The New Raith Rovers Thread

[Double Jack D]

32 minutes ago, stevoraith said:

I think the difference between fans of other clubs commenting on McGlynns future, and some Raith fans doing the same is that it’s easy for the fans of other clubs to see it in black and white.
The Raith fans see more of the grey areas (and yes, perhaps a bit through rose-tinted reactalights).

If it’s not too callous to do so, I’ll use a crime-based analogy. I think we all agree McGlynn is guilty of the crime.

It’s the sentencing we have the problem with.

A judge will take into account the previous record and behaviour of the defendant.
That’s what the Raith fans who have softened their attitude towards McGlynn are doing.
The other thing taken into account by a judge is remorse- this is the key thing for me.
It’s yet to be seen what he has to say on the matter, and what he does say will be key for me deciding which side of the fence I’ll come down on.

Me too.

I'm fairly sure he wont convince me but I'm willing to give him a listen.

Edited to add, I'm on the side of the fence that he should go, as soon as practical. The detail behind the signing and his response to it would need to 100% absolve him for me to climb over to the other side. 

If, as is expected, he promoted the signing or tries to justify it in any way then he should leave on the same horse as DG and the remaining board. 

Folk saying that this is obvious, maybe so but we haven't been given that info yet. 

Edited February 4, 2022 by Double Jack D

[ribzanelli]

3 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

McGlynn clearly identified Goodwillie and sold him to the board as an option. I'd be surprised if he didn't sell them the idea that he'd be accepted and there would be no fuss either.

You clearly had board members who would've questioned him over that when the name came up, and I'm not convinced the others on the board would know enough either way.

It's really disappointing to see Raith fans now trying to defend him and shift "100%" of the blame to a chairman who in all likelihood was sold Goodwillie by McGlynn as someone who'll get Raith promoted and wouldn't cause any fuss.

McGlynn is the root cause here, its him who started the process.

As has been said, it is black and white for non Raith fans. In truth all the things you have just categorically stated as being ‘clear’ are not actually clear at all, although granted they are fairly likely. Nobody is shifting blame off him at all and just wanting to welcome him back, simply looking for an explanation in the first instance before confirming an opinion that is 95% confirmed anyway. 

[roverthemoon]

21 minutes ago, Uncle Psychosis said:

Deserving a second chance because he's part of the Raith family is rhetoric I've heard somewhere else recently. Perhaps someone could remind me where that might have been. 

Sorry, but this is hyperbole. Comparing Goodwillie and McGlynn is fucking daft. Choosing to ignore someone’s past and thinking it’s just football ability that matters when you’re looking to potential signings is a monumental error of judgement but it is not the same as raping someone. Plus every single Rovers fan talking about giving McGlynn a second chance is based on him apologising, Goodwillie has and never will apologise. 

Edited February 4, 2022 by roverthemoon

[R.R.FC]

9 hours ago, McGuigan1978 said:

I really hope the board don’t think that their statement this morning fixed anything  

From what I can gather, four board members and the manager thought that signing a rapist was a good idea. With that being the case, I’d like them all to leave the club 

I really couldn’t care less what McGlynn has done previously, championing Goodwillie is a hideous route to go down, and he should leave. 

The Board is also a disgrace, and the fact they’re hiding behind anonymous statements says a lot about them. Pathetic. 

This morning was a start, but nothing more than that. 

Can I ask, has your opinion changed since Tuesday night? I listened to your excellent podcast with Andy Harrow on the subject on Tuesday night and you suggested that you would consider going back, although not immediately, if they cancelled Goodwillie’s contract because it would at least show they eventually listened to the fans but you said, as we all thought at the time, that wasn’t going to happen.

They have obviously done that now but the comment above appears a lot stronger that your thoughts on Tuesday night regarding this hypothetical situation. Not having a go in any way, just genuinely interested to hear your thoughts.

Is it just a simple case of you were speaking about a hypothetical situation you didn’t think would happen or at least not for a long, long time and now it has, much quicker than we all thought, that in the light of day with the feelings involved you still feel the same level of anger and raw emotion which changes your position slightly or has there been anything else which has changed your feelings?

Again, I am not having a go, it was a great listen, just interested to know. I appreciate doing something like that less than 24 hours after the event is difficult to digest everything and even understand the depth of your true feelings on the subject at that stage particularly as this has been so fast moving. None of us expected to be in the situation we were in on Monday night and then from that point, I don’t think any of us thought we’d see the change as quickly as yesterday.

[Jilted John]

I also wonder how many of the fans of other teams who are demanding we hound the manager out are being genuine in their comments or are actually here to try and add to the turmoil?

[Broken Algorithms]

When the news, that there had been a u-turn, broke I actually found myself feeling more angry than I had been on Tuesday and Wednesday!
In footballing terms, Rovers are now in exactly the same place they were last week - in that David Goodwillie doesn’t play for them. Yet Raith Rovers are drastically altered. Everything was lost during this fiasco and nothing was gained - not even these mythical goals that would miraculously propel us to win the league. All of this shame and embarrassment has been for nothing. So much has been stripped away from the club I proudly supported for 25 years in the blinkered pursuit of this divisive player and now he’s just binned, gone. 
We’ve gone from club statements lauding him as a talented footballer who is a part of the Raith family to a statement where he, like Voldemort, couldn’t be referenced by name - simply “the player”. Do they really expect us to believe they suddenly changed their entrenched opinion so drastically? That they only just realised what he did and who he is?
 
I’m a woman, a mum and I work with children. Personally I wouldn’t feel comfortable cheering on a team that contained Goodwillie. So, from that perspective, obviously I’m glad he’s gone. However, it’s too late. It took far too long to “do the right thing” and because of this I find it hard to feel the benefit of being pleased or relieved now he’s gone.
 
Had the board acted more quickly (I.e. after Val announced she was pulling her sponsorship) so many more relationships could have been salvaged. Goodwillie’s departure came after all the damage was done and I’m incredibly angry about the absolute fuckwittery of the people, at the top, responsible for that.  If any of them genuinely thought “we didn’t realise it would be this bad” then they don’t deserve to hold any position, within any company, that involves decision making more complicated than “what should I order for my lunch?”.
Hopefully change is afoot and hopefully I’ll stop feeling so angry about everything soon. Can’t see myself back at Starks Park until we’ve seen some changes at CEO / boardroom level - because I might burst a blood vessel, or something!
 

In all honesty, I felt that the mood in the fan base changed drastically when Scott Burns rumour started doing the rounds on twitter. I said to a few folk it felt like the support became divided between most folk who found it but disgusting and had awareness of how commercially toxic it would be, and the few who felt it was worth it because he'd score goals. It wasn't everyone, but I felt a lot of people in the latter camp were daft wee laddies who were either naive to the perception or trying to be edgy.

For the last month, I've seen some amount of horrendous takes. Every game we didn't score you had the same folk chatting about how "Goodwillie would've won us that game". All the unity which had built up to scenes the full time in the Killie game, for me, were gone. If we hadn't gone forward with this you'd have have seen stuff like that for the rest of the season.

It's fucking incredible how many times the club decided not to be transparent: that a CEO decided the best course of action was to lie to our primary sponsor and as a result cost the club a six figure sum. That a board and management team tried to fly this under the radar and that most fans would just shrug their shoulders and say "ah he's here now, we can't do anything". It wouldn't surprise me on the slightest if the board were fuming that Scott Burns leaked this in the first place. That they lost any facade of being naive about how people don't want him at the club.

Now we're stuck giving him a full wage because so few people failed to show any sign of transparency.

[renton]

McGlynn and Smith should go, for they are guilty of a monumental f**k up in their judgement. That doesn't mean McGlynn shouldn't hold up his hands publicly - he should, for his own sake own his part in this and try to move forward - but I don't think that saves his job.

Practically speaking, I'm not sure this board can sack him, given their own culpability. It would raise some difficult decisions about their own positions.

So, he might walk away of his own accord. I really couldn't tell you what is going to happen at this club in any 12 hour slot now.

Otherwise, for me I think the most practical way out is to limp to the end of the season. Win enough to not get relegated and let McGlynn and Smith go at the end of their contracts.

In the meantime however, there needs to be quicker action in refashioning the board to allow for a rebuilding of the club from a corporate level and to quickly get in the hunt for a new management team. I don't imagine any half decent managent candidates would fancy working under the conditions part created by the current board.

So, in the short term I'd like McArtney to be told she is going with McGlynn and Smith, for Sim to accept he cannot continue as chairman and step back (we cannot realistically get rid of him) to increase the size of the board from the current 4 to 8, to add a second elected fans representative director - I don't care if the level of holding held by the trust is adequate or not, we are owed. The other two slots to include a new chairperson. Diversity of views within the Rovers community and a broader outlook should be paramount in choosing new representatives to run the club.

[GreenockRover]

16 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

McGlynn clearly identified Goodwillie and sold him to the board as an option. I'd be surprised if he didn't sell them the idea that he'd be accepted and there would be no fuss either.

You clearly had board members who would've questioned him over that when the name came up, and I'm not convinced the others on the board would know enough either way.

It's really disappointing to see Raith fans now trying to defend him and shift "100%" of the blame to a chairman who in all likelihood was sold Goodwillie by McGlynn as someone who'll get Raith promoted and wouldn't cause any fuss.

McGlynn is the root cause here, its him who started the process.

You're guessing.

Projecting like f**k, but still guessing.

To a point, we all are. However only those who were actually part of the process know how it went and in what order.

Most of us realise we have to wait and see who and how many put their hands up and show accountability.

But you crack on with building that mass scaffold

[stevoraith]

Just because McGlynn has done well for Raith he has a redemption road? f**k right off, he wanted to sign a rapist.

If Locke signed Goodwillie, he'd rightly be chased out of town. The same should happen to apologist John.

Nope, you’ve missed the point.

It’s not because he’s ‘done well for Raith’ in a footballing sense.
That’s the same as ‘he’ll score goals’.

It’s because of all the good he’s done around the club in general. He’s been a massive part of making the club the part of the community it has (had?) become.
He’s instilled a sense of pride at following this club. He’s worked hard at a million things that make the club better but are never seen on a Saturday afternoon (fixing roof racks on the minibus, sorting showers, painting changing rooms etc are all things that insiders have mentioned him doing).

It’s all these things that make us think he’s sitting in his house right now with his head in his hands wondering why he was so stupid, rather than fuming that he’s lost his star striker over a storm in a teacup.

Of course we don’t know which of those he’s feeling, we can only guess based on our judgement of his previous character- that’s why we need him to speak out.

And that’s why it’s not black and white for a lot of Raith fans.

[TheScarf]

John McGlynn is the reason this has all come about.  Not John Sim or Karen McCartney.  The latter clearly didn't to go him and say 'we want to sign David Goodwillie' did they? He needs hounded out of the club by the fans.

[roverthemoon]

Looks like the Christmas Day kickabout between rivals is over and we’re all heading back to the trenches. In some ways that’s a good sign. Means that the worst of this shit is over with Goodwillie gone. Long way back for us as we try to get rid of those who fucked this up (including McGlynn) but at least the journey has started. 

[gav-ffc]

From the outside I don’t think he should be sacked as that’s another pay off coming out of your club, he should be walking ( should’ve already) and not be taking a pay off.

[Gigi Alabocheré]

13 minutes ago, Jilted John said:

I also wonder how many of the fans of other teams who are demanding we hound the manager out are being genuine in their comments or are actually here to try and add to the turmoil?

Your manager wanted to sign a rapist ya mad man. 

[HeWhoWalksBehindTheRows]

1 hour ago, GreenockRover said:

 

The more astute of you here will have noticed my return to the boards after a lengthy absence. 

Events such as this are indeed designed precisely for these forums.

I'm 'pleased' to see that, after all this time, DIV is still happy to entertain the low IQ boys who's idea of analysis in any given subject is both without research and substance.

plus ce la change!

You're board signed a rapist m9.

[DiegoDiego]

I also wonder how many of the fans of other teams who are demanding we hound the manager out are being genuine in their comments or are actually here to try and add to the turmoil?

There's been ample chance for fans of other teams to stick the boot in and add turmoil this month, but almost to a man folk have realised this is not the correct situation to do so. Why would they start now?

If I were a Raith fan I'd want McGlynn gone. I don't want him banished from football, but in any other line of work if you make a monumental error of judgement which costs the company hundreds of thousands and ruins its reputation, you're getting the tin tack regardless of exemplary service prior.

[RandomGuy.]

27 minutes ago, ribzanelli said:

As has been said, it is black and white for non Raith fans. In truth all the things you have just categorically stated as being ‘clear’ are not actually clear at all, although granted they are fairly likely. Nobody is shifting blame off him at all and just wanting to welcome him back, simply looking for an explanation in the first instance before confirming an opinion that is 95% confirmed anyway. 

It's a 100% fact that John McGlynn is the reason Goodwillie was an option. There's no debate to be had there. Do you honestly believe, in the knowledge there were board members questioning the signing at all, that he didn't sell Goodwillie to them?

Raith fans circling the wagons to protect McGlynn are being horrendous hypocrites here. You can't have this both ways.

[Jilted John]

7 minutes ago, gav-ffc said:

From the outside I don’t think he should be sacked as that’s another pay off coming out of your club, he should be walking ( should’ve already) and not be taking a pay off.

Weren’t Falkirk rumoured to be interested too? 

[roverthemoon]

5 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

Raith fans circling the wagons to protect McGlynn are being horrendous hypocrites here. You can't have this both ways.

Not seen anyone doing that. Most I’ve seen is folk saying ‘!et’s hear what he has to say for himself before making the decision to bin him’.  Many want him gone at some point, including myself. I’d probably give him to the end of the season for some continuity and stability on the field and to avoid costing the club yet more money. 

Edited February 4, 2022 by roverthemoon

[CM.]

3 minutes ago, Jilted John said:

Weren’t Falkirk rumoured to be interested too? 

Had bids rejected.

[ribzanelli]

2 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

It's a 100% fact that John McGlynn is the reason Goodwillie was an option. There's no debate to be had there. Do you honestly believe, in the knowledge there were board members questioning the signing at all, that he didn't sell Goodwillie to them?

Raith fans circling the wagons to protect McGlynn are being horrendous hypocrites here. You can't have this both ways.

Its almost certainly the case, although it wouldn’t be the first time a promotion hungry chairman went rogue in the signing department. 

I’m 95% certain he has to go but I’ve got a small window in which I’m willing to listen, that’s all.