NorthBank Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 By not paying your debts you are effectively stealing. Clubs that get themselves into that mess should go under like any other business. I am sorry for supporters but you cannot continually cheat all your life and get away with it. Livi did it once. No second chance. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom McB Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Code: 'Insert code box' is easy enough, but the type in it is too wee, so I couldnae' be ersed... How's the Love Street end stand looking by the way? Still just a pile of steel rusting away, with no funds to even erect it yet? The redevelopment's coming along fine thank you. When it's done we'll still have a proper fitba grun. Unlike the legoland mess that has replaced love street. B) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AND180Y Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Can I just repeat again for the cerebrally challenged in the Livi Support that my username is the registration of my first car not my name. Perhaps if they had spent as much time raising funds for their trust as they have challenging folks for having an opinion then they might not be in the mess they are!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbers Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 (edited) Crikey and180y, that makes you kinda old, very old does it not. Edited July 30, 2009 by Numbers 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pozbaird Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 (edited) The redevelopment's coming along fine thank you.When it's done we'll still have a proper fitba grun. Unlike the legoland mess that has replaced love street. B) Good stuff. Get the stadium sorted, then get your sorry ass into the SPL, so we can hump you in a meaningful situation instead of just the pre-season friendly that is the Renfrewshire Cup. Four in a row.....and counting. Edited July 30, 2009 by pozbaird 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivo den Bieman Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Why should they? I'm pretty sure West Lothian Council own premises that are rented out to businesses. I worked in Hamilton, in a South Lanarkshire Council Business Park, and my boss rented two units there. When the business got into trouble, firstly we weren't allowed to rack up unpaid rent debts, and secondly, we weren't allowed to rack up unpaid debts to the Inland Revnue. Thirdly, the Council didn't come knocking on our door offering a two-thirds rent reduction....Fcuking Livingston have been dreadfully mis-managed for far too long. They have already been in administration for fcuk sake, and are currently being run by a complete cnut. Football clubs do indeed have an 'emotional' attatchment to them, but this fcuking mob have a 14 year history FFS - and have proved to be about as adept at running a manageable business as I would be flying the space shuttle.... Bullet. Eyes. Now. Agree with this 100% but I doubt it will happen given the SFL's sympathetic noises in today's paper. Further, as Duncan Freemason pointed out yesterday, McGruther has been made to look like an idiot by giving it the hardman-final deadline-or-else act, only to then admit that yesterday's final deadline was nothing of the sort. If, as seems likely, Massone refuses to sell, then he might ask for more time and/or a rule change. Neither plea should be considered for more than 30 seconds. Plus, I'm guessing that McGruther doesn't have that much more time anyway before his administrators start running up a fee they're unlikely to see back from the liquidation process. This circus has been allowed to go on chaotically for far too long. Sorry, but there are twenty nine other SFL clubs to think of and we'd quite like to know how our seasons are going to look. Time for the SFL to show a bit of backbone and get rid of these chancers once and for all. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbo Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Can I just repeat again for the cerebrally challenged in the Livi Support that my username is the registration of my first car not my name. Oh come on Andy. Did your mammy buy you the registration plate for passing your test. You're sussed. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AND180Y Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Crikey and180y, that makes you kinda old, very old does it not. To be fair it was 15 years old. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbers Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 B) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AND180Y Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Oh come on Andy. Did your mammy buy you the registration plate for passing your test. You're sussed. Oh but for the chance to have known her or her have had the opportunity to buy me something. I never knew who she was, smartass!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jester Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdTheDuck Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 No-one at Livingston has pissed me off, but I agree with him - I look at clubs like East Fife and Dumbarton who have built decent stands, and are running title winning operations on a budget they can sustain - and if they got in trouble, I'd certainly help out with a pound or two in a supporters' collection bucket. Clubs like Gretna and Livingston deserve(d) all the bile that is spouted in their direction.... Is there enough sand in the world for Massone to bury his head in by the way? 100% agree with this. and it applies to the SPL as well, as those clubs that are technically insolvent should have been relegated or had points deducted or have some kind of punishment meted out years ago when it was clear they were living beyond their means to prevent them becoming insolvent. It's cheating, plain and simple, spending money you don't have to try and gain an advantage on the park. i doubt if livingston will be the last one we see going to knackers yard over the next few years. I hope for the fans, few though they may be, that the club can survive only this time with someone in charge who isn't an ego-maniac or uhu addict. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivo den Bieman Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 I'd actually prefer to see Livi survive for a number of reasons, but what flexibility do the league have? Are Livingston able to show that they'll have a squad and a compliant ground?Stuart as to flexibility, well, they could agree a rule change, but I'm sure they couldn't just do that on the hoof without consulting other clubs. The trouble with Livingston is not the squad (they still have players) or the ground (WLC will ensure it has a safety certificate in time), but that they are insolvent. Trading whilst insolvent is illegal. A club's membership comes under threat if it enters administration; under the current rules, liquidation, which will be the outcome unless Massone transfers the shares, means automatic expulsion. There has been a tremendous lack of will from political and footballing authorities to force a reckoning here. That lack of will gives Livingston hope when there should be none. If the expulsion does go through, it will be because they have run out of time, and its simply too close to the beginning of the league season to allow them any more of it. If liquidation/expulsion does happen, the SFL will say "we gave them every chance" and not even entertain any notion of their culpability in the shambles. McGruther and WLC will blame Massone, with McGruther possibly also offering mild criticism of the inflexibility of the SFL's rules. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest penelope pitstop Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 (edited) Don't really give a shit what you think, to be honest. There was a thread on Liviloins last night with a few of the posters saying much the same as the one I quoted above. The thread has now been deleted by the Nazis in charge. Free speech not welcome over there ?The "Trust" are not innocent in all of this. They pursued an agenda and the result is the club might disappear. Their council lacky Peter Johnstone has gone awfully quiet now. So who wrote the post you quoted above - was it you by some chance? I see you are getting a tad touchy now - presumably you will lose a source of income without all those photos of Livi to sell. As a Livi "supporter" I wonder what you consider the right course of action should have been that would have not meant the club (possibly) going out of business - bearing in mind that the administrator has said that the club is hopelessly insolvent. Edited July 30, 2009 by penelope pitstop 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbers Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 I assume PP that you are one of those who support livi being saved. Tell us all honestly how you can be so self centred in so much that you believe in to hell with the creditors, just so long as we survive. There is a huge moral issue here too and i hope you and all your supporters can live with yourselves. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdinburghPar1975 Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 has anyone heard if there has been any communications between McGruther and Don Massone? Given that the SFL meeting is only a couple of hours away I would have thought that to stand any chance of Livi being around McGruther would have to be able to tell them that the shares have now transfered. FWIW I don't think it will help as I can't see how he's going to be able to convince them that Livi can GAURANTEE to fulfill there fixtures...i think times run out... The SFL will finally be forced to act (can I just cover myself by saying that I also wouldn't be surprised to see a combination of fixture movement and rule changes to try and help)...mind you I also wouldn't be surprised to see the meeting 'postponed' for 24 hours! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcoxk76 Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 welcome airdrie to the 1st devision bye bye livi livi and gretna never be forgotten R.I.P 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbo Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 I assume PP that you are one of those who support livi being saved.Tell us all honestly how you can be so self centred in so much that you believe in to hell with the creditors, just so long as we survive. There is a huge moral issue here too and i hope you and all your supporters can live with yourselves. PP is not a Livi fan. Shei s an English lawyer who has taken an interest in the whole thing for some reason or other. She also posts on livilions as watcher. You do realise that if Livi fold tomorrow the creditors will get nothing. if Massone sells (unlikely) and the new group take over they will have to give a guarantee that there will be a creditor settlement. So basically Livi survive creditors are paid. Livi fold zilch. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livi 293 Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 So, as far as I can see, the only way LFC could survive now, bar Massone doing a u-turn, is if the new perspective owner(s) paid off all the creditors in full, thus making the company solvent, and, therefore, allowing - within the SFL rules - a transfer of the assets/membership to a new company? I think we may as well say game over. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbers Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Yes they will. A CVA of around 2/25 pence in the pound. How many innocent workers from creditor firms could possibly lose there jobs because of this. How many small businesses or one man businesses could this finish. Dont sit on the immoral high ground here. This is the second time livi have affected peoples lives, and in simple terms, they should not be allowed to survive. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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