The New Raith Rovers Thread

[Rovers_Lad]

2 hours ago, Specky Ginger said:

I'm not sure it'll necessarily be the smaller clubs who'll be hardest hit. A lot, although not all, of the smaller clubs are generally quite prudently run. It could be the supposedly 'ambitious' clubs that are hit hardest as many of them have players on high wages and long term contracts. 

It was BC that said some of the smaller clubs would be struggling

[craigkillie]

2 hours ago, Rovers_Lad said:

So they can pay out but then they cant because theres a chance all the money is not there?

If they did pay out on respective positions now or soon thats an admittance surely the seasons finished/final positions,otherwise if ,although highly unlikely the season resumes some time later the league positions could change but they,ll already have paid out

They can pay out what they have, but they might not have all of the money for the reasons I mentioned. What I am suggesting is fairly straightforward - you decouple the prize money from the final standings and instead base it on the current standings, without that guaranteeing that the season is actually finished. It gives the clubs the income they need, without having to rush the decision on ending the season.

In other words, if the money is the only reason that clubs need a rushed decision, then just make a decision on the money and nothing else.

Of course, if the broadcasters/sponsors are withholding some money due to the season not yet being finished, then if we finish the season later on then that money could then be paid out based on the actual final positions as an extra bonus.

 

2 hours ago, Rovers_Lad said:

Regards the Cup Final.Ourselves and ICT are entitled to a sum of money for reaching the final irrespective of broadcasters and the two teams in the final is not going to change so that money could be paid now.Gate money is a seperate issue and aware that cant be forthcoming

 

It's not "irrespective of broadcasters (or sponsors)". Where do you think the prize money from the competition comes from?

 

2 hours ago, Rovers_Lad said:

There comes a time when the SFA/SPFL have to make a call.When do you think that should be?

We have at least another 4 months to get 8-10 games played, based on UEFA's recent suggestions, so they definitely don't need to do anything for the next while.

[Scottydog]

3 hours ago, craigkillie said:

We have at least another 4 months to get 8-10 games played, based on UEFA's recent suggestions, so they definitely don't need to do anything for the next while.

Do you honestly think that's  going to happen? (4 months to get past COVID-19, run a pre-season programme and then conclude the season) I think both you and UEFA are living on a different planet with that one!  Scottish  football will require at least 4-6 weeks to complete the fixture list, that would mean teams being back in training for the start of June.

UEFA are hoping league footballs going to be played in or before July, but take a look around you, summer events such as Glastonbury, Wimbledon, the European Championships and the Olympics have all been cancelled. That more than suggests to me that there will be no football played before the summer in this UK (and most of Europe) and probably not even until after July.....if we are lucky!

Delaying any decision would be absolutely the right thing to do if this were only a short term issue and the season were likely to be played out before the usual start date of next season, however that scenario is looking increasingly unlikely.

[CALDERON]

I cant believe anyone genuinely thinks that we are going to go from not being able to leave our house to completing 8 games in 4 months, especially when the UK is likely to see 1,000 people dieing a day soon. 

I don't think anyone needs UEFA to tell them that. Their timing guidelines are absolute fantasy. 

I would love games to start as soon as possible. I'd rather see us lose the league title that way, and experience the emotion of a title race, than win it by virtue of an administrative procedure. 

However, UEFA can come out with any date they want. The fact is this is a global emergency, and one which each of its individual member nations is dealing with differently and at a different stage. 

Delaying the end to this season delays the start to next, and then it all gets really messy.  In my opinion, the focus should be how to we rectify this season, structure next with as little disruption as possible and most importantly keep clubs alive. 

I hate the idea of null and void, for obvious reasons, but I'd rather a decisive message to null and void rather than some half baked let's wait and see approach. Clubs need some kind of clarity, or at least they will do very soon.  And I don't think it's as simple as giving some prize money to keep things going whilst the rest is sorted out. Season tickets, contracts etc all depend on some basic idea over who plays in what league next season. 

Raith Rovers, for example, would likely need to go very much towards a part time setup if that were the case. I'm fine with that if it means I still have a club to watch, however even that requires some clarity sooner than later. 

Football obviously is put into comparison when we see the news. Health and family come first. However this will end at some point, and life will edge towards some kind of normality again. If we want to have football to enjoy the way we are used to when this is over, we need decisive decisions pretty soon. And waiting for UEFA or even going by their guidelines won't give us that.

 

 

Edited April 5, 2020 by CALDERON

[foreverarover]

On 04/04/2020 at 17:47, Frank conner said:

On 04/04/2020 at 17:42, renton said:

A quick google suggests that while the league and Scottish Cup were suspended, unofficial regional leagues took their places for those years.  Obviously teams were depleted by a number of men going off to fight, but others in protected industries (coal mining and ship building, for example) kept the teams going. Appearances in those regional leagues didnt count towards players official appearances, but it does mean that clubs received some income and didnt just go into deep freeze for the duration.

We still have the 5k a month from the players fund and I cant see John Sim just writing off the 800k the club owes him.

Frank in with you on this one. It's s first I know lol. We have until 6th June to pay staff and that is not including the government scheme. With 9 players as the chairman was saying after then two of who are apprentices we really aren't in the worst predicament. £50k from crowd funds £4k pm from other scheme and the ticket scheme that's running. Has the chairman stated yet that sponsors both on shirts and on touchlines are willing to pay in full. There was 8 games left to play, that's 4 home matches. Each probably getting around 1700 in crowds take away 1000 season ticket holders . Split the adult and concessions prices , factor in food and programmes but taking off staffing byway of stewards can't be much over say 15k per match . So we are losing around 60k. If we are so fucked with that scenario then let's just go part time and pay off debt.  The factoring of prize funding comes in but if I were a chairman I'd be looking at budgeting to prize money of being  in top 4 and not reliant on anything more . 

Edited April 5, 2020 by foreverarover

[Rovers_Lad]

5 hours ago, CALDERON said:

I cant believe anyone genuinely thinks that we are going to go from not being able to leave our house to completing 8 games in 4 months, especially when the UK is likely to see 1,000 people dieing a day soon. 

I don't think anyone needs UEFA to tell them that. Their timing guidelines are absolute fantasy. 

I would love games to start as soon as possible. I'd rather see us lose the league title that way, and experience the emotion of a title race, than win it by virtue of an administrative procedure. 

However, UEFA can come out with any date they want. The fact is this is a global emergency, and one which each of its individual member nations is dealing with differently and at a different stage. 

Delaying the end to this season delays the start to next, and then it all gets really messy.  In my opinion, the focus should be how to we rectify this season, structure next with as little disruption as possible and most importantly keep clubs alive. 

I hate the idea of null and void, for obvious reasons, but I'd rather a decisive message to null and void rather than some half baked let's wait and see approach. Clubs need some kind of clarity, or at least they will do very soon.  And I don't think it's as simple as giving some prize money to keep things going whilst the rest is sorted out. Season tickets, contracts etc all depend on some basic idea over who plays in what league next season. 

Raith Rovers, for example, would likely need to go very much towards a part time setup if that were the case. I'm fine with that if it means I still have a club to watch, however even that requires some clarity sooner than later. 

Football obviously is put into comparison when we see the news. Health and family come first. However this will end at some point, and life will edge towards some kind of normality again. If we want to have football to enjoy the way we are used to when this is over, we need decisive decisions pretty soon. And waiting for UEFA or even going by their guidelines won't give us that.

 

 

This

[pantene proV]

Not for me. I'd rather the administrative procedure if it meant staying full time and seeing Hendry, Vaughan etc playing for us in front of decent crowds, than having the rug pulled from under us through no fault of our own. Yes theres more to life than football but I'd still be raging if we had to stay down and go part time. 

I agree with you that we're not seeing football till August - that is becoming clearer with every day's health update - so the beaks need to be decisive and reward teams at the top whilst not punishing teams at the bottom.  

I hope this break means they are busy prepping to reorganize the leagues but my head says not a chance. 

[Michael W]

Declaring the season null and void is essentially saying the games played are less important than the ones that haven't yet been played. It should be the ultimate last resort.. As it is, I suspect that the games will be played behind closed doors initially when football does actually resume, whether that is the next season or a continuation of the current one. 

We do however need a plan to avert a fixture pile up if we are to play the end of the current season and start the next one. 

[true_rover]

Declaring the season null and void is essentially saying the games played are less important than the ones that haven't yet been played. It should be the ultimate last resort.. As it is, I suspect that the games will be played behind closed doors initially when football does actually resume, whether that is the next season or a continuation of the current one. 
We do however need a plan to avert a fixture pile up if we are to play the end of the current season and start the next one. 

That's the bit I don't get with extending this season - all it ends up doing is messing up next season as well, particularly given there will be no scope to extend next season with the Euros being played in Glasgow.

[fifer67]

Correct me if I’m wrong, but with the majority of players contracts up in late May and all loan players heading back to their parent clubs, playing the last 8 games of the current season after late May would mean most teams wouldn’t have enough signed players to form a 5 a side team. So would you play the last 8 games let’s say for arguments sake at beginning of August with completely different squads. Can’t really see any way out this sad sorry mess other than promoting top 2 and no relegation . 

[pantene proV]

Precisely.

Any football in August will be the new season's football. 

[kev23]

Correct me if I’m wrong, but with the majority of players contracts up in late May and all loan players heading back to their parent clubs, playing the last 8 games of the current season after late May would mean most teams wouldn’t have enough signed players to form a 5 a side team. So would you play the last 8 games let’s say for arguments sake at beginning of August with completely different squads. Can’t really see any way out this sad sorry mess other than promoting top 2 and no relegation . 

If we went down the route of finishing the season first, you just don't allow players to move between clubs until the season is finished. Regardless, most clubs at our level won't be looking at signing players until they know what division they'll be in the following season. You may find a few would sign pre contracts elsewhere but that's nothing new.

I really doubt anyone in our squad would rather sit at home not getting paid than playing the last 8 games with us.

[grumswall]

If we went down the route of finishing the season first, you just don't allow players to move between clubs until the season is finished. Regardless most clubs at our level won't be looking at signing players until they know what division they'll be in the following season. You may find a few would sign pre contracts elsewhere but that's nothing new.
I really doubt anyone in our squad would rather sit at home not getting paid than playing the last 8 games with us.

That would be an absolute legal nightmare. The players have contracts you can't tell them what to do when they run out. I doubt many of our squad would want to move unless it was to a team up a league etc but there's no gaurentees with that.

[craigkillie]

9 hours ago, CALDERON said:

I cant believe anyone genuinely thinks that we are going to go from not being able to leave our house to completing 8 games in 4 months, especially when the UK is likely to see 1,000 people dieing a day soon. 

I don't think anyone needs UEFA to tell them that. Their timing guidelines are absolute fantasy. 

I would love games to start as soon as possible. I'd rather see us lose the league title that way, and experience the emotion of a title race, than win it by virtue of an administrative procedure. 

However, UEFA can come out with any date they want. The fact is this is a global emergency, and one which each of its individual member nations is dealing with differently and at a different stage. 

Delaying the end to this season delays the start to next, and then it all gets really messy.  In my opinion, the focus should be how to we rectify this season, structure next with as little disruption as possible and most importantly keep clubs alive. 

I hate the idea of null and void, for obvious reasons, but I'd rather a decisive message to null and void rather than some half baked let's wait and see approach. Clubs need some kind of clarity, or at least they will do very soon.  And I don't think it's as simple as giving some prize money to keep things going whilst the rest is sorted out. Season tickets, contracts etc all depend on some basic idea over who plays in what league next season. 

Raith Rovers, for example, would likely need to go very much towards a part time setup if that were the case. I'm fine with that if it means I still have a club to watch, however even that requires some clarity sooner than later. 

Football obviously is put into comparison when we see the news. Health and family come first. However this will end at some point, and life will edge towards some kind of normality again. If we want to have football to enjoy the way we are used to when this is over, we need decisive decisions pretty soon. And waiting for UEFA or even going by their guidelines won't give us that.

 

 

You've just said that you don't think we'll be ready to play again in 4 months - next season starts in just over 3. So by that logic we'll need to delay the start to next season anyway. It's better to set up next season's structure once we know how long we have to play it.

[Scottydog]

[Rovers_Lad]

3 hours ago, fifer67 said:

Correct me if I’m wrong, but with the majority of players contracts up in late May and all loan players heading back to their parent clubs, playing the last 8 games of the current season after late May would mean most teams wouldn’t have enough signed players to form a 5 a side team. So would you play the last 8 games let’s say for arguments sake at beginning of August with completely different squads. Can’t really see any way out this sad sorry mess other than promoting top 2 and no relegation . 

Sure Bill Clark said players were contracted until June 10ish ,but makes not difference to your point as nobody will be kicking a baw by then anyway

[CALDERON]

1 hour ago, craigkillie said:

You've just said that you don't think we'll be ready to play again in 4 months - next season starts in just over 3. So by that logic we'll need to delay the start to next season anyway. It's better to set up next season's structure once we know how long we have to play it.

My point was more that its  much better to delay just one season without worrying about this one. At least gives a fighting chance of somehow getting through next season.  Which will be tough enough. 

Don't think an exact time line is needed to get the basic structure of the leagues next season determined. 

[kev23]

That would be an absolute legal nightmare. The players have contracts you can't tell them what to do when they run out. I doubt many of our squad would want to move unless it was to a team up a league etc but there's no gaurentees with that.

You wouldn't be telling them what to do? You move the transfer window. You don't allow player movement until the season is officially finished. You allow clubs to offer current players 4/6/8 weeks deals on the same terms to finish the season. If players don't commit and would rather stay at home until the following 'season' then there isn't much you can do. You're not forcing anyone to do anything.

[grumswall]

 

 

 

You wouldn't be telling them what to do? You move the transfer window. You don't allow player movement until the season is officially finished. You allow clubs to offer current players 4/6/8 weeks deals on the same terms to finish the season. If players don't commit and would rather stay at home until the following 'season' then there isn't much you can do. You're not forcing anyone to do anything.

 

Lawyers would have a field day with that (not allowing player movement). I get your point though. I think Windows will need to be extended rather than moved with this though. I don't think there's anything stopping clubs currently offering players that length of deal. I know we've had a few in on similar deals on the past.

 

[Beachbum]

For anyone needing to contact Stark's Park during the lockdown revised contact details have been issued by the club.

http://www.raithrovers.net/43919/contact-details-during-coronavirus-lockdown.htm