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The New Raith Rovers Thread


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2 minutes ago, Toddy said:

yeah i get that but all it does is fuel speculation in regards the actual fee . Would it not be better if clubs just told the details of the fee involved ? They're always talking about transparency after all. 

Yes, in an ideal world transfers would be fully disclosed so everyone could see the details. However there is no formal requirement for clubs to do so.  Furthermore, if one or both parties have requested the deal to remain private and confidential then there is very little they can say publicly. We will never know.

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Compare what we did with Tait to what St Mirren did with Jamie McGrath. Hibs apparently offered them money plus 2 players and they told them to bolt. No need to rush into selling a player at this stage of the window especially if we're going to get him back on loan.

Given we're not going to get anyone else in then what the hell is the money going towards? If the club dispute the £100k figure and it's more yet still no investment then what the hell is happening at the club! If it's that or less then we've given him away.

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He'll never ask these questions, we rarely ask any probing questions unless approved before any interview.

Oh I’m well aware of that.
And it’s not the fault of Raith TV guys either I’m sure- as has been said most other club TV channels are the same.

But it would be nice to hear answers to the questions we all want to ask at times like this.
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53 minutes ago, ATLIS said:

I'm not entirely sure why he'd come back but we've got better here. I'm sure it's a season long loan too so you can't cancel it without us agreeing as well (may be a factor if you're paying his wages in full and we don't want to)

Think if we can we may send him back, not a bad player just not a great one even at this level tbh, waste of a loan deal IMO 

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14 minutes ago, Ding Dang Doo said:

Compare what we did with Tait to what St Mirren did with Jamie McGrath. Hibs apparently offered them money plus 2 players and they told them to bolt. No need to rush into selling a player at this stage of the window especially if we're going to get him back on loan.

Given we're not going to get anyone else in then what the hell is the money going towards? If the club dispute the £100k figure and it's more yet still no investment then what the hell is happening at the club! If it's that or less then we've given him away.

St Mirren supposedly accepted that deal, we ran out of time when submitting the paper work. 

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29 minutes ago, raith1974 said:

Then you don't sell him, he was under contract until 2024 and if he fulfilled his potential this season we may well have has 2 or 3 teams bidding for him. We've just given away another decent youngster for next to nothing.

May…perhaps…reportedly. Not picking on you, @raith1974, but your post was timely to quote. I stand by my assertion that Dylan Tait was underperforming our expectations so far this season, not vastly, but still not pushing on as we expected. Hendry moving on exposed Tait as not quite as developed as we believed (I know I did), but he is still a very solid prospect. He has also picked up a nasty affinity for yellow cards. So, why did Raith accept Hibs bid?

1) Desperate for money

2) Promised Dylan they would allow him to move if an acceptable offer arrived, probably in exchange for that contract extension. Note that Hibs gave Dylan a four year deal, very important to him.

3) Got an offer they didn’t see being significantly improved upon by waiting.

4) JMcG believes that Dylan could be replaced with another player soon, so Tait was available for sale.

 

Of the four above, #2 or #3 seems most likely. On to “what is a good transfer deal”…

Well,  a good deal within Scotland is worth less (in cash terms) than a sale to an English club, and we know that Bowie was worth about £150k, plus some addons. Given Tait’s performance last year, £100k would seem a bit low, but if you get a 10% or 33% cut of sell-on fees that number can look increasing better or worse. As I’ve said before, without details, we cannot judge how good a deal this is.

 

Finally, for those scunnered by Raith selling talent, we are what we are. It would be awesome to have kept Bowie, Hendry and Tait while pushing into the Premiership, but we lack the financial backing for that yet. We will be developing and selling talent for the immediate future,  but hopefully building the club structure to finally make the push for permanent promotion. We have a number of  promising local young players, more than any time in recent memory, and are about to have to replace Fife Elite to ensure a further stream.

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Finally, for those scunnered by Raith selling talent, we are what we are. It would be awesome to have kept Bowie, Hendry and Tait while pushing into the Premiership, but we lack the financial backing for that yet.


I’m going to disagree with you and agree with you all in one go.

You’re right, we are what we are- a development/selling club.
But where I’ll disagree with you is that it’s not about our lack of financial backing.

Young guys generally don’t dream about trying help Raith Rovers get promoted to the Scottish premier.

If a team comes in for them who can offer them the chance to play in front of 15-20k fans every week in a team established at a good level then any young guy with ambition will jump at that chance.
And without spending an unsustainable amount of money on wages we’ll never be able to compete with that.

That’s maybe a bit ‘canny stand in the lads way’ but it’s the sad reality and the best we can do is make sure we wring as much as we can out of the deal when it happens.
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29 minutes ago, stevoraith said:

 


I’m going to disagree with you and agree with you all in one go.

You’re right, we are what we are- a development/selling club.
But where I’ll disagree with you is that it’s not about our lack of financial backing.

Young guys generally don’t dream about trying help Raith Rovers get promoted to the Scottish premier.

If a team comes in for them who can offer them the chance to play in front of 15-20k fans every week in a team established at a good level then any young guy with ambition will jump at that chance.
And without spending an unsustainable amount of money on wages we’ll never be able to compete with that.

That’s maybe a bit ‘canny stand in the lads way’ but it’s the sad reality and the best we can do is make sure we wring as much as we can out of the deal when it happens.

 

This..................Pretty much spot on, 

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Raith Rovers shouldn't exist to develop players for other teams.  Sometimes it's a natural by-product of bringing young talent through, but this "oh well he was always going to leave so as well being now " attitude will mean this club never, ever progresses.  

Again, I don't mind where the club play.  But you do everything you can to reach the best level you can.  All this talk about 5 year plans from Sim, I'd like to know where selling youth players to the first bidder fits in?

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Raith Rovers shouldn't exist to develop players for other teams.  Sometimes it's a natural by-product of bringing young talent through, but this "oh well he was always going to leave so as well being now " attitude will mean this club never, ever progresses.  
Again, I don't mind where the club play.  But you do everything you can to reach the best level you can.  All this talk about 5 year plans from Sim, I'd like to know where selling youth players to the first bidder fits in?

I get your point but doesn’t the club have a £1M debt over its name? Within the last 2 years we’ve generated an estimated £250k + future incentives. The clubs existence is priority. We don’t want to be like our neighbours, we pay our debts. Within this 2 years, we’ve progressed from league 1 to the championship.

In regards to price, nobody seemed unhappy with the fee for Bowie who had a long list of scouts at every game from all over the UK. Tait attracted some interest but nowhere near as much and whilst I am a big fan of his, hasn’t been a shadow of himself this season. Whether thats due to interest, being asked to play deeper due to being without Hendry, nobody knows. If we had Matthews and Spencer fit, I doubt he’d have featured much based on form.

In McGlynn we trust we all say. Lets show him some. Ultimately we have Tait until Jan, at which point (if not before) we’ll have a replacement lined up.
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2 minutes ago, RRFC1989 said:


I get your point but doesn’t the club have a £1M debt over its name? Within the last 2 years we’ve generated an estimated £250k + future incentives. The clubs existence is priority. We don’t want to be like our neighbours, we pay our debts. Within this 2 years, we’ve progressed from league 1 to the championship.

In regards to price, nobody seemed unhappy with the fee for Bowie who had a long list of scouts at every game from all over the UK. Tait attracted some interest but nowhere near as much and whilst I am a big fan of his, hasn’t been a shadow of himself this season. Whether thats due to interest, being asked to play deeper due to being without Hendry, nobody knows. If we had Matthews and Spencer fit, I doubt he’d have featured much based on form.

In McGlynn we trust we all say. Lets show him some. Ultimately we have Tait until Jan, at which point (if not before) we’ll have a replacement lined up.

Why is Sim making noises about becoming a Premier League club then? Again, i don't really mind at what level we play, but a couple of months ago Sim was on the radio talking about 5 year plan to get to the Premiership etc. 

Bowie had half a season where he looked decent at League 1 before getting the move to Fulham.  Tait is well above that.

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48 minutes ago, stevoraith said:

 


I’m going to disagree with you and agree with you all in one go.

You’re right, we are what we are- a development/selling club.
But where I’ll disagree with you is that it’s not about our lack of financial backing.

Young guys generally don’t dream about trying help Raith Rovers get promoted to the Scottish premier.

If a team comes in for them who can offer them the chance to play in front of 15-20k fans every week in a team established at a good level then any young guy with ambition will jump at that chance.
And without spending an unsustainable amount of money on wages we’ll never be able to compete with that.

That’s maybe a bit ‘canny stand in the lads way’ but it’s the sad reality and the best we can do is make sure we wring as much as we can out of the deal when it happens.

 

You are actually pretty much completely agreeing, in my view. I think that over time the Rovers could establish a fan base that would support what we all aspire to see, especially if we keep playing attractive football. However, until then, the younger players will almost always succumb to the blandishments of the bright lights at clubs like the OF, Hearts and Hibs (and, perhaps the Dons) and be clawed away from us.

What would it take to establish Raith Rovers as a solid premiership side with enough appeal to retain players? Unfortunately, I suspect the answer involves a sugar daddy who builds us a new park…something I would be very disappointed in. There is a certain (urine-soaked) charm to Stark’s Park, the old Main Stand and all. There is something about the club that might have to die to reach that higher level, and I’m not really sure that would be for the better.

Am I sad that Dylan is leaving, and I hope we got a good deal, but I still stand behind the Rovers!

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6 minutes ago, RRFC1989 said:

In McGlynn we trust we all say. Lets show him some. Ultimately we have Tait until Jan, at which point (if not before) we’ll have a replacement lined up.

Whom do you see filling that role? Arnott is young and promising, but seems more an AM and is still too raw, much like Coulson. Coulson is looking alright in League Two, but that’s League Two, and BRS is an enigma so far. Are you assuming we bring someone in?

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