The New Raith Rovers Thread

[Raithie]

1 hour ago, Ro Sham Bo said:

I'd agree with this. To lose Hendry, Tait and Spencer within 12 months would be a disaster and we'd need to rebuild the midfield completely.

Aye, and this is also another reason why I think having a go at promotion is imperative otherwise we'll forever be stuck in this cyle of 'do well - fail on promotion - and key players who have done well get picked up by bigger teams'. It just ends in a never ending rebuild job each season. One of the key components of our success in the past has been keeping a core group of players together. The consistency and togetherness can be a huge factor and I feel it's one of the reasons a team like Arbroath are doing so well in recent years. We've got the benefit of a committed manager that seems like he's in this for the long haul - just need some key players to do the same however if bigger teams come calling with bigger wages it's a no brainer players will be off. 

Re crowds. It's depressing to see us struggle to break the 2000 barrier with a team playing such good football and sitting in a great position league wise. Falkirk managed to get over 3000 for their game against Montrose (if the attendance reported in the goal supplement in the papers is correct) and that's a team who are in the seaside league with some brutal results thus far. Partick as well are getting just shy of 3000 for home games I believe. If it boils down to club size then fair enough but we've shown plenty of times that when required the fans turn up - they just don't want to turn up for run of the mill games against the likes of Morton/Ayr etc (no offence to those teams intended). How we improve attendances is anyones guess. I can't even get into my laddies school for meetings etc so players can't just rock up for a blether with the kids, have a kick about and hand out some tickets. Hopefully if we're still sitting nicely near the top end of the table into the new year it might entice folk to think 'actually, the team might do something special, I'll pop down and give them some support'. 

[HoBNob]

15 hours ago, Jilted John said:

 

I’m sure if you asked most Pars fans they’d tell you that they’ve lost a lot of fans over the past couple of years. I’d imagine if both clubs stayed around the championship for a few more years that our attendances wouldn’t be too far off each other.

We had a bounce in attendances after the admin period, our attendances have largely settled now. 

 

Depends what you define as a few years, since 2009? We've spent the same amount of time in the Championship bar our one season in the Premier, which wasn't great for growing the fanbase unsurprisingly. 

14 hours ago, raith1974 said:

They also stated there was 4500 at the recent Fife Derby. Unlikely as our end had 1000 fans, the away end was empty and the Norrie stand was sparse at best.

You still had the North West and the main stand. 

 

There was undoubtedly more tickets sold than attendees, but if you think that the difference is so large that both clubs are pulling the same numbers you're a bit deluded tbf. 

 

I've no idea why Raith struggle for numbers, you'd probably be best going over each clubs average attendance and seing when they started to split off. Dunfermline is one of the fastest growing towns in Britain at the moment which does help, however its unlikely people are moving to Dunfermline without already have allegiances in place. There's a plethora of Hearts and Hibs fans in the town, and it's not like they're a far journey. 

[Raithie]

46 minutes ago, Grant228 said:

You still had the North West and the main stand. 

Did we? 

[Rovers_Lad]

Is he not meaning you still had to take into consideration home support in the North West and Man Stand

Even at that seville calculator well in use for derby game and not just that game 

[HoBNob]

2 hours ago, Raithie said:

Did we? 

No, we did. As opposed to Starks the home support isn't fully housed within the end stand, the main stand is one of the more populated parts of the ground. 

36 minutes ago, Rovers_Lad said:

Is he not meaning you still had to take into consideration home support in the North West and Man Stand

Even at that seville calculator well in use for derby game and not just that game 

There'll be a discrepancy for sure, for example the Raith end wasn't maxed out due to no shows, however its not so large that our attendance is down around 1600. 

[TxRover]

Found this data:

https://public.tableau.com/views/attendances/HomeLeagueAttendances?%3Aembed=y&%3Adisplay_count=yes&%3AshowVizHome=no

 

Couldn't find the DFAC version of the same thing, my search skills and tableu experience let me down...but I'm surprised the attendance "trend" isn't what I expected. With a general sign that attendance has stagnated since about 1970, varing mainly only due to league level and opponents.

[RRFC2711]

Aye, Saturday was cold when it got dark. Time to get the winter jacket out and two pairs of socks.

That’s me in July in the south stand by the way

[Wardy]

Obviously a long way away, but I wonder when the community hub opens behind the North stand, that they change it so that becomes the home end? It’s a shame the terracing behind the dugouts couldn’t have a stand behind it at an angle, similar to how the main stand sits at Dens Park. 

Edited November 24, 2021 by Wardy

[Scottydog]

Not massively interested in how many fans attend EEP or don't. I will admit to holding to the belief that judging by the figures posted weekly and looking at highlight reels then unless there are a few thousand sitting below and behind the camera then they are using the same accountancy method as Ross County.

What I am interested in is why our core has dropped to around 1500 and not recovered post covid, that was our core in L1 (previously around 1700/1800 in Championship). Away support in L1 was on average 90 fans and in the pre-covid championship average was about 900. If our core is as it seems to now be around 1500 I'd be keen to know what the streaming figures are. If 1600 were in attendance on Saturday how many streamed the game? The Morton support was very poor could there have been just as many or more streams sold in Inverclyde and how many season ticket holders tuned in?

With Kirkcaldy (50k), Glenrothes (40k) and all the other wee places between Aberdour, Cardenden, Markinch and the Coaltown of Wemyss the Rovers catchment area has to be close on 120-130k, it's piss poor that for a core home support we cannot harness even 2%, even more so given the quality and standard of football we are currently enjoying.

I spoke to a lapsed fan today who admitted that despite The Rovers STILL being the 1st result he looks for, he hasn't been inside SP for years When asked why? He said they (he and 4 mates) just started going to the pub and watching the EPL game on a Saturday lunchtime instead and it just became the norm. I pointed out he could come to SP and watch the EPL in either the Raith Suite or 200 club and then go to the Rovers and pick up a 3rd game on Sky after the Rovers game.

Is football too expensive? personally I don't think £20 for an adult is too excessive but for a family day out for Dad, Mum, Jack (12yrs £8) & Jill (10yrs £5) it'd be £53 before they even buy a programme or pie (season tickets for them all would be (£675). In this neck of the woods I just don't think the money is there! Kirkcaldy has little of no industry and could even be described as an employment blackspot, that kind of cash is hard for folks to come by once in a blue moon never mind 2 times a month!  Fife Flyers family game pass at £49 is slightly cheaper but I suppose the product is quite different, best yo don't get me started that one.

I think up to 2 kids under 10 should be free if accompanied by a full paying adult, unacompanied kids below 16 yrs should be £7 (leave em enough for a pie!) Pensioners/students/Consessions £15. We need to grow the support. To do that we need to bring as many of the lapsed fans (there has to be a few 100) and we need to find new supporters. Both can be more easily achieved with a decent product at a decent price, we are heading in the right direction but maybe a few tweaks are needed here and there.

Another thing is get to them while they're young! An American Sporting franchise owner once said "Give a kid a team jersey when they are young and you've got them for life"  I don't think we do enough here on that score.

[Scottydog]

1 hour ago, Wardy said:

Obviously a long way away, but I wonder when the community hub opens behind the North stand, that they change it so that becomes the home end? It’s a shame the terracing behind the dugouts couldn’t have a stand behind it at an angle, similar to how the main stand sits at Dens Park. 

I  kind of a degree (although we cant fill what we already have) but there's another big Portacabin going there I think.

Edited November 24, 2021 by Scottydog

[Wardy]

14 minutes ago, Scottydog said:

I  kind of a degree (although we cant fill what we already have) but there's another big Portacabin going there I think.

It’s weird though because, yes we can’t fill what we’ve got, but yet the team from West Fife (and other teams within the division)  seem to open more than 2 stands for their support…just gives fans more opportunity to sit and view the game from a different perspective. 

[embow]

1 hour ago, Wardy said:

Obviously a long way away, but I wonder when the community hub opens behind the North stand, that they change it so that becomes the home end? It’s a shame the terracing behind the dugouts couldn’t have a stand behind it at an angle, similar to how the main stand sits at Dens Park. 

Most unlikely planning would ever allow that due to blocking light to houses on other side of Pratt Street.

Ever wonder why we have the L shaped stand from as far back as the early 1920's? I'm fairly certain that was the issue as far back as then, almost a hundred years ago.

[Zen Archer (Raconteur)]

5 minutes ago, embow said:

Most unlikely planning would ever allow that due to blocking light to houses on other side of Pratt Street.

Ever wonder why we have the L shaped stand from as far back as the early 1920's? I'm fairly certain that was the issue as far back as then, almost a hundred years ago.

The only building around that time was the old manse.

Detailed Old Victorian Ordnance Survey 6 inch to 1 mile Old Map (1888-1913) , Kirkcaldy, Fife Co-ordinates 56.115299, -3.159471 (archiuk.com)

[pantene proV]

32 minutes ago, embow said:

Most unlikely planning would ever allow that due to blocking light to houses on other side of Pratt Street.

Ever wonder why we have the L shaped stand from as far back as the early 1920's? I'm fairly certain that was the issue as far back as then, almost a hundred years ago.

The stand was moved from our previous ground at Robbie's Park was it not?

Edited November 24, 2021 by pantene proV

[embow]

Ok so the terraced houses weren't there in 1913. They look late C19th but obviously not. When were they built then? Indeed when was that part of the town between Milton Road and Links Street developed? I'm still sticking with them being there before the stand was built until proven to be talking gibberish.

[embow]

3 minutes ago, pantene proV said:

The stand was moved from our previous ground at Robbie's Park was it not?

The original one was and was situated on the railway side. I think that was the one that was burnt down and the club became a limited company selling shares to help finance the new stand. I'd need to go away and read the 'Bible' again to make sure all that is correct.

[Scottydog]

Main stand was built 1923? 

I would have thought the terraced houses would be up by then, I reckon Barnett Cres would maybe be 1930's

[RaithRover123]

4 hours ago, Scottydog said:

Not massively interested in how many fans attend EEP or don't. I will admit to holding to the belief that judging by the figures posted weekly and looking at highlight reels then unless there are a few thousand sitting below and behind the camera then they are using the same accountancy method as Ross County.

What I am interested in is why our core has dropped to around 1500 and not recovered post covid, that was our core in L1 (previously around 1700/1800 in Championship). Away support in L1 was on average 90 fans and in the pre-covid championship average was about 900. If our core is as it seems to now be around 1500 I'd be keen to know what the streaming figures are. If 1600 were in attendance on Saturday how many streamed the game? The Morton support was very poor could there have been just as many or more streams sold in Inverclyde and how many season ticket holders tuned in?

With Kirkcaldy (50k), Glenrothes (40k) and all the other wee places between Aberdour, Cardenden, Markinch and the Coaltown of Wemyss the Rovers catchment area has to be close on 120-130k, it's piss poor that for a core home support we cannot harness even 2%, even more so given the quality and standard of football we are currently enjoying.

I spoke to a lapsed fan today who admitted that despite The Rovers STILL being the 1st result he looks for, he hasn't been inside SP for years When asked why? He said they (he and 4 mates) just started going to the pub and watching the EPL game on a Saturday lunchtime instead and it just became the norm. I pointed out he could come to SP and watch the EPL in either the Raith Suite or 200 club and then go to the Rovers and pick up a 3rd game on Sky after the Rovers game.

Is football too expensive? personally I don't think £20 for an adult is too excessive but for a family day out for Dad, Mum, Jack (12yrs £8) & Jill (10yrs £5) it'd be £53 before they even buy a programme or pie (season tickets for them all would be (£675). In this neck of the woods I just don't think the money is there! Kirkcaldy has little of no industry and could even be described as an employment blackspot, that kind of cash is hard for folks to come by once in a blue moon never mind 2 times a month!  Fife Flyers family game pass at £49 is slightly cheaper but I suppose the product is quite different, best yo don't get me started that one.

I think up to 2 kids under 10 should be free if accompanied by a full paying adult, unacompanied kids below 16 yrs should be £7 (leave em enough for a pie!) Pensioners/students/Consessions £15. We need to grow the support. To do that we need to bring as many of the lapsed fans (there has to be a few 100) and we need to find new supporters. Both can be more easily achieved with a decent product at a decent price, we are heading in the right direction but maybe a few tweaks are needed here and there.

Another thing is get to them while they're young! An American Sporting franchise owner once said "Give a kid a team jersey when they are young and you've got them for life"  I don't think we do enough here on that score.

Kids top at £35 doesn’t help with the last part 

[TxRover]

4 hours ago, Scottydog said:

Main stand was built 1923? 

I would have thought the terraced houses would be up by then, I reckon Barnett Cres would maybe be 1930's

Well, the provided map shows Ramsey Road dead-ending by the school, while I know a great-grandparent lived at 53 Ramsey Road in 1911. That’s beyond the indicated extent of Ramsey Road, unless they renumbered. Barnet Crescent was then almost certainly no later than the 1930’s. I know the southern end of Pratt Street (now demolished) was earlier than the middle, near Starks Park...and looking at the homes by the park and stand, the materials are different/more modern, and they feature bay windows, while the whole of Ramsey Road and the other section of Pratt Street north of Starks Park are the older materials and feature flat fronts. It’s possible that the section of Pratt Street by Starks Park and Barnet Crescent are both post 1923, while the other areas are earlier.

[Scary Bear]

6 hours ago, RaithRover123 said:

Kids top at £35 doesn’t help with the last part 

True. During Lockdown 1 I bought my kids the smart home top from the Rovers league winning season @tazz1903 but that was only because they were £15 in the sale.