Ken Fitlike Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 you can continue bleating your sevco new club nonsense all you want but the facts are officially we will be back in the top league next season a quick look at the spfl rangers page proves that. all the credible evidence supports the fact that we are the same club try 'Similar' club and you may be going in the right direction. or did Dave King buy OldCo out of liquidation last night and it hasn't made the press yet? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
field of dreams Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 Incorporation. Is the important word, inthis instence. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solitaire Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 Ffs I only said Shakespeare's Sister were shite. I stand by that. Shakespeare's Sister were a great band. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strichener Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 feel free to provide the legal evidence that club and company cant be separated - this mythical scots law for example that all of you talk about and none of you can provide all the legal evidence available shows that club and company are seperate entites, lord nimmo and glennie have proved this They can be seperated, there can be no dispute about that. Now perhaps you can tell us, in legal terms, how the club exists as a legal entity. Neither of the two people that you name have stated that the club has any legal persona. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bennett Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 Shakespeare's Sister were a great band. One song tho..... They can be seperated, there can be no dispute about that. Now perhaps you can tell us, in legal terms, how the club exists as a legal entity. Neither of the two people that you name have stated that the club has any legal persona. The new QC. Farewell HBQC, you'll be missed mate. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henrik's tongue Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 Shakespeare's Sister were a great band. Respectfully, were they f**k... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stonedsailor Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 you can continue bleating your sevco new club nonsense all you want but the facts are officially we will be back in the top league next season a quick look at the spfl rangers page proves that. all the credible evidence supports the fact that we are the same club Wrong. The facts are that it is against UEFA rules for a club to alter their structure in the case of an insolvency event, and has been since the introduction of the financial fair play rules. See the Timişoara case for confirmation. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strichener Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 One song tho..... The new QC. Farewell HBQC, you'll be missed mate. Have you ever considered applying for pointless? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nacho Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 Wrong. The facts are that it is against UEFA rules for a club to alter their structure in the case of an insolvency event, and has been since the introduction of the financial fair play rules. See the Timişoara case for confirmation. a selective interpretation of what uefa actually said, i agree with you totally that "The facts are that it is against UEFA rules for a club to alter their structure in the case of an insolvency event, and has been since the introduction of the financial fair play rules" no argument whatsoever with that,, firstly because what you have stated would have no bearing on the clubs status anyway what you missed out from that , is the fact that according to the rules we remain the same club even if we alter the structure, the appropriate bit is highlighted below heres the exact quote from uefa on the timisoara case “Clubs are not allowed to change their legal form or structure in order to obtain a licence, simply by ‘cleaning up’ their balance sheet while offloading debts – thus harming creditors (including employees and social/tax authorities) as well as threatening the integrity of sporting competition. Any such alteration of a club’s legal form or structure is deemed to be an interruption to its membership of a UEFA member association and consequently three years must pass before a club can apply again for a UEFA licence. In other words, the three-year rule is designed basically to avoid circumvention of the club licensing system.” another massive fail from you you can add that to all the other evidence that uefa recognises we are the same club and its another miserable loss for you 1. “We consulted with UEFA, which explained that its rules allowed for the recognition of the ‘sporting continuity’ of a club’s match record, even if that club’s corporate structure had changed,” 2.Rangers currently sit at number 264 on the UEFA club rankings and have been accumulating points for this season and the last 4 seasons which shows continuation from the oldco to the newco indicating that they consider us the same club. 3. Fiorentina is considered the same club with the same history and honours by UEFA despite going completely bust, starting a completely new club and buying back the Fiorentina name, shirt design and badge years later. Rangers situation was nowhere near as severe as Fiorentina’s as the club was sold from oldco to newco with no gap in history and all emblems, symbols, history and trophies intact so it’s clear that UEFA would and do consider rangers to be the same club it has always been. Uefa have confirmed we are the same club numerous times, you have absolutely nothing to refute this and have to resort to hiding stuff to try and claim otherwise, still you can cling to the fact that our club page hasnt been updated since 2011-12(like hibs hasnt been siince they were relegated from the top division) until the start of next season when the final nail in that particular coffin will be hammered in 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nacho Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 try 'Similar' club and you may be going in the right direction. or did Dave King buy OldCo out of liquidation last night and it hasn't made the press yet? ken you continue to come out with this pish time and time again without providing any supporting evidence that this means we are a new club, all the evidence contradiacts you as all the footballing, legal and business experts who have commented say we are the same club, you are denying reality when you claim we are a similar club with zero credible evidence to back you up 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nacho Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 Incorporation. Is the important word, inthis instence. feel free to provide some properly sourced evidence that incorporation means club and company cant be separated, all the evidence available contradicts this 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nacho Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 They can be seperated, there can be no dispute about that. Now perhaps you can tell us, in legal terms, how the club exists as a legal entity. Neither of the two people that you name have stated that the club has any legal persona. the club doesnt have any legal persona, that is provided by the company that runs it, the club was sold from one company to another so it has always had a legal persona, feel free to expand on your point with this in mind, over to you 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave.j Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 (edited) feel free to provide some properly sourced evidence that incorporation means club and company cant be separated, all the evidence available contradicts thisI'd have a little respect for Rangers fans if they stuck two fingers up by saying... yup, we didn't know any of this shit 4 years ago. Christ we held up red cards against liquidation, that shows you what we knew. But hey, we got let off the hook, they changed the rules just before we went into liquidation, so suck it up.Instead they all make out they knew all along everything would be fine. That makes them look stupid. And gives us the ability to keep pointing and laughing at them. Edited March 6, 2016 by dave.j 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bennett Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 Nory must have been chatting to his chums on Rangers Football monitor blog again. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strichener Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 the club doesnt have any legal persona You previously suggested that it did. Perhaps you can explain negative goodwill in accounts. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nacho Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 I'd have a little respect for Rangers fans if they stuck two fingers up by saying... yup, we didn't know any of this shit 4 years ago. Christ we held up red cards against liquidation, that shows you what we knew. But hey, we got let off the hook, they changed the rules just before we went into liquidation, so suck it up. Instead they all make out they knew all along everything would be fine. That makes them look stupid. And gives us the ability to keep pointing and laughing at them. Rangers fans wanted to avoid liquidation for obvious reasons – losing players, possibility of relegation down the divisions etc. but most were aware that the club would survive as there were buyers in place for it as the evidence shows. STV article from 2011 outlining what would happen if the Olcdo was liquidated, it’s very clear according to that rangers would survive and be the same club. http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/rangers/277115-what-happens-when-a-club-in-administration-sets-up-a-phoenix-company/ duff and phelps in april 2012 "We cannot rule out the winning bid could prefer a different structure that meant the sale of the business to a new company and in that eventuality it is certainly possible that Rangers would be liquidated," co-administrator Paul Clark told a number of newspapers. "But it would only be done so after the football club was made safe." lord glennie may 2012 "This is a petition for judicial review by the Rangers Football Club plc, a company presently in administration. That company presently operates Rangers Football Club (to whom I shall refer as "Rangers"). http://www.scotcourts.gov.uk/opinions/2012CSOH%2095.html cva not agreed 12th june 2012 - hope that clears it up for you, another new club myth busted 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nacho Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 You previously suggested that it did. Perhaps you can explain negative goodwill in accounts. nope not something i have previously said, that is the role of the company, feel free to present an argument on negative goodwill and what its relevance to the new club nonsense is using sources, and i will be happy to answer you 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stonedsailor Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 (edited) a selective interpretation of what uefa actually said, i agree with you totally that "The facts are that it is against UEFA rules for a club to alter their structure in the case of an insolvency event, and has been since the introduction of the financial fair play rules" no argument whatsoever with that,, firstly because what you have stated would have no bearing on the clubs status anyway what you missed out from that , is the fact that according to the rules we remain the same club even if we alter the structure, the appropriate bit is highlighted below heres the exact quote from uefa on the timisoara case “Clubs are not allowed to change their legal form or structure in order to obtain a licence, simply by ‘cleaning up’ their balance sheet while offloading debts – thus harming creditors (including employees and social/tax authorities) as well as threatening the integrity of sporting competition. Any such alteration of a club’s legal form or structure is deemed to be an interruption to its membership of a UEFA member association and consequently three years must pass before a club can apply again for a UEFA licence. In other words, the three-year rule is designed basically to avoid circumvention of the club licensing system.” another massive fail from you you can add that to all the other evidence that uefa recognises we are the same club and its another miserable loss for you 1. “We consulted with UEFA, which explained that its rules allowed for the recognition of the ‘sporting continuity’ of a club’s match record, even if that club’s corporate structure had changed,” 2.Rangers currently sit at number 264 on the UEFA club rankings and have been accumulating points for this season and the last 4 seasons which shows continuation from the oldco to the newco indicating that they consider us the same club. 3. Fiorentina is considered the same club with the same history and honours by UEFA despite going completely bust, starting a completely new club and buying back the Fiorentina name, shirt design and badge years later. Rangers situation was nowhere near as severe as Fiorentina’s as the club was sold from oldco to newco with no gap in history and all emblems, symbols, history and trophies intact so it’s clear that UEFA would and do consider rangers to be the same club it has always been. Uefa have confirmed we are the same club numerous times, you have absolutely nothing to refute this and have to resort to hiding stuff to try and claim otherwise, still you can cling to the fact that our club page hasnt been updated since 2011-12(like hibs hasnt been siince they were relegated from the top division) until the start of next season when the final nail in that particular coffin will be hammered in Clubs are not allowed to change structure during an insolvency event. There is an interuption in the membership of their home FA. Rangers are on a restarted membership which belonged to another entity and ended when that entity died.Three years must pass before a club can apply again. Timişoara applied thinking they were the same club and got knocked back as a new club, they were told to reapply in three years when they had established themselves as a club. The Fiorentina argument is moot as they reformed prior to the rule changes. It's like when everyone was off their skulls on Mcat, one day you could get cunted quite legally, the next a maximum of 4 years for possession. Edited March 7, 2016 by stonedsailor 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stonedsailor Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 That says Fiorentina were refounded in 2002. A bit like Rangers were refounded in 2012. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doink Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 Charles Green 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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