The New Raith Rovers Thread

[GhostZapper]

I understood that the club did have the north stand side section as a contingency plan, if it was needed, which it was, but only just - as folk have pointed out earlier, there were areas of individual seats but folk simply refused to sit in them because they wanted to stand with their mates, and instead stood/sat on the stairs. Not sure what they expected, coming in 5 mins before kick off at what was known was going to be a busy game. What didn't help either was folk who must have known they were standing or sitting at someone's season ticket seat - I saw 2 separate situations where the ST holder came in around 10 to 3, and moved folk on, who then stood complaining in the stairway that they couldn't see a group of seats together big enough for their group (which looked like 5 or 6) - They then clambered down a full row trying to find seats together.

Surely however, as folk had pointed out, X number of seats - X number of season tickets = the maximum number of cash pay ins that should be allowed into the south stand.

Not sure how folk ended up in the railway stand - there would have been no open turnstiles to pay in at, so I assumed folk took it upon themselves to dive into this stand to avoid paying and because game had started - then were moved on by the police who directed them to pay in at the back of the North stand - didn't look like more than 100/150 folk, but still the club should learn lessons from it. Is all ticket the solution? maybe not - maybe just monitor numbers more closely, and have a section open in the north stand to spread out the crowd.

[Beachbum]

My understanding was that they had already paid to get in (to the South Stand) and were removed from there and placed, eventually, in the North Stand.

[RR #1]

5 minutes ago, GhostZapper said:

I understood that the club did have the north stand side section as a contingency plan, if it was needed, which it was, but only just - as folk have pointed out earlier, there were areas of individual seats but folk simply refused to sit in them because they wanted to stand with their mates, and instead stood/sat on the stairs. Not sure what they expected, coming in 5 mins before kick off at what was known was going to be a busy game. What didn't help either was folk who must have known they were standing or sitting at someone's season ticket seat - I saw 2 separate situations where the ST holder came in around 10 to 3, and moved folk on, who then stood complaining in the stairway that they couldn't see a group of seats together big enough for their group (which looked like 5 or 6) - They then clambered down a full row trying to find seats together.

Surely however, as folk had pointed out, X number of seats - X number of season tickets = the maximum number of cash pay ins that should be allowed into the south stand.

Not sure how folk ended up in the railway stand - there would have been no open turnstiles to pay in at, so I assumed folk took it upon themselves to dive into this stand to avoid paying and because game had started - then were moved on by the police who directed them to pay in at the back of the North stand - didn't look like more than 100/150 folk, but still the club should learn lessons from it. Is all ticket the solution? maybe not - maybe just monitor numbers more closely, and have a section open in the north stand to spread out the crowd.

Sorry but that is mostly pish. 

Your assumption that people took it upon themselves to enter the railway stand is entirely wrong.  People were led there by stewards who had been told via radio to put us in there. 

So how was using the side section of North stand the contingency plan? Some of us didn't even get the chance to look for a seat in the South as the stairways were so crowded I couldn't even get in the stand. 

No Rovers fan paid to get in the North Stand and there was far more than 100 rovers fans in there. 

Arriving at 2.50 to see a football match that starts at 3 in a half full stadium seems perfectly reasonable to me. 

[SuperHans]

Sorry but that is mostly pish. 
Your assumption that people took it upon themselves to enter the railway stand is entirely wrong.  People were led there by stewards who had been told via radio to put us in there. 
So how was using the side section of North stand the contingency plan? Some of us didn't even get the chance to look for a seat in the South as the stairways were so crowded I couldn't even get in the stand. 
No Rovers fan paid to get in the North Stand and there was far more than 100 rovers fans in there. 
Arriving at 2.50 to see a football match that starts at 3 in a half full stadium seems perfectly reasonable to me. 

In fairness of both sides, the club had sent out statements during the week that tickets were available and it was advised to arrive early. It was said to be the largest home attendance in 10 years so not a lot of experience in this area.

The fact that there were still seats in the home end is irrelevant if it is deemed that there is a safety issue and it sounds like there could have been. The stewards have tried to move a large group of people which is never easy at the best of time. Whether they were told to go to the Railway stand or not doesn't really matter. The main thing is that no one was injured, the safety issue had been resolved, everyone got a seat and the club will have likely learned a lesson from the whole thing.

I think under the circumstances of the week building up to the game on Saturday caught the club off guard and that's why things were a little bit disorganised. However, with the people we have in charge of the club already running a pretty dysfunctional and unorganised football club, it doesn't take much to make the situation a lot worse.

The BoD are under serious pressure now and every mistake is highlighted even more so because of it. The problem is that they're not dealing with that pressure very well which emphasises their lack of competence to the supporters.

[SuperHans]

**Side note: if the 'fans representative' is meant to be the link between the supporters and the BoD, then if it is requested to have a message put to the BoD, could we request a suggestion? Is there a forum for the fans to have questions or points raised with the BoD? If so could it be requested with enough support that a vote of no confidence be put towards the current chairman and directors?

[GhostZapper]

22 minutes ago, RR #1 said:

Sorry but that is mostly pish. 

Your assumption that people took it upon themselves to enter the railway stand is entirely wrong.  People were led there by stewards who had been told via radio to put us in there. 

So how was using the side section of North stand the contingency plan? Some of us didn't even get the chance to look for a seat in the South as the stairways were so crowded I couldn't even get in the stand. 

No Rovers fan paid to get in the North Stand and there was far more than 100 rovers fans in there. 

Arriving at 2.50 to see a football match that starts at 3 in a half full stadium seems perfectly reasonable to me. 

Not sure how you can state it was mostly pish - you clearly say you didn't even get in to the South stand.

I assumed that was the case when I was standing at the game on Saturday, given the rush of people we could see running around the back, and based on how quickly the police/security staff moved folk on. It was a known fact that the Railway stand doesn't have a safety cert so nobody should be directing anyone in there. The area at the railway side was clearly marked off with some form of segregation, and the club had said on Friday that there was a contingency plan in place - that was where that assumption came from.

The fact remains that there were seats available - not many - but there were, in the South Stand. Like i say, we had folk standing in the stairwells up the back who point blank refused to move to individual seats pointed out by security, because they wanted 3 together, or wanted 2 together cos the guy had his kid.  Security should have been more strict in moving people away from the stair entrances, and off the aisles. That itself was equally as dangerous.

However, on your last point - Assume you didn't expect it to be that busy given you rocked up at 2.50? Assume you didn't check which ends would be open? The club clearly stated that 1. North stand was for Alloa fans, and 2. The game would defo kick off at 3. You are honestly saying you weren't aware of either?  

Anyone rocking up 5 mins before kick off on Saturday left themselves open to not getting in! However, like i say, lessons defo could be learnt to avoid the similar situation happening.

 

 

 

[Raithie]

 

15 minutes ago, Beachbum said:

My understanding was that they had already paid to get in (to the South Stand) and were removed from there and placed, eventually, in the North Stand.

That was my understanding as well. We were sitting right next to the exit at the far left hand side and the people crowding on the stairways were basically in our laps at one point. The stewards were also roaring at people to move up the rows and fill up all available space to make more room rather than have several seats empty in between groups of people. Couple of people refused due to being in their season ticket seat so there were a  couple of stand offs with stewards before the stewards shrugged their shoulders not knowing what to do next. Eventually the people standing on the stairways dispersed and could see the railway side filling up so can only assume it was people without a seat in the south stand and the people still waiting outside being moved there before being further moved on to the north stand. 

 

[GhostZapper]

22 minutes ago, SuperHans said:

**Side note: if the 'fans representative' is meant to be the link between the supporters and the BoD, then if it is requested to have a message put to the BoD, could we request a suggestion? Is there a forum for the fans to have questions or points raised with the BoD? If so could it be requested with enough support that a vote of no confidence be put towards the current chairman and directors?

On that topic, I've never seen any way in which the fans can raise points with, or contact the fans rep.

A vote of no confidence would need to come from a majority to push that through - and given Mr Sims is the majority owner, that aint gonna happen

[RR #1]

1 minute ago, GhostZapper said:

Not sure how you can state it was mostly pish - you clearly say you didn't even get in to the South stand.

I assumed that was the case when I was standing at the game on Saturday, given the rush of people we could see running around the back, and based on how quickly the police/security staff moved folk on. It was a known fact that the Railway stand doesn't have a safety cert so nobody should be directing anyone in there. The area at the railway side was clearly marked off with some form of segregation, and the club had said on Friday that there was a contingency plan in place - that was where that assumption came from.

The fact remains that there were seats available - not many - but there were, in the South Stand. Like i say, we had folk standing in the stairwells up the back who point blank refused to move to individual seats pointed out by security, because they wanted 3 together, or wanted 2 together cos the guy had his kid.  Security should have been more strict in moving people away from the stair entrances, and off the aisles. That itself was equally as dangerous.

However, on your last point - Assume you didn't expect it to be that busy given you rocked up at 2.50? Assume you didn't check which ends would be open? The club clearly stated that 1. North stand was for Alloa fans, and 2. The game would defo kick off at 3. You are honestly saying you weren't aware of either?  

Anyone rocking up 5 mins before kick off on Saturday left themselves open to not getting in! However, like i say, lessons defo could be learnt to avoid the similar situation happening.

 

 

 

You are correct that no one should have been directed to the railway stand but we were. The big gates at the back of the railway stand were opened and we were led round there by a steward who had received instruction on his radio. About ten minutes later the same steward who put us in the railway stand starts shouting and roaring at us to get into the North right away  or he'll be phoning the police. 

Is 4.5k really even that big a crowd? Should have been a far easier game to organise and police  than say a derby match v the pars when you've got 3k away fans. I didn't forsee any problems getting in as the stadium holds far more people than we have supporters. 

I was at work around 50 miles from Starks Park and got away early at 130pm to make the game on Saturday. I never had the option of arriving earlier than I did.  If I knew I was going to miss half the match I wouldn't have bothered making the effort. 

 

[SuperHans]

On that topic, I've never seen any way in which the fans can raise points with, or contact the fans rep.
A vote of no confidence would need to come from a majority to push that through - and given Mr Sims is the majority owner, that aint gonna happen

Fair point. Just interesting that now there is an application for the next representative to see what the roles and responsibilities are and if the last guys have actually served a real purpose or just been there for a social status.

Well to be honest, I'm not sure how much confidence there is for the current set up at this moment in time. I'm sure the failings of the BoD have been noticed by Sim. What with him coming into the club as the season was just starting I wouldn't imagine sweeping changes were going to be made throughout a busy season ahead.

Sim has brought his own guys in though, so if the point was raised by the fans rep and had the agreement of Sinton and Clark then I'd imagine it would be enough to make Sims mind up for him.

**Please note that I'm not suggesting that this is the way forward**

**Please also note that as I'm supposed to be Eric Drysdale in disguise, this isn't me trying to wiggle my way back into the club.**

[roverthemoon]

4 minutes ago, RR #1 said:

You are correct that no one should have been directed to the railway stand but we were. The big gates at the back of the railway stand were opened and we were led round there by a steward who had received instruction on his radio. About ten minutes later the same steward who put us in the railway stand starts shouting and roaring at us to get into the North right away  or he'll be phoning the police. 

Is 4.5k really even that big a crowd? Should have been a far easier game to organise and police  than say a derby match v the pars when you've got 3k away fans. I didn't forsee any problems getting in as the stadium holds far more people than we have supporters. 

I was at work around 50 miles from Starks Park and got away early at 130pm to make the game on Saturday. I never had the option of arriving earlier than I did.  If I knew I was going to miss half the match I wouldn't have bothered making the effort. 

 

Miss half the match? Did you only got in in your seat just before  half time?  The movement of fans seemed to stop around the 15 minute mark 

[RR #1]

5 minutes ago, roverthemoon said:

Miss half the match? Did you only got in in your seat just before  half time?  The movement of fans seemed to stop around the 15 minute mark 

That was an exaggeration but it was half 3 until I got a seat in the North stand. 

[SuperHans]

That was an exaggeration but it was half 3 until I got a seat in the North stand. 

Imagine if you'd missed a goal!

[Ro Sham Bo]

I turned up before 2.45 and didn't get in til near on 3.10.

Two of the turnstile gates weren't even open.

[Scottydog]

1 hour ago, Ro Sham Bo said:

I turned up before 2.45 and didn't get in til near on 3.10.

Two of the turnstile gates weren't even open.

At least one of them is broken.

I'd complain directly to John Simm and the board.

Talking about spending 100 of thousands on a plastic pitch and the rest of the place is slowly falling to bits.

Edited May 1, 2018 by Scottydog

[SuperHans]

At least on of them is broken.
I'd complain directly to John Simm and the board.
Talking about spending 100 of thousands on a plastic pitch and the rest of the place is slowly falling to bits.

Have these turnstiles ever really been needed before last Saturday? Do you think bombarding the man who's a new owner of our club and spending his own money on the club is a good idea considering that he now owns a team that's potentially going part-time and in the process of replacing their playing surface?

I don't see what the big issue is here over what happened. The SFA couldn't even handle the Scotland fans at Celtic Park getting in on time. The club put an announcement out well in advance warning fans of the expected large crowds and there was the option of buying tickets in advance. Do you think this is going to suddenly become a weekly occurrence? I knew the potential of the crowd being larger and arrived with plenty of time to get in and a seat. The BoD are at fault for plenty of things this season but now we're just pointing the fingers for the sake of it.

I think the BoD should be sacked because my pie wasn't hot enough. I even booed at the catering staff!

[macatto]

My understanding was that they had already paid to get in (to the South Stand) and were removed from there and placed, eventually, in the North Stand.

I was one of the few who was stuck at the side of the South stand, moved into railway stand, then moved into north stand. Found a nice wee quiet corner in the sun and this view.

[Beachbum]

5 minutes ago, SuperHans said:

Do you think bombarding the man who's a new owner of our club and spending his own money on the club is a good idea considering that he now owns a team that's potentially going part-time and in the process of replacing their playing surface?

 

We are potentially going part time because we sold Ross Callachan last August. Whose decision was that? 

[Scottydog]

16 minutes ago, SuperHans said:

 

Have these turnstiles ever really been needed before last Saturday? Do you think bombarding the man who's a new owner of our club and spending his own money on the club is a good idea considering that he now owns a team that's potentially going part-time and in the process of replacing their playing surface?

I don't see what the big issue is here over what happened. The SFA couldn't even handle the Scotland fans at Celtic Park getting in on time. The club put an announcement out well in advance warning fans of the expected large crowds and there was the option of buying tickets in advance. Do you think this is going to suddenly become a weekly occurrence? I knew the potential of the crowd being larger and arrived with plenty of time to get in and a seat. The BoD are at fault for plenty of things this season but now we're just pointing the fingers for the sake of it.

I think the BoD should be sacked because my pie wasn't hot enough. I even booed at the catering staff!

 

You clearly mist the gist of my post.

For the record I believe the board to be hugely incompetent on several levels but just to be crystal clear, the installation of a plastic pitch just about trumps them all.

[SuperHans]

We are potentially going part time because we sold Ross Callachan last August. Whose decision was that? 

[emoji23][emoji23] we lost the league title on the final day of the season because we sold Callachan? Vaughan hit the post in the 92nd minute because we sold Ross Callachan? When Callachan was sold everyone was amazed rather than disappointed. I'm pretty sure you were one of the Vaughan fanboys who pinned all our hopes of promotion on his wee shoulders and now the reason we didn't go up was because we sold Callachan? Come on, get a grip.

An offer came in for a player and we took the money. Smith would have likely had a small say on the matter regarding how valuable he would be to his squad but with Matthews, Robertson, Barr and then his idea of a replacement, he obviously felt he could strengthen a bit more and free up some cash for the club.

We've not even kicked a ball in the playoffs and already you've got us part-time and found the most tenuous reasoning behind it. Great stuff.