Back Post Misses Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 (edited) 33 minutes ago, Sarah67 said: This seems a pretty fair assessment to me. There was all this talk of the Navy Blue Group guys having anything up to 800k to invest based on claims. It seemed to grow upwards every week, but sadly none of it has really materialised. The majority of those NBG people were on the patrons list Kenny Jamieson showed at the meeting. So it seems reasonable to now question whether the money was ever really there, or if it was empty boasts. If it is there, then hopefully as you say CP they can be encouraged to do what they said as now is the time to plough it in, to get us out of this division and not just let our biggest rivals romp to the title on their watch. Either way, as others have said, we need others to help, so I’d encourage others to do what our family has done and join up to FSS and/or buy shares if you can. I know times are tough but it’s a tenner donation. It’s also not really fair for folk to fire shots at some of the less wealthy patrons though, at the end of the day most of them are fairly “normal” fans who didn’t make big boasts, but normal folk that were lucky to be able to stump up 10k from life savings or retirement pots as a one-off, but who realistically were never going to be able to do it again six months later. Sad times for the finances. On a brighter note, it’s Scottish Cup day! There was never 800k mentioned. It was 550k and would jump to 800k IF Phil Rawlins wished to keep his 26% shareholding as he would have needed to put that sort of money in. When KJ launched the Patron group he made it pretty clear at the time that further investment could be required. It was never sold to us as a one off hit. As far as the “nothing has really materialised comment” do you actually know what you are talking about? 7 NB are Patrons and all invested and all will have done plenty since. Your comment as far as that goes is frankly ignorant of the truth. As far as the boast comment that should be treated with the contempt it deserves as it was a narrative peddled by a previous Chairman Edited January 21 by Back Post Misses 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Back Post Misses Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 45 minutes ago, Syd Puddefoot said: Maybe the likes of Gary Deans, Doug Henderson etc could make a donation to help the club, after all they got us into this mess. Can't see then for dust. Add Liddell to that list 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecosse83 Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 Bring back Onef 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigbrbairn Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 48 minutes ago, Sarah67 said: This seems a pretty fair assessment to me. There was all this talk of the Navy Blue Group guys having anything up to 800k to invest based on claims. It seemed to grow upwards every week, but sadly none of it has really materialised. The majority of those NBG people were on the patrons list Kenny Jamieson showed at the meeting. So it seems reasonable to now question whether the money was ever really there, or if it was empty boasts. If it is there, then hopefully as you say CP they can be encouraged to do what they said as now is the time to plough it in, to get us out of this division and not just let our biggest rivals romp to the title on their watch. Either way, as others have said, we need others to help, so I’d encourage others to do what our family has done and join up to FSS and/or buy shares if you can. I know times are tough but it’s a tenner donation. It’s also not really fair for folk to fire shots at some of the less wealthy patrons though, at the end of the day most of them are fairly “normal” fans who didn’t make big boasts, but normal folk that were lucky to be able to stump up 10k from life savings or retirement pots as a one-off, but who realistically were never going to be able to do it again six months later. Sad times for the finances. On a brighter note, it’s Scottish Cup day! The donation bit is the key A lot of people like myself love their club and want it to grow but in no way want a direct hand in the minutia of ownership and assessing who can piss higher up a wall! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Caractacus Potts Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 17 minutes ago, Back Post Misses said: There was never 800k mentioned. It was 550k and would jump to 800k IF Phil Rawlins wished to keep his 26% shareholding as he would have needed to put that sort of money in. When KJ launched the Patron group he made it pretty clear at the time that further investment could be required. It was never sold to us as a one off hit. As far as the “nothing has really materialised comment” do you actually know what you are talking about? 7 NB are Patrons and all invested and all will have done plenty since. Your comment as far as that goes is frankly ignorant of the truth. As far as the boast comment that should be treated with the contempt it deserves as it was a narrative peddled by a previous Chairman You said most of the 7 have joined the patrons but if it was £550k then was that not 11 people on the NB group at £50k each? If so that means at least 4 were willing to join the NB for £50k but haven’t joined the patrons for £10k. Can they not be tempted for 20% of the previous buy in? Also if not a one off hit does that mean the patrons that signed up were expected to pay an ongoing fee to be included as a member or was that just a general statement about new investment being required? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulioBairn Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 I’m lost. Why are we harping on about the NB group? That was a proposal that was put to the club and rejected so I’m not sure why it’s relevant now? People seem to be having a pop at Patrons, what have I missed? As far as I’m aware these are a group of people who have put significant money into the club at a time of need for next to f**k all in return. Why do people feel they have the right to know every last detail about who has invested, how much they have invested and how many shares they had/have? 17 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Back Post Misses Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 Just now, Caractacus Potts said: You said most of the 7 have joined the patrons but if it was £550k then was that not 11 people on the NB group at £50k each? If so that means at least 4 were willing to join the NB for £50k but haven’t joined the patrons for £10k. Can they not be tempted for 20% of the previous buy in? Also if not a one off hit does that mean the patrons that signed up were expected to pay an ongoing fee to be included as a member or was that just a general statement about new investment being required? Can’t speak for the other 4, no idea why they didn’t join the Patrons 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecosse83 Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 4 minutes ago, JulioBairn said: I’m lost. Why are we harping on about the NB group? That was a proposal that was put to the club and rejected so I’m not sure why it’s relevant now? People seem to be having a pop at Patrons, what have I missed? As far as I’m aware these are a group of people who have put significant money into the club at a time of need for next to f**k all in return. Why do people feel they have the right to know every last detail about who has invested, how much they have invested and how many shares they had/have? This! Kudos to the people who have contributed to helping the club get back on its knees. Some seem desperate to pick apart every little detail of what’s going on, I wonder why? 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy1876 Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 To be fair I think both sides of this argument are fair and being misunderstood. Absolutely good on the patrons for the amount of money they put in out of their own pockets. Equally, some of those patrons had been willing to put in more than 10k a year before so maybe those are people who are a potential source of further support if they still have that extra money. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Caractacus Potts Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 11 minutes ago, Caractacus Potts said: You said most of the 7 have joined the patrons but if it was £550k then was that not 11 people on the NB group at £50k each? If so that means at least 4 were willing to join the NB for £50k but haven’t joined the patrons for £10k. Can they not be tempted for 20% of the previous buy in? Also if not a one off hit does that mean the patrons that signed up were expected to pay an ongoing fee to be included as a member or was that just a general statement about new investment being required? Can’t see anyone having a go at the patrons. Just questioning if those who previously pledged more could be tempted to do the same again. Don’t see why anyone would have an issue with that when clearly we need more investment. Not any different from asking where those who pledged to join the previous fans group haven’t joined the FSS. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blame Me Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 2 minutes ago, Caractacus Potts said: Can’t see anyone having a go at the patrons. Just questioning if those who previously pledged more could be tempted to do the same again. Don’t see why anyone would have an issue with that when clearly we need more investment. Not any different from asking where those who pledged to join the previous fans group haven’t joined the FSS. Sometimes the easiest answer is the obvious one. Circumstances have changed and those that had disposable cash now don't. It does seem that folk are looking for a smoking gun - like board differences or personalities - which aren't necessarily there. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Caractacus Potts Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 Just now, Blame Me said: Sometimes the easiest answer is the obvious one. Circumstances have changed and those that had disposable cash now don't. It does seem that folk are looking for a smoking gun - like board differences or personalities - which aren't necessarily there. Not at all. The NB proposal wasn’t too long before the patrons and unless I’m missing something there’s nothing to suggest of any differences as the end goal appeared to be the same. Not sure why this has triggered so many people when we are able to ask why not as many fans have signed up to the FSS than had previously pledged money. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FFC 1876 Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 No real surprises in the starting 11 today. From memory Hall's a centre back and captain for the u18's, Shay Burke's a centre midfielder and someones going to have to let us know about Mcmurray? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Back Post Misses Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 1 minute ago, Caractacus Potts said: Not at all. The NB proposal wasn’t too long before the patrons and unless I’m missing something there’s nothing to suggest of any differences as the end goal appeared to be the same. Not sure why this has triggered so many people when we are able to ask why not as many fans have signed up to the FSS than had previously pledged money. Do you not listen or just choose to ignore? The Navy Blue offer/wishes were rejected by the Board at the time. They then got into discussions with KJ over a different structure and choose to accept that. The Q&A accelerated the complete change we now have. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Back Post Misses Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 3 minutes ago, FFC 1876 said: No real surprises in the starting 11 today. From memory Hall's a centre back and captain for the u18's, Shay Burke's a centre midfielder and someones going to have to let us know about Mcmurray? Clearly Martin must be off with the new guy on the bench 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Caractacus Potts Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Back Post Misses said: Do you not listen or just choose to ignore? The Navy Blue offer/wishes were rejected by the Board at the time. They then got into discussions with KJ over a different structure and choose to accept that. The Q&A accelerated the complete change we now have. I read well. Went from £300k investment to undisclosed. From £10k buy in to some reappropriating existing shares. From 7 in NB to 11. Just trying to work out what was invested and the potential money out there. Anyone willing to spend £50k should hopefully be persuaded to spend at least £10k under any structure as already established Patrons can pay more. I don’t get your objection to trying to find other avenues of investment. Also don’t get your argument about a different structure. The same could be said of the Back the Bairns pledgers but sure you’ve also questioned why no more of them have joined? Edited January 21 by Caractacus Potts 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ignoramus Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 21 minutes ago, Back Post Misses said: Clearly Martin must be off with the new guy on the bench He’s in Bonnyrigg’s team at Annan this afternoon it appears. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FFC 1876 Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 10 minutes ago, Ignoramus said: He’s in Bonnyrigg’s team at Annan this afternoon it appears. Very strange nothing was announced. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reggie Perrin Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 58 minutes ago, Caractacus Potts said: I read well. Went from £300k investment to undisclosed. From £10k buy in to some reappropriating existing shares. From 7 in NB to 11. Just trying to work out what was invested and the potential money out there. Anyone willing to spend £50k should hopefully be persuaded to spend at least £10k under any structure as already established Patrons can pay more. I don’t get your objection to trying to find other avenues of investment. Also don’t get your argument about a different structure. The same could be said of the Back the Bairns pledgers but sure you’ve also questioned why no more of them have joined? You seem strangely keen to tell other people what they should be doing with their own money. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gav-ffc Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 53 minutes ago, Ignoramus said: He’s in Bonnyrigg’s team at Annan this afternoon it appears. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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