Livingston - all the threads merged

[Guest]

Anybody no what the final bill livi are going to have to pay for Donald McGruther services?

Figure on two grand a day plus expenses and third party involvement.

[AND180Y]

Please! I have much better taste than that!

*Strolls briskly past the lady waiting under the clock in the station, covering the white carnation with his newspaper.

[AND180Y]

Figure on two grand a day plus expenses and third party involvement.

Grand a day for a decent lawyer in court, plus outlays and preparation time.

[Guest]

Right this is going to be a long day for me, with a worse day to follow tomorrow.

Where has my angel of music gone?

Angel of music guide & guardian,

bring to me your glory,

Angel of music hide no longer

Come to me strange angel,

Duncan feel free to join in!

Boak.

Edited August 12, 2009 by Guest

[Guest]

Grand a day for a decent lawyer in court, plus outlays and preparation time.

A penny ha'penny consultant working for a recognized consultancy firm is well over a grand these days. A recognized experienced player in any given field will jack that figure up by a big chunk in daily rate terms. In the N Sea, body shops are charging £600 a day for technicians, and £900 a day for engineers.

There may well be a fixed term deal in place given that McGruther is supposedly around for 9 months. It would be interesting to know who is shelling out for this.

Of course, you have to remember that it is part of the debt avoidance strategy. His bill will be covered by not paying existing legitimate creditors. It is just awash with the new found Livvy morality, isn't it.

Edited August 12, 2009 by Guest

[Guest]

And there we have it.

McGruther (or a counsel acting on his behalf) has said in a court of law that the appeal is being made at the actual meeting.

So Livingston don't have a proverbial leg to stand on with respect to the scratching of the fixture.

Correctamundo. One big .45 magnum shell duly discharged into the right foot. They have as yet made no appeal. They are therefore, a 3rd division side seeking to be returned to the 1st division. Their way of going about this was as a 3rd division side to turn round and tell the governing body that they would not play another 3rd division side. Not the most convincing of arguments.

They have effectively told their governing body that they will not adhere to their decision to the point where they wish to appoint a solicitor to represent them. Why would they seek legal represntation against a governing body (the SFL) whose authority they have refused to acknowledge? Kick them out. Nothing has changed, and nothing ever will change. This is one soiled football club that should be shown the exit door tomorrow.

Edited August 12, 2009 by Guest

[Guest]

Cheers.

I thought it might be high but fook me that's a steep bill somebody is going to have to cover.

Aye, you can expect to see Mcgruther in court in a years time trying to recover money not paid by LFC.

[phantoms-livi-lass]

Only 186 posts till the magic 10,000.. I hope Div is gonna put up some sort of prize for the person who posts the 10,000th offering...Considering this is only Wednesday, this could hit 11,000 by Friday. Maybe we should run a we competion to predict what the final total will be when Livi play thier first league game ( where ever that may be)

Please allow me the honour of the 10, 000th post?

[EdinburghLivi]

£1 to enter, proceeds go to the Fighting Fund.

Hmm... I reckon we'll have a surge tommorow from all of the bottomfeeders anticipating a potential expulsion so we'll be past 10,000.

I'll go for 10,469.

Edited August 12, 2009 by EdinburghLivi

[phantoms-livi-lass]

*Strolls briskly past the lady waiting under the clock in the station, covering the white carnation with his newspaper.

Do you have the Phantom costume on yet? It is criminal to get a lady this excited & then let her down you know!

[TheDoctor]

Please allow me the honour of the 10, 000th post?

I started this beast. I should get the honour

[The ghost of Jim Morton]

I started this beast. I should get the honour

I bet when you started this you never thought you'd get 100 replies never mind 10,000. Is this a P&B record??? Outstanding work Doc. You should be honoured in some way.. Perhaps a statue outside Almondvale of you wearing a white coat, with a stethoscope and a pie and bovril in hand... B)

Edited to add.. Not near the record.

What music you listening to in GN forum has 42,000 plus replies and there are anith2 who have 30,000 plus.. This ones a baby compared to them ..

Edited August 12, 2009 by The ghost of Jim Morton

[Nowhereman]

Correctamundo. One big .45 magnum shell duly discharged into the right foot. They have as yet made no appeal. They are therefore, a 3rd division side seeking to be returned to the 1st division. Their way of going about this was as a 3rd division side to turn round and tell the governing body that they would not play another 3rd division side. Not the most convincing of arguments.

They have effectively told their governing body that they will not adhere to their decision to the point where they wish to appoint a solicitor to represent them. Why would they seek legal represntation against a governing body (the SFL) whose authority they have refused to acknowledge? Kick them out. Nothing has changed, and nothing ever will change. This is one soiled football club that should be shown the exit door tomorrow.

The player shall have the right to appeal as set out in Rule 54.1.1.1 and the player and the club shall

each have the right of appeal as set out in Rule 54.1.1.2. Should a club impose on a player any of

the penalties contained in Rule 54.1.1 or 54.1.2, they will not become operative until the appeals

channels have become exhausted

This is from the league rules. As you will see it states that any penalty imposed will not become operative until the appeals channels have become exhausted. It does deal with a different situation but you would expect the rules of an institution to be interpreted consistently. In the Livi situation they are clearly not saying that they did not break the rules. But a penalty has been imposed and they are appealing the penalty. If the above interpretation is applied then the penalty should not become operative and therefore Livi are still a first division club. So Livi's decision not to play last week is entirely logical and consistent with their decision to appeal. By agreeing to play they would be accepting the very penalty which they are disputing.

The red card analogy is similar. When a player appeals a red card he is not necessarily saying that he did not do what he was accused of. He may well accept that he is guilty of the 'crime' but thinks that the penalty is too harsh. He therefore appeals the red card. In those circumstances the penalty is suspended until the appeal is heard.

So that is two situations within the rules where a penalty is suspended until an appeal is heard.

Therefore the Livi argument about being in the first division can be seen to be consistent with the sfl rules in other situations where an appeal is possible

Given that rule 76 is not exactly clear as to when an appeal is succesful and could be interpreted both ways , where would you look for guidance as to the correct way to interpret it ? Thats right , other parts of the rules where an appeal is competent. And they would seem to suggest that the penalty should be suspended pending the result of the appeal.

[Larsson.]

I bet when you started this you never thought you'd get 100 replies never mind 10,000. Is this a P&B record??? Outstanding work Doc. You should be honoured in some way.. Perhaps a statue outside Almondvale of you wearing a white coat, with a stethoscope and a pie and bovril in hand... B)

Edited to add.. Not near the record.

What music you listening to in GN forum has 42,000 plus replies and there are anith2 who have 30,000 plus.. This ones a baby compared to them ..

Bet if i started the ghost of jim morton is a w**k thread it would blow any of the above

out of the water.

[The Master]

Given that rule 76 is not exactly clear as to when an appeal is succesful and could be interpreted both ways , where would you look for guidance as to the correct way to interpret it ? Thats right , other parts of the rules where an appeal is competent. And they would seem to suggest that the penalty should be suspended pending the result of the appeal.

Rubbish.

Rule 76 is clear enough. Only once the appeal has been made is it deemed to have succeeded. Livi, by their own admission, have not yet made their appeal.

Ergo, it has not succeeded so they are a Third Division team.

Oh, and this bit:

When a player appeals a red card he is not necessarily saying that he did not do what he was accused of. He may well accept that he is guilty of the 'crime' but thinks that the penalty is too harsh. He therefore appeals the red card. In those circumstances the penalty is suspended until the appeal is heard.

Is utter tosh.

Red card offences are defined in the rules. So you either carried out the offence (and hence deserve the red card) or you didn't; there's no middle ground.

Edited August 12, 2009 by Sir Calum Melville

[phantoms-livi-lass]

Bet if i started the ghost of jim morton is a w**k thread it would blow any of the above

out of the water.

Away to your own thread ya wee ned!!

[KingfaetheSooth]

If as has been hinted at, McGruther and his backers are prepared to go to the law courts if and when the appeal falls tomorrow - things will really start to get interesting, costs will increase as will the stakes.

Amazing what money will be spent and risks taken to make money and aquire real estate....

[Yoss]

The analogy with player suspensions doesn't work because, like the death penalty analogies used earlier in the thread, the sentence is obviously irreversible once carried out. The same is not true of whichever division Livingston are regarded to be in until the appeal is heard.

At any rate we've covered that topic more than to death now and it's not getting us anywhere. Let's see what the SFL decide tomorrow.

(Has it been confirmed anywhere that they've got authority from all thirty clubs to go ahead tomorrow? I'm assuming that'll be a formality, but you never know.)

[phantoms-livi-lass]

If as has been hinted at, McGruther and his backers are prepared to go to the law courts if and when the appeal falls tomorrow - things will really start to get interesting, costs will increase as will the stakes.

Amazing what money will be spent and risks taken to make money and aquire real estate....

Stop spreading shit! They bloody better not take this any further or I will have no choice but to quit, All my Livi stuff will get burned on a bonfire I really can't do this anymore!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[The Master]

Nothing beats a bit of melodrama on a Wednesday afternoon.