Raith Against The Machine Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 6 minutes ago, PB1994 said: I presume, before this transfer, McGlynn would have been nailed on for a contract extension? I know everything has changed from the fans point of view but will the board not still have every intention of offering him a new contract? What would the reaction be like if he signed a new deal? It's an odd situation, actually. I'm not sure I realised McGlynn's contract expired at the end of this season, before all this happened. As you say, you'd think it was a foregone conclusion that he'd have been offered and agreed an extension, and maybe it was one of those where it was so locked in they just hadn't gotten around to actually completing the formalities, but there can't be many managers of McGlynn's (prior) standing with a club like the Rovers who enter the last five months of a contract. There was some discussion last night that this season is the end of John Sim's "five year plan" that targeted ending up in the Premiership and that McGlynn's contract depended on the success or failure of that, but I'd find that hard to believe. Or, at least I would have done, six or seven days ago. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueone Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 1 hour ago, Michael W said: There's an article in The Courier today about our finances. As one may imagine, they are bad. Those culpable in this horrendous saga have gone and taken another massive shit on our balance sheet. https://www.thecourier.co.uk/fp/sport/football/2977113/raith-rovers-david-goodwillie-finances-john-sim/ Anyone know how to bypass the paywall on this article. Or copy and paste if that's allowed. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renton Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 1 minute ago, blueone said: Anyone know how to bypass the paywall on this article. Or copy and paste if that's allowed. https://12ft.io/ Paste the url in that link. But to save you a read, without Sim the club is dead. This has been true since 2006. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob1885 Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 Is that you straight back into shite patter mode, aye?No it's me calling out out right hypocrisy. Couldn't mark some of your necks with a blow torch. It's fine, a lot of you are too close to it and I knew some sort of bargaining would come along at some stage I just didn't expect it so soon. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manfaefife3 Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 We're often told in our finances there are soft loans to directors, has it ever been published how much and to whom these are owed to ? Won't this likely affect director resignations if we have to pay these loans back ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Offshore Rover Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 As much as Sim is to blame for this whole situations, him leaving us would mean we would go bust. The man inputs his own money to keep the club afloat and owns the stadium. Unless we have another mystery business person hiding in Kirkcaldy then I cant see him resigning. Dont get me wrong, he is still a fud for giving the green light over this deal but it would be extremely worrying if he was to leave 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raith Against The Machine Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 1 minute ago, blueone said: Anyone know how to bypass the paywall on this article. Or copy and paste if that's allowed. If you open the link in Incognito mode you should be able to read it, although it doesn't really tell us anything we didn't already know. "The club" as an umbrella term for a nebulous collection of five or six companies all owned by a tangled mess of stakeholders, owes John Sim (and associates) about a million quid. The balance sheet shows a fair amount of fixed assets, but a significant amount of those were only accrued by money straight from Sim's pocket. Quite simply, there is no realistic prospect of 'ousting' John Sim. Not unless someone finds £3m minimum in a Samsonite briefcase that's washed up on the Prom. What makes the events of the last week even more maddening is that John Sim has, on the face of it, actually been doing really good work for the longevity and sustainability of Raith Rovers. Stark's Park is arguably in a better condition than it has ever been. From improved maintenance, to new floodlights and the pitch, to the new hospitality building and the upcoming "Hub", all underwritten by Sim, the club has been doing everything right in becoming an actual cornerstone of the community. There's also been no indication that John Sim is looking to turn a quick buck or pull some other sort of nefarious moves. People have, to a lesser or greater degree, turned a blind eye to his stranglehold on the ownership and leadership because he's been making these long-term investments for the good of the club. The total sabotage of all those efforts, by the same man is just utterly bizarre. He seems to have some sort of blindspot when it comes to the first team, like it exists in a bubble that's insulated from the rest of the organisation. That's the only way that I can see how he's managing these utterly conflicting actions. Fundamentally, he's shown that he's not a suitable person to be chairman. As the majority shareholder in both the club and the ground he shouldn't be chairman anyway, and that's been brought into an incredibly bright light this week. If John Sim wanted to, he could pull the shutters down on Raith Rovers Football Club tomorrow. I hope, and believe, that he won't. He needs to step away from the Chairmanship and the board. He only became Chairman after Bill Clark stepped down previously (if I remember rightly), so it's not a situation that's unprecedented. I'd also like to see a proto-Foundation of Hearts style situation where a conglomerate of fans' groups can buy back at least some of his stake in the club and the ground, over time, to get back to a position where we're no longer beholden to one individual. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Starko Rover Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 3 minutes ago, Offshore Rover said: As much as Sim is to blame for this whole situations, him leaving us would mean we would go bust. The man inputs his own money to keep the club afloat and owns the stadium. Unless we have another mystery business person hiding in Kirkcaldy then I cant see him resigning. Dont get me wrong, he is still a fud for giving the green light over this deal but it would be extremely worrying if he was to leave Unfortunately you’re pretty much spot on the best we can hope short term is Sim is he agrees to be in the background and removes himself from the board until we come up with a way of buying him out. He’s the difficult one to remove. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael W Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 13 minutes ago, Manfaefife3 said: We're often told in our finances there are soft loans to directors, has it ever been published how much and to whom these are owed to ? Won't this likely affect director resignations if we have to pay these loans back ? I can't seem to read the Courier article anymore, but I think it was £860k. It wasn't said to whom these were owed, but I imagine most of it is John Sim. The club is insolvent. It is still trading, but the assets are outstripped by the liabilities. We are fucked without Sim, but at the same time things need to change. Over time, gradually lessening his grip on the club is the way forward. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsimButtHitsASix Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 If Raith are going to be paying up Goodwillie's contract in full, or at least some of it, or putting him on gardening leave is it still gonna be coming from the club's (ie the supporter's) money or are the rape apologists who sanctioned the signing gonna be paying this up out of their own pockets? That'd be the contributing factor on whether I'd be going back or not for the foreseeable. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
50/50 Winner 2.0 Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 It's a simple one for me, McGlynn has to go. It's a shame that his legacy at Stark’s will be tainted but he only has himself to blame. He knew the risks and decided it was worth it. He's put the reputation of our club through the mud on a global scale and there's no way back from that. Will we ever shake the 'rape rovers' nickname? A grovelling apology from McGlynn might be enough for some fans to overlook this mistake but it won't sway my opinion. There's a saying which has been used by Rovers fans over the years "In McGlynn we trust". Up until Monday, I was a firm believer in this sentiment. How can we trust him again if he's willing to tarnish the club's name whilst showing complete disregard for the concerns of the fans and sponsors? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawk89 Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 (edited) Hypothetically speaking, if Sim was to put the for sale sign up do you think he would just take the first offer? Or do you think you'd be in a stagnant position like we were with Lachlan Cameron where he effectively kept the club alive but couldn't contribute anything further (in Sim's case wouldn't be willing to), whilst chasing off roasters like the restore-a-roof guy (Hugh Clarke) until the right person was found? Worth noting my understanding was that Lachlan and the directors fronted soft loans but wrote them off when David Smith took control. Edited February 4, 2022 by Hawk89 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Starko Rover Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 2 minutes ago, Hawk89 said: Hypothetically speaking, if Sim was to put the for sale sign up do you think he would just take the first offer? Or do you think you'd be in a stagnant position like we were with Lachlan Cameron where he effectively kept the club alive but couldn't contribute anything further (in Sim's case wouldn't be willing to), whilst chasing off roasters like the restore-a-roof guy (Hugh Clarke) until the right person was found? Would come down to Sim as a person I guess. He’s a Raith fan after his father was a lifelong fan, he could close the club tomorrow or sell it to any old arsehole to rip apart. Only he could decide if he wants to see the club finished or hand it onto the right person at the right time. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raith Against The Machine Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 2 minutes ago, Hawk89 said: Hypothetically speaking, if Sim was to put the for sale sign up do you think he would just take the first offer? Or do you think you'd be in a stagnant position like we were with Lachlan Cameron where he effectively kept the club alive but couldn't contribute anything further (in Sim's case wouldn't be willing to), whilst chasing off roasters like the restore-a-roof guy (Hugh Clarke) until the right person was found? Worth noting my understanding was that Lachlan and the directors fronted soft loans but wrote them off when David Smith took control. I don't think there's any way of knowing. Until this week there was no indication whatsoever that any kind of succession plan was in place or would be required any time soon. His stated aim was to get the club to a point of sustainability, and he was investing in the infrastructure to try and make that possible. There are too many permutations now to really get a handle on how things will go, ranging from liquidating the club to him paying the Goodwillie money out of his own pocket and then stepping away from the board while continuing to underwrite the club. It'll probably be somewhere inbetween, but it's too soon to tell. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheScarf Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 14 minutes ago, Against The Machine said: "The club" as an umbrella term for a nebulous collection of five or six companies all owned by a tangled mess of stakeholders, owes John Sim (and associates) about a million quid. The balance sheet shows a fair amount of fixed assets, but a significant amount of those were only accrued by money straight from Sim's pocket. Sounds a bit like how Ross County operate. The football club is just one of the companies under the umbrella of Global Energy Group. Which (I believe) means McGregor can move money about between all the companies under the umbrella tax free. So he takes 1-2 million from one company, and pays off County's debt every season. Most of which will be the players/coaching staff salaries. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smpar Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 Yep. Scratching my head at how quickly some Raith fans are doing an about turn. It's fine to have a rapist apologist as your manager because he's a good manager, sound. John McGlynn is more culpable than anyone at the club for that signing. I also agree. I’m not accepting the “he’s just a football man through and through” as a reasonable excuse. Yes, McGlynn is clearly just a manager who loves football and will do whatever is in his power to succeed. Let’s not kid ourselves on, however, that he didn’t know who and what Goodwillie is and how this signing would be received. Quite how McGlynn thought that was an appropriate signing for a club he knows inside out is an extraordinary moral failing of his. It’s incredibly difficult to find out that someone you’ve idolised would demonstrate such abhorrent decision-making, and for that I empathise with the Rovers fans that you’ll want him to have that chance. For me, though, his position is untenable. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raith Against The Machine Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 1 minute ago, TheScarf said: Sounds a bit like how Ross County operate. The football club is just one of the companies under the umbrella of Global Energy Group. Which (I believe) means McGregor can move money about between all the companies under the umbrella tax free. So he takes 1-2 million from one company, and pays off County's debt every season. Most of which will be the players/coaching staff salaries. The Rovers' set up isn't borne of clever tax work (that might go on, although I don't think it does), it's a result of years of mismanagement and buyouts and investment vehicles to get other bad actors out of the way. I believe one of the longer term aims that John Sim has committed to is to simplify the structure, but it's nigh on impossible. The 'core' group is composed of Raith Rovers Football Club Ltd, Raith Rovers FC Holdings Ltd, New Raith Rovers Ltd and NRR Investments Ltd. There's also Stark's Park Properties Ltd, which owns the ground. It's all very incestuous with each company owning bits and parts of some of the others. I keep meaning to sit down and try to work out what the effective overall control is, but on the back of a fag packet, John Sim owns about 75% of the club and 85% of the ground. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broken Algorithms Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 Would come down to Sim as a person I guess. He’s a Raith fan after his father was a lifelong fan, he could close the club tomorrow or sell it to any old arsehole to rip apart. Only he could decide if he wants to see the club finished or hand it onto the right person at the right time. For all of his faults in the Sim during the current debacle, he has a track record of an interest in helping community projects in Kirkcaldy like the Kings theatre development. Nothing the size of writing off the debts of a club like Rovers mind you. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeWhoWalksBehindTheRows Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, GreenockRover said: No shit Sherlock...? Not much added by your incisive contribution there and clearly your rage typing fucked up the 'mate' sarcasm attempt. Never mind. Cant wait for your next attempt at serious discussion. Aye, I'm seething right enough. You've got me there. E.t.a the fact that you don't know the m9 patter leads me to believe your a little bit dim M10.. Edited February 4, 2022 by HeWhoWalksBehindTheRows 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cardle is Magic Posted February 4, 2022 Share Posted February 4, 2022 It’s utterly inconceivable that any Raith fan would still be on board with McGlynn remaining in post. He was a major contributor to the most shameful episode in the club’s history, which has ended up costing a fortune both financially and in their reputation to the local community. He’s been a brilliant manager over his two spells with Raith but his position is completely untenable. A fresh start is surely both desired and extremely necessary? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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