread out across different regions. The most famous is probably Clairefontaine, which has seen the likes of Anelka, Henry, Gallas and Saha pass through. The academies are supervised by the French Football association, and players usually move onto bigger clubs in France after. Clairefontaine was the one I was thinking of, but wasn't 100% sure on the name. How does it work with regards to players moving on to clubs? Do the clubs buy them from the acadamy? Do they "Draft" them to clubs and the acadamy takes a cut of the sale proceeds? Who decides what club gets specific players? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby_F Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 (edited) Lord Turnbull said the evidence at the trial "made it clear beyond any doubt that the devices...could not have exploded." He went on to say that was because there was not enough "explosive material" and "there was no form of detonator or other method" to blow them up. The judge said: "It follows, therefore, despite believing the devices were capable of igniting and exploding the evidence made it perfectly clear they could not in fact do so, the intent could not have been achieved, there was no risk of injury to anyone beyond accidental contact with the nails present." In other words - it wasn't a bomb. Ah, okay, you're right enough. The fact the attempted murders failed due to incompetence will have eased any concerns Miller had about taking on RFC . Edited May 9, 2012 by Bobby_F 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Thompson Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Because the notion of a meritocracy implies that each club sources all their own players in the first place. In such a system we cannot (or perhaps just should not) view the SPL in isolation from the rest of the structure, or indeed from other countries. There may be barriers to it from FIFA/UEFA (unless it works that way in other countries). But CraigKillies question was specifically about the relegated side. You're widening the argument out quite a bit - not that I disagree with your points. I would imagine the EU would have something to say about it RE employment law too. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~~~ Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Gretna were financially prudent when they first admitted to SFL3. They were 6th then 3rd in the first 2 seasons in Div 3. It all started to go wrong sometime after Mileson got involved. I have no idea when he first started his financial meltdown of the club. The day he took control of the club. I've never had any sympathy for the likes of Gretna & Airdrieonians, at least Grenta fans didnt kill off another club just so they could stay in the SFL. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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