The get fit, stay fit thread

[Greggy Wallace]

What is it you currently do for your back?

I would always recommend squats and deadlifts (not on the same day). I know you specifically mentioned barbell and dumbbells but I would also do as many wide grip chin ups as you can.

Bent over row, deadlifts, shrugs, dumb bell bor

I'm struggling with deadlifts and squats now tbh because I've got knee problems that I'm waiting to receive physio for so can't go heavy at all.

I'm also pretty tall and find chin ups/pull ups a real struggle

[Culture]

Bent over row, deadlifts, shrugs, dumb bell bor

I'm struggling with deadlifts and squats now tbh because I've got knee problems that I'm waiting to receive physio for so can't go heavy at all.

I'm also pretty tall and find chin ups/pull ups a real struggle

If you are struggling with chins I think you are limiting yourself a bit but the only other thing i can think of is doing upright barbell rows (some people do it as part of their shoulder routine) as it works the traps. Seated rows on the cable machine are good too, or using the lat machine for lat pull-downs. Other than that I cant think of much else.

[TurbineTon]

Cheers TT. Was thinking about protein shakes earlier on, may enquire further about them.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Maximuscle-Cyclone-Strawberry-Strength-Powder/dp/B000OZ71IA/ref=pd_sim_d_4

Above is a link to the protein shake that i use.

[Greggy Wallace]

If you are struggling with chins I think you are limiting yourself a bit but the only other thing i can think of is doing upright barbell rows (some people do it as part of their shoulder routine) as it works the traps. Seated rows on the cable machine are good too, or using the lat machine for lat pull-downs. Other than that I cant think of much else.

cheers mate, i do upright rows as part of my shoulder day but i'll change it up a bit, will also get to the gym to do pull-downs

what about assisted chin ups? any good?

[TheScarf]

Just to echo previous posts, six packs are made in the kitchen. All about diet.

[TurbineTon]

So on a typical day when training to get a six-pack. What should you eat?

[Culture]

cheers mate, i do upright rows as part of my shoulder day but i'll change it up a bit, will also get to the gym to do pull-downs

what about assisted chin ups? any good?

Depends if you mean using a machine or someone to help push you up? The way we do it in the gym is when someone is reaching failure we assist by pushing their feet up so they can get an extra 1-2 reps from the set.

With regards to your back you could always keep the same exercises but change how you do the sets. For example instead of three sets of say 6 reps change it to 3 sets of 12 reps. Keeps your muscles from getting used to the exercise and stimulates the maximum gains you can get. We change it around every three or four weeks.

Hope that helps

[Culture]

So on a typical day when training to get a six-pack. What should you eat?

This pretty much depends on your metabolism, do you find it easy to put on weight or can you pretty much eat all the time and not put much on?

I find it really hard to put on muscle because of my fast metabolism so I have a diet high in carbs and calories.

My eating plan pretty much consists of this:

Morning (8am or so): Protein shake mixed in with instant oats

Mid morning: banana

Lunch: Tin of low salt/sugar beans and a bagel

Mid afternoon: banana or fruit salad.

Pre gym: high calorie/carb protein shake (works out around 500 calories and 40g of protein.

Post gym: same shake as pre gym.

Dinner (about an hour after gym): grilled steak/chicken/turkey with wholemeal rice or pasta(just a small hand full)

An hour before bed: Protein shake that blends casein protein and whey. You need casein protein before bed as it is a slow release so as you sleep your body gets the full benefit of it.

Like I said though it all depends on your metabolism and this is suited to me. If yours is slow then I would suggest getting a protein shake that is really low in carbs.

As a general rule of thumb I would cut out as much saturated fat as you can from your diet and limit your carb intake to before 7-8pm at night.

[Aufc]

Started doing the beep test lately. Its fucking horrific.

Upto level 13.6 now. It is not like the one at school where the first few levels can be walked. Start off at a brisk jog. There was a professional footballer doing it with us and he got 15.4 so I feel my score is pretty good!

[TurbineTon]

This pretty much depends on your metabolism, do you find it easy to put on weight or can you pretty much eat all the time and not put much on?

I find it really hard to put on muscle because of my fast metabolism so I have a diet high in carbs and calories.

My eating plan pretty much consists of this:

Morning (8am or so): Protein shake mixed in with instant oats

Mid morning: banana

Lunch: Tin of low salt/sugar beans and a bagel

Mid afternoon: banana or fruit salad.

Pre gym: high calorie/carb protein shake (works out around 500 calories and 40g of protein.

Post gym: same shake as pre gym.

Dinner (about an hour after gym): grilled steak/chicken/turkey with wholemeal rice or pasta(just a small hand full)

An hour before bed: Protein shake that blends casein protein and whey. You need casein protein before bed as it is a slow release so as you sleep your body gets the full benefit of it.

Like I said though it all depends on your metabolism and this is suited to me. If yours is slow then I would suggest getting a protein shake that is really low in carbs.

As a general rule of thumb I would cut out as much saturated fat as you can from your diet and limit your carb intake to before 7-8pm at night.

I can put weight on at the drop of a hat.

I never really have time for breakfast in the morn, but if i do it's normally toast.

I tend not to eat untill lunch at which point i have soup and a sanwich, or pasta of some sort.

My tea varies all the time as i often don't make it.

I've started back at the gym recently as my football has finished. Since i started taking my protein (which i only take after the gym session and the day after) i have noticed a differene. I am able to bench a much higher weight for a longer period of time.

I try to start every gym session off with a 20 min (2 mile) run so i am getting a mixture of cardio and muscle work.

For my ab work in the gym i do roll outs followed by the plank. I work with my partner and we alternate between the two.

I then try and follow this with 100 0dd sit ups.

I'm prone to a beer or two so my stomach isn't as defined as it possibly could be.

[Reynard]

Bent over row, deadlifts, shrugs, dumb bell bor

I'm struggling with deadlifts and squats now tbh because I've got knee problems that I'm waiting to receive physio for so can't go heavy at all.

I'm also pretty tall and find chin ups/pull ups a real struggle

I'm tall as well, big levers make chins tougher but you just need to build it up bit by bit and tough it out. I started off doing a set of 8 then wait a minute or two then 7 rest the 6 then five. Daily until I could crank them out easily. Then just add more and vary the hand positions and keep your form right. One of the best body weight exercises ever I reckon and lots of people shy away from them because they are hard. Definitely worth persevering with and I see a huge difference after sticking with them.

I stopped doing them for about a year as I had a bit of tendonitis in my elbow and I was still playing a lot of squash and wanted to keep that going. When I went back and started doing chins and pull ups again the DOMS the following couple of days were utterly horrific! Shoulders, arms, back and abs were all on fire

[Armand 2]

I then try and follow this with 100 0dd sit ups.

Might sound bizarre but I'd stop this if you are pursuing six-pack definition. If you've got too much fat covering the muscle, it doesn't matter if you do ten sit-ups or a thousand, they're still not going to show. Working on your abs before combining a good diet with regular high intensity cardio is a pretty futile activity - in most cases, all it serves to do is make you look a little bigger around the stomach as the muscles begin to push the fat out further.

Also, when looking to develop a six-pack, don't forget to work on your back muscles.

I try to start every gym session off with a 20 min (2 mile) run so i am getting a mixture of cardio and muscle work.

I'd also advise you to stop doing cardio before weights. Matter of preference, I suppose, but I always recall reading that you are more likely to suffer muscles pulls or tears when following cardio with weight training.

Also bear in mind that the sort of cardio you're looking for is high intensity - try booking up for a spin class or, when on the treadmill, follow a pattern like:

5 mins - warm-up

1 min - sprinting

1.5 min - jogging

1 min - sprinting

1.5 min - jogging

You'll get more benefit from this rather than running at a steady pace for however long. Always consider the physiques of an Olympic sprinter and a marathon runner - one is powerful and defined looking, the other generally looks emaciated; one uses high intensity training, the other uses low intensity training. Suppose it depends on what your aims are.

Edited July 12, 2012 by Armand 2

[Mak]

As far as diet goes, 'low fat' and 'low carb' approaches aren't necessarily appropriate or beneficial. What you need to be doing is eating around the right amounts of these macronutrients, cycling them appropriately.

'Seeing your six pack' is all about burning bodyfat, although work on the core region will help (which doesn't mean endless sit-ups: compound moves are more useful, although things like weighted crunches, Russian twists and hanging leg raises are also useful).

Generally speaking, if your bodyfat's fairly high then you might be well off going lowish on carbs (which doesn't mean cutting them out completely) and higher on fats; say 25-30% of overall calories coming from healthy fat sources. Saturated fats should be kept low, although a moderate intake won't kill you; what you really need to cut out are trans fats. If you're on a caloric deficit, which is the easiest way to burn fat quickly, then you might want to go slightly higher than the normal 2g protein /kg bodyweight as protein has a higher metabolic effect than the other macronutrients, but I wouldn't advise going above 3g/kg. The remainder of your calories should come from clean sources of carbs. There's a bit of debate over which sources are better: everyone agrees that a lot should be coming from vegetables with a small amount from fruit but there's some controversy over which grains to include, if any. Some experts will champion whole grains, pulses etc. while others will say that those are exactly what you shouldn't be eating and tell you to eat starches like white or sweet potatoes and white rice for most of your carb intake. My opinion is that you should experiment to see what works for you, but that being too restrictive can be counter-productive.

If you aren't trying to lose weight and want to gain lean muscle without putting on too much fat, carb cycling approaches are a good way to go. A simple way of doing this is to go higher carb on workout days and lower on non-workout days, although that's a bit imprecise. Intermittent fasting techniques can be effective but are pretty extreme and require a lot of discipline; I don't think that they're a good idea unless you're already quite experienced in the area of training and nutrition. What a lot of people don't realise is that the single most important time to be taking on your carbs is post-workout: this is when your insulin sensitivity is highest and carbs are most likely to be stored as muscle glycogen rather than knocking about your blood sugar and stopping you from burning fats. What I like to do is have moderate protein, low carb (lower than 30g; less carbs than protein), high (10-30g) fat meals in the early period of the day, usually three meals like that, followed by BCAAs and a small portion of quick release carbs (usually 25g raisins or dates) immediately before training and then two moderate protein, high carb (usually over 100g each), low fat meals after training (I train either 6:30pm - 7:30pm or 6:30pm to 8:30pm; one meal comes immediately after training, with the second at either 10:30pm or 11:00pm. If I'm training for 2 hours, I'll also have 1 litre of a sports drink containing quick release carbs and BCAAs during the second hour of training). This is one kind of carb cycling, but there are loads of others which can all have good results if implemented correctly. I think that approaches such as this can at the very least lessen the need for the 'bulking and cutting' approaches favoured by a lot of bodybuilders. Certainly, if you're wanting to gain muscle whilst at the same time 'seeing your six pack' then some degree of carb cycling will be necessary as it's very difficult to bulk up without also gaining fat rather than losing it.

(Should say here that I'm not a bodybuilder and my training's aimed at improved performance rather than aesthetic goals. I am interested in minimising bodyfat and maximising muscle, though, because muscle's functional tissue and fat isn't).

One last thought: a mistake that a lot of people make when trying to build muscle / burn fat is overdoing cardio. I'm not saying that you shouldn't be doing it - for any number of reasons, you should - but you need to bear in mind that excessive cardio can lead to muscle wastage.

[TurbineTon]

As far as diet goes, 'low fat' and 'low carb' approaches aren't necessarily appropriate or beneficial. What you need to be doing is eating around the right amounts of these macronutrients, cycling them appropriately.

'Seeing your six pack' is all about burning bodyfat, although work on the core region will help (which doesn't mean endless sit-ups: compound moves are more useful, although things like weighted crunches, Russian twists and hanging leg raises are also useful).

Generally speaking, if your bodyfat's fairly high then you might be well off going lowish on carbs (which doesn't mean cutting them out completely) and higher on fats; say 25-30% of overall calories coming from healthy fat sources. Saturated fats should be kept low, although a moderate intake won't kill you; what you really need to cut out are trans fats. If you're on a caloric deficit, which is the easiest way to burn fat quickly, then you might want to go slightly higher than the normal 2g protein /kg bodyweight as protein has a higher metabolic effect than the other macronutrients, but I wouldn't advise going above 3g/kg. The remainder of your calories should come from clean sources of carbs. There's a bit of debate over which sources are better: everyone agrees that a lot should be coming from vegetables with a small amount from fruit but there's some controversy over which grains to include, if any. Some experts will champion whole grains, pulses etc. while others will say that those are exactly what you shouldn't be eating and tell you to eat starches like white or sweet potatoes and white rice for most of your carb intake. My opinion is that you should experiment to see what works for you, but that being too restrictive can be counter-productive.

If you aren't trying to lose weight and want to gain lean muscle without putting on too much fat, carb cycling approaches are a good way to go. A simple way of doing this is to go higher carb on workout days and lower on non-workout days, although that's a bit imprecise. Intermittent fasting techniques can be effective but are pretty extreme and require a lot of discipline; I don't think that they're a good idea unless you're already quite experienced in the area of training and nutrition. What a lot of people don't realise is that the single most important time to be taking on your carbs is post-workout: this is when your insulin sensitivity is highest and carbs are most likely to be stored as muscle glycogen rather than knocking about your blood sugar and stopping you from burning fats. What I like to do is have moderate protein, low carb (lower than 30g; less carbs than protein), high (10-30g) fat meals in the early period of the day, usually three meals like that, followed by BCAAs and a small portion of quick release carbs (usually 25g raisins or dates) immediately before training and then two moderate protein, high carb (usually over 100g each), low fat meals after training (I train either 6:30pm - 7:30pm or 6:30pm to 8:30pm; one meal comes immediately after training, with the second at either 10:30pm or 11:00pm. If I'm training for 2 hours, I'll also have 1 litre of a sports drink containing quick release carbs and BCAAs during the second hour of training). This is one kind of carb cycling, but there are loads of others which can all have good results if implemented correctly. I think that approaches such as this can at the very least lessen the need for the 'bulking and cutting' approaches favoured by a lot of bodybuilders. Certainly, if you're wanting to gain muscle whilst at the same time 'seeing your six pack' then some degree of carb cycling will be necessary as it's very difficult to bulk up without also gaining fat rather than losing it.

(Should say here that I'm not a bodybuilder and my training's aimed at improved performance rather than aesthetic goals. I am interested in minimising bodyfat and maximising muscle, though, because muscle's functional tissue and fat isn't).

One last thought: a mistake that a lot of people make when trying to build muscle / burn fat is overdoing cardio. I'm not saying that you shouldn't be doing it - for any number of reasons, you should - but you need to bear in mind that excessive cardio can lead to muscle wastage.

Some great advice, thanks mate.

[TurbineTon]

Might sound bizarre but I'd stop this if you are pursuing six-pack definition. If you've got too much fat covering the muscle, it doesn't matter if you do ten sit-ups or a thousand, they're still not going to show. Working on your abs before combining a good diet with regular high intensity cardio is a pretty futile activity - in most cases, all it serves to do is make you look a little bigger around the stomach as the muscles begin to push the fat out further.

Also, when looking to develop a six-pack, don't forget to work on your back muscles.

I never kew this. I did however notice that my stomach tends to stick out a bit after a lot of sit- ups. Im not fat but i dont exactly have a defined stomach as such. I can see some muscle in certain parts of my stomach but others it's slightly flabby. I Need to tone this up. Do you think there is a way of mking much of a difference before August the 7th.

[Culture]

Pretty much what mhak says, although I think he can put it in a more eloquent way!

[forzamorton]

What should be the average weight for a lad around 6ft?

[Maxriddles]

What should be the average weight for a lad around 6ft?

Someone's ideal weight depends on a number of factors, I wouldn't recommend anyone to aim to be a certain weight. A better goal may be to aim for the sort of body shape you want to have, if you do the right sort of training with the right sort of diet you will achieve it and then you'll find out what your ideal weight is.

[Newbornbairn]

Ok, new to this so looking for tips.

Forty-(cough) basically slim but with a big gut that's developed over the last year or so. Used to be about 12st but I've ballooned to over 16 st and it's all around my waist.

Back in the gym as of last week doing 1 1/2 hour whole body sessions 3 time a week mixing CV with resistance machines. Out on the bike when I can and when weather permits.

I reckon diet is a big part of the weight problem - far too many McDonalds breakfasts and pies at the footy.

Cleaning up the diet is the issue. This week I've started on Slimcea shakes & a banana at lunchtime with some kind of quorn and rice in the evening.

Can anyone advise on those big tubs of powder I see at the fitness shops - what's that all about? Is it a version of Slimcea?

[the jambo-rocker]

After two months out of doing nothing I've finally got back into the game last week. Drinking and smoking like Don Draper hasn't helped. Two football training seesions and a game of football.

I also managed a mile and half run on the treadmill yesterday in under 11 minutes, which I was rather chuffed with. However, I had absolutely no energy afterwards and spent the rest of the night crawling home.