Livingston - all the threads merged

[ATLIS]

Shinnie at 31 was on that side of things too. 

It's worked in the past, when you look at Alexander. It's up and down but he has a connection to the club so maybe feels a duty to us as his first club

Edited April 11, 2023 by ATLIS

[LIVIFOREVER]

1 hour ago, FreedomFarter said:

I really wanted Dorrans to return to us after he was released by Rangers and was disappointed when he didn't. His subsequent spells at Dundee and Dunfermline were both underwhelming, though. Maybe a cautionary tale there regarding Snoddy. 

The last "old" player we signed was Bartley but he still had full athletic capacity and his performances were a cut above, justifying his higher salary.

Think Snoddy was a late bloomer compared to Dorrans, and has lasted longer at a higher level, still looked class at Hearts. Would improve our corners and free kicks a hell of a lot too.

[The Wrong Car]

Haven't his performances been fairly poor since the World Cup? His red card at the weekend seemed like a player who isn't able to move around the pitch as much. I'd rather keep the Kelly's, Pittman and Holt as our main midfield options

[LIVIFOREVER]

3 hours ago, The Wrong Car said:

Haven't his performances been fairly poor since the World Cup? His red card at the weekend seemed like a player who isn't able to move around the pitch as much. I'd rather keep the Kelly's, Pittman and Holt as our main midfield options

Reading through the Jambo thread, Snoddy seems to be getting the blame for them being so shite since then, but i think they're grasping at straws hoping everything will now be hunky dory with him and Neilson away, and that's all their problems fixed. 

If Martindale could get an unfit JET to look good enough to get dosh from Aberdeen, and Brucie thrown into the deal, i'm pretty confident he would get the best out of Snoddy.

[The Wrong Car]

31 minutes ago, LIVIFOREVER said:

Reading through the Jambo thread, Snoddy seems to be getting the blame for them being so shite since then, but i think they're grasping at straws hoping everything will now be hunky dory with him and Neilson away, and that's all their problems fixed. 

If Martindale could get an unfit JET to look good enough to get dosh from Aberdeen, and Brucie thrown into the deal, i'm pretty confident he would get the best out of Snoddy.

The JET signing was more to do with Aberdeen’s stupidity under Glass rather than any great form

Signing Snodgrass would just impact on Stephen Kelly’s development or Holt’s role

[LIVIFOREVER]

11 minutes ago, The Wrong Car said:

The JET signing was more to do with Aberdeen’s stupidity under Glass rather than any great form

Signing Snodgrass would just impact on Stephen Kelly’s development or Holt’s role

He played well and scored goals against them, but in general his performances improved when he got his fitness up, and he was our best player going into our final 5 games.

I just see Snoddy as a massive upgrade on Shinnie, and don't think he'd impede anyone's development, in fact the experience he has could help Kelly's. Holt's a different type of player from Snoddy, again he's more comparable to Shinnie.

Edited April 12, 2023 by LIVIFOREVER

[The Wrong Car]

Shinnie's a backup option (who can play in a few positions), whereas Snodgrass is about to leave a club midseason due to issues with his playing time and form. It doesn't sound like he'll want to be a rotation option any time soon

[LIVIFOREVER]

I wouldn't compare what Shinnie has done with us on what Snoddy would though, Snoddy is a better player, and as such would feature more. Forrest is hardly getting games for them and he'd be a starter for us. Also wouldn't bother what Hearts fans are saying/speculating, on why he's leaving them, that's Hearts and Livi are a different ball game where our dressingroom and manager is concerned.

I'd love him signing for us just to have someone that can take a decent corner and free kick, we're absolutely hopeless at them. Anything else would be a bonus for me.

Edited April 12, 2023 by LIVIFOREVER

[Durnford]

1 hour ago, LIVIFOREVER said:

If Martindale could get an unfit JET to look good enough to get dosh from Aberdeen, and Brucie thrown into the deal, i'm pretty confident he would get the best out of Snoddy.

He wasn't so successful in getting Kouda Aisha or Goncalvez fit though?

TBH I'm not sure Snodgrass's issue is fitness at the moment; he's 35 years old and simply put he's slowing down; not able to turn or react as quickly as he could; that's not his fault; just life.

His real benefit at the moment is his ability with dead ball and set pieces; something we haven't really had consistently for a while.

With regard to Shinnie; he's undoubtedly a skilful player but running around in circles and achieving not very much isn't something we need at the moment.

[LIVIFOREVER]

1 minute ago, Durnford said:

He wasn't so successful in getting Kouda Aisha or Goncalvez fit though?

TBH I'm not sure Snodgrass's issue is fitness at the moment; he's 35 years old and simply put he's slowing down; not able to turn or react as quickly as he could; that's not his fault; just life.

His real benefit at the moment is his ability with dead ball and set pieces; something we haven't really had consistently for a while.

With regard to Shinnie; he's undoubtedly a skilful player but running around in circles and achieving not very much isn't something we need at the moment.

You have to have the talent there too though, both of them aren't up to it at this level, or in Kouda's case Championship either, he was a PT player that just couldn't step up fitness or skill wise to FT football at a higher level. Snoddy could walk about the place and still contribute more than those 2, which is pretty much what Goncalves tried to get away doing. 

 

Snoddy was never a quick player, but his speed of thought and being able to see a few steps ahead hasn't slowed down, he def could still do a job for us imo. 

[The Wrong Car]

10 minutes ago, LIVIFOREVER said:

I wouldn't compare what Shinnie has done with us on what Snoddy would though, Snoddy is a better player, and as such would feature more. Forrest is hardly getting games for them and he'd be a starter for us. Also wouldn't bother what Hearts fans are saying/speculating, on why he's leaving them, that's Hearts and Livi are a different ball game where our dressingroom and manager is concerned.

I'd love him signing for us just to have someone that can take a decent corner and free kick, we're absolutely hopeless at them. Anything else would be a bonus for me.

Both Kelly's seem decent at set plays, our issue seems to be that we don't have a Halkett/Guthrie to attack them

Understand your point about different clubs etc, however Holt has just signed a new deal and we paid money for Stephen Kelly. Before his injury Sean Kelly was probably our best midfielder. Accomodating a player that can't run doesn't seem  like a good move 

[LIVIFOREVER]

3 minutes ago, The Wrong Car said:

Both Kelly's seem decent at set plays, our issue seems to be that we don't have a Halkett/Guthrie to attack them

Understand your point about different clubs etc, however Holt has just signed a new deal and we paid money for Stephen Kelly. Before his injury Sean Kelly was probably our best midfielder. Accomodating a player that can't run doesn't seem  like a good move 

Corners in particular do my head in, the amount of times we don't get the ball past the first defender, yeah the odd time swinging a ball in from a free kick can be decent, mostly not though, and neither of them have taken a particularly good direct shot at goal, i thought Bradley might after scoring from one in the cup against Stenny, but that hasn't materialised playing in the league.

Shinnie can't run, how could replacing him with Snoddy be any worse, esp when you'd be replacing him with a better player. And i'm sure he'd have to earn the right to play, if he did then we wouldn't be accommodating anyone, nobody is a passenger for long in Martindale's team.

[The Wrong Car]

Shinnie is much more mobile that Snodgrass, who now hasn't spent more than a year at the club for three years. 

Martindale is good at maintaining control in a dressing room, and getting the best out of players, but it's not a record that needs tested every season. I'd rather target the Stephen Kelly's and Steven Bradley's of the world, than accomodate 1 player who we have to change a system for.  With Holt and Pittman in midfield it's not like we're lacking experience anyway

[Durnford]

35 minutes ago, LIVIFOREVER said:

Corners in particular do my head in, the amount of times we don't get the ball past the first defender, yeah the odd time swinging a ball in from a free kick can be decent, mostly not though, and neither of them have taken a particularly good direct shot at goal, i thought Bradley might after scoring from one in the cup against Stenny, but that hasn't materialised playing in the league.

Shinnie can't run, how could replacing him with Snoddy be any worse, esp when you'd be replacing him with a better player. And i'm sure he'd have to earn the right to play, if he did then we wouldn't be accommodating anyone, nobody is a passenger for long in Martindale's team.

The thing about our corners that really does my head in is when they go sailing past everyone (no-one on the far post) and likely as not end up as an opposition throw-in.

[LiviLion]

Shinnie is criminally underrated. The only way we should be bringing Snodgrass in is if it's with a coaching role; as a player/coach would give us a good bit of extra depth but I don't see any reason we should be finding money to bring him off the bench a few times.

[ATLIS]

The reason the Snodgrass deal would work is us needing midfielders with Omeonga and Shinnie leaving in the summer. We probably need to replace them with two of similar quality, Snodgrass falls into that. It's up to him if he wants to take a low wage and 'pay us back' for starting his career. 

[Durnford]

Apparently he's going back to England to be with his family so the whole thing is a bit academic

.

[Guest]

Snoddy bombed at Hearts. He was played in holding mid yet didn't defend or move much. It was similar to Charlie Adam at Dundee last season. His inclusion unbalanced the Hearts team and was a factor in their results downturn. Neilson was compelled to play him having been the one who signed him on a significant wage. Naismith has come in free of that burden and told Snoddy he wouldn't be playing.

That was Hearts, though, we're Livi and at a different level. Given his age he might just retire now but I'd definitely not be against Martindale making an offer to him again in the summer.

[EdinburghLivi]

I wonder if you could play him as an attacking midfielder coming inside from one of the wings as replacement for Nouble. I think that would be less damaging for a side like ours than sticking him in centre midfield and he probably still has enough ability to pull off that type of attacking role, regardless of his lack of pace. 

[LIVIFOREVER]

On 12/04/2023 at 14:53, Durnford said:

The thing about our corners that really does my head in is when they go sailing past everyone (no-one on the far post) and likely as not end up as an opposition throw-in.

Yeah Halkett was good at getting in at the far post, Guthrie was quite aggressive at set pieces too, was hoping de Lucas might fill that role now, but hasn't so far.