The Falkirk FC Thread

[Skyline Drifter]

27 minutes ago, superandy_07 said:

Paton suspended for two games (rapturous applause).

As amusing as it is if you've told Paton he's suspended for two games as a bit of trolling, he isn't. He has a one match suspension on Saturday. Muirhead has a one match suspension the week after too, though that's irrelevant now if he's out injured anyway.

[Bainsfordbairn]

18 minutes ago, Shodwall cat said:

We got a sell on clause but no fee was involved same with Connor. Hardly surprising the former moved on as he was never given a sniff of first team action even when those playing in the first team were nowhere near the standard required.

I'd have liked to have seen Mitchell get his chance. He could read the game well, was composed on the ball and could pick a pass.

The issue for me was his size. I watched him get brushed aside a number of times in the U20 League so the same would undoubtedly have happened in the first team, except probably more often.

I reckon that in a year or two once he bulked up he would have been a very good player for us.  Though I kind of agree with (presumably) the thoughts of both managers last year that he wasn't ready to hold down a first team berth. He should still have been given a couple of chances though in the same way that Dunne was.

[Shodwall cat]

1 minute ago, Believe The Hype said:

Not sure if you are trying to disagree or agree with me here. By the end of the above, you state teams are above us because the have a good manager in charge and recruitment and not because they punted their academies, we'll going by your logic, which I agree with, they are not above us because they kept them either. 

The blame for us not getting promoted is being unfairly laid at the academies door which had absolutely nothing to do with it.  St Mirren managed to produce a championship winning first team funded by the sale of the likes of Mallan and including players brought through like Lewis Morgan and Kyle Magennis. They will now continue to benefit from having a thriving academy . So they did get promtion thanks to having a good academy aided and abetted by simply appointing an excellent manager and having an excellent recruitmant programme alongside it.

[MrDust]

10 hours ago, Hank von Hell said:

Epic first post Rob-FFC !! Welcome. At last someone else (as well as BPM ) to shoot holes in Margaret's smoke & mirrors. 

We do not need elite status as we are far from an elite club , but we could still bring through our own young players - the lifeblood of small to medium clubs since forever.

This Project Brave was a very convenient reason for them to fall over themselves in the rush to shut the academy .

Best interests my ass. 

They went on about the Brentford chairman working on stats with everything, said he worked it out that a youth player from 8 or 10 in an academy has 0.03 percent chance of making it to your team. I'd say in England the academy situation is lower than Scotland albeit still a low percent but it was always pointed out that if you got one two or three players a year then its done its job. We had to have a manager who would utilise it though, Houston through his entire tenure didn't and that has a huge factor to why its been dry for years.

This Brentford model is hardly a model, they claimed it was all done on a players stats ala moneyball american football, yet when they signed a player for millions based on stats looking to get a return whilst he flopped, suggests stats and football doesn't work as well or don't akin to the american funny shaped ball.

Their model really is what every club has done, snap up big clubs rejects, give them a platform and if they show well £s. Crewe had a purple patch with it

I can't wait till Dallison is wort £5M, that's if we followed this Brentford model !!!

[Stuperman01]

1 hour ago, Bairnardo said:

Whilst I have said before, like others, I couldnt make it lastnight so loathe to give it the big talk and I know aswell as anyone how it can be a bit intimidating to speak up in these scenarios, but I dont know why anyone would go to an event like this with no intention of ensuring the board get a hard time. The whole point of something like this is to air out all the dirty stuff. Even if all is going well thats the point of these things.

I havent seen much post forum talk about the bid to take over the club. Were the board pressed on this, ie what are the stumbling blocks and whether they are actively working towards this or are they paying it lip service whilst blocking it any way they can?

The only person that really touched on this was Colin Liddle (I think thats his name anyway) he said they are willing to listen to offers but any offer has to be  from the right people who have evidence of funds etc in place to take the club forward. Lang acknowledged discussions but didn't really expand much on it at least until I left anyway. Colin also said that the MSG are not in this for financial gain which was met by a few groans. 

Edited November 2, 2018 by Stuperman01

[superandy_07]

34 minutes ago, Skyline Drifter said:

As amusing as it is if you've told Paton he's suspended for two games as a bit of trolling, he isn't. He has a one match suspension on Saturday. Muirhead has a one match suspension the week after too, though that's irrelevant now if he's out injured anyway.

Might have heard Ray wrong, updated to reflect 

[ShaggerG]

56 minutes ago, Shodwall cat said:

Going by Mckinnon's comments last night things are not well behind the scenes at Morton and he couldn't wait to jump ship even to a club in our state in the league.

Whilst none of us are privy to the actual reasons or circumstances of McKinnon's move I feel that it's fairly obvious that there were underlying reasons for him to do what he did. Why would a manager who had only recently been appointed and was doing a reasonable job of improving the team that he was with decide to jump ship to a club (or at least team) in turmoil?

I suppose it's reasonable to suggest that we are a 'bigger' club with better (very) long-term prospects however it still seems a wee bit of a strange decision on the face of it unless there were extenuating circumstances.

If I was a Morton fan I'd be more interested in why this happened rather than how yet I don't think I've seen any of them ask that question on here so far?

[Stuperman01]

1 hour ago, Shodwall cat said:

Problem is all our rainy day cash is being used to keep us up not to push for promotion and people keep going back to the academy because the reasons they are giving us for it closing don't add up. The other laugh was that we didnt keep the likes of Longridge because they wanted more money and Hartley felt he could get better players in for that cash.  Feckin hilarious statement that was.

I did ask if the 'substantial' increase on the budget in January will be sustained  to next season,  Lang didn't really give a reply although agreed when I said that spending money is the only way to get out this league. 

[Believe The Hype]

8 minutes ago, Shodwall cat said:

The blame for us not getting promoted is being unfairly laid at the academies door which had absolutely nothing to do with it.  St Mirren managed to produce a championship winning first team funded by the sale of the likes of Mallan and including players brought through like Lewis Morgan and Kyle Magennis. They will now continue to benefit from having a thriving academy . So they did get promtion thanks to having a good academy aided and abetted by simply appointing an excellent manager and having an excellent recruitmant programme alongside it.

Who is blaming the academy? 

Now you are using the academy as a positive source of income to allow the first team to recruit well for promotion. What if there was no immediate prospects or sellable assets to generate that cash? The circumstance we had was we needed money to improve the first team ASAP. Keeping the academy was not going to do that so the logical step was to look at all avenues of extra income which included axing the academy and put any money in the first team which was the correct decision at that moment in time. What we lacked was an excellent manager and recruitment like you have stated. 

[Shodwall cat]

24 minutes ago, Believe The Hype said:

Who is blaming the academy? 

Now you are using the academy as a positive source of income to allow the first team to recruit well for promotion. What if there was no immediate prospects or sellable assets to generate that cash? The circumstance we had was we needed money to improve the first team ASAP. Keeping the academy was not going to do that so the logical step was to look at all avenues of extra income which included axing the academy and put any money in the first team which was the correct decision at that moment in time. What we lacked was an excellent manager and recruitment like you have stated. 

We've shut our academy down basically because individuals think the money used to fund it( which is pretty insignificant in real terms) should be used to fund the first team instead. To me that isn't necessary as the budget we've had over the previous 5 or 6 seasons is more than enough to get us promoted if we have the right manager in charge and a proper recruitment system in place.  St Mirren and Livi being the ideal example of this on smaller budgets than what we have had the past few seasons.You can fling as much cash at the budget as you want but it will make no difference if you don't have the right people spending it as can be seen in the case of Dundee United over the past couple of seasons and ourselves.  There is absolutely no reason why we shouldnt have been able to achieve what was necessary on the park and kept our academy. We then would've had the added bonus of young talent coming through in the future and improving our first team plus our bank balance when sold on. 

Edited November 2, 2018 by Shodwall cat

[Shodwall cat]

23 hours ago, Back Post Misses said:

 

I don’t think re-starting the youth development programme is pie-in-the-sky. The most difficult bit would be convincing parents to trust Falkirk again.

Certainly it would not start as it finished but built up over a period of time it is certainly achievable

 

That and the fact that we would now have to fund it completely by ourselves having missed out on the SFA pot due to Lang and Campbell. 

[Skyline Drifter]

34 minutes ago, superandy_07 said:

Might have heard Ray wrong, updated to reflect 

I doubt it, you're not the first on this thread to say they announced he was suspended for two games. Definitely only one though.

[Reggie Perrin]

Having had time to reflect on last night's event I am even more of the opinion that our CEO is not of the standard required.

Hid behind Margaret Laing almost all evening and when he did contribute it added little to the event.

Laing spoke well and at length though far from convinced by much of what she said, but unrealistic to expect her to deviate from the party line in a public forum.

Don't doubt her commitment to the club but is she in a position of power or a pawn of others?

Colin Liddell seemed to enjoy his wee turn in the spotlight taking the opportunity once again to remind people of how they saved the club 20 years ago (or was it Back the Bairns and the fans...) not at all sure what he brings to the BOD.

It was late into the event that the matter of the revenue we fail to generate due to not owning the office / hospitality areas of the main stand was raised.

We lose out to the tune of hundreds of thousands of pounds compared to  the likes of St Johnstone and Hamilton, surely a priority for this board or (hopefully) their successors to resolve with the Council.

Edited November 2, 2018 by Reggie Perrin

[Reggie Perrin]

1 minute ago, Skyline Drifter said:

I doubt it, you're not the first on this thread to say they announced he was suspended for two games. Definitely only one though.

Bugger

[ilostmyself]

Surely as long as nobody tells Paton we should be alright.

[Shodwall cat]

I certainly cant remember him saying anything about a two game suspension.  Can only remember him saying Saturday.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Branch Ton said:

Think watching endless reruns of  Peppa Pig is about the limit of your powers of comprehension grandad.  

Wonder how your lawyer’s detailed explanation of the selection process for Hartley’s  appointment differs from what happened with McKinnon’s, and why, and also how the “press” came to know before McKinnon or Morton.  Staggering you think that the SFA haven’t already seen documents such as contracts which their compliance officer,  who is herself a lawye, r would have reviewed, before deciding to move to a full review.  Maybe you should switch to Teletubbies, don’t they live in LaLa Land?

 

Aw look. It just can’t stay away. The SFA you say? The SFA? 

Stick to your legalise bollocks, as you clearly have no grasp of who is involved in the meeting. The SFA. You utter half wit.

[Believe The Hype]

23 minutes ago, Shodwall cat said:

We've shut our academy down basically because individuals think the money used to fund it( which is pretty insignificant in real terms) should be used to fund the first team instead. To me that isn't necessary as the budget we've had over the previous 5 or 6 seasons is more than enough to get us promoted if we have the right manager in charge and a proper recruitment system in place.  St Mirren and Livi being the ideal example of this on smaller budgets than what we have had the past few seasons.You can fling as much cash at the budget as you want but it will make no difference if you don't have the right people spending it as can be seen in the case of Dundee United over the past couple of seasons and ourselves.  There is absolutely no reason why we shouldnt have been able to achieve what was necessary on the park and kept our academy. We then would've had the added bonus of young talent coming through in the future and improving our first team plus our bank balance when sold on. 

We are going round in circles here. Good manger, good recruitment, and if possible have an academy in the background for the romantic notion that we will uncover a gem. Got ye. 

[AGPar]

20 minutes ago, Believe The Hype said:

Who is blaming the academy? 

Now you are using the academy as a positive source of income to allow the first team to recruit well for promotion. What if there was no immediate prospects or sellable assets to generate that cash? The circumstance we had was we needed money to improve the first team ASAP. Keeping the academy was not going to do that so the logical step was to look at all avenues of extra income which included axing the academy and put any money in the first team which was the correct decision at that moment in time. What we lacked was an excellent manager and recruitment like you have stated. 

A properly, prudently-run football club would not have required to view its academy in those terms. It could, and should, have provided us with a massive advantage over any other club of our size, allowing us to maintain a competitive first team whilst integrating players of the quality of Alston, Fulton, Kingsley, McGrandles, Sibbald and Wallace over a period of time. Instead, ruinous decisions such as allowing Hughes and Craig to run riot with the cheque book, followed by the appointment of May, meant we had hit the financial buffers by the start of 2011/12 and had no choice but to throw them in wholesale, before many of them were anywhere near ready. From that point onwards, the focus was solely on getting players into the first team, irrespective of preparedness, "marketed" and punted out the door at the first opportunity, for whatever we could get. In the January of 2014, with the likes of McGrandles, Alston and Kingsley well established, a modicum of ambition and investment would have seen us win the league with a bit to spare. Instead we sold Fulton and signed two loan players, one of whom was utterly useless. That was a massive sliding doors moment, and they took the wrong option again.

Competent stewardship of the football club over the past ten years would have rendered the either/or scenario you paint completely irrelevant. The prospect of having five or six graduates as regular first-team players (and quality players at that) supplemented by experienced signings was well within our grasp, and could have easily taken us into the top flight and established us there. Instead, despite receiving transfer fees that others could only dream about, we have nothing to show for it, in terms of either infrastructure or performance and achievement on the park, and are staring League 1 squarely in the face.  Criminal does not even begin to cover it.  Those "custodians" failed the academy, and the club,  not the other way round. 

 

 

 

[Bairnardo]

Surely as long as nobody tells Paton we should be alright.

What about if we all agree that he sits out one game due to suspension and X number further due to being shite?