Livingston - all the threads merged

[ol1vercloff]

I genuinely think we could win the Champions League and we'd still struggle to fill the West Stand.  It's a real shame.

[Durnford]

29 minutes ago, ol1vercloff said:

I genuinely think we could win the Champions League and we'd still struggle to fill the West Stand.  It's a real shame.

The playoffs against United and Partick Thistle proved the support potential is still there.

Season tickets are good value IMO.

The free tickets to schools provided some real long term benefit but it needed to be employed regularly; getting punters to break the habit of sitting in front of the box on a Saturday or whenever.

[ATLIS]

We’re being linked with Middlesbrough’s Toyosi Olusaniya a winger that seems not to have played a lot of games in his career but seems to get moves.

Apparently we’re after a permanent deal 

[LIVIFOREVER]

2 hours ago, ATLIS said:

We’re being linked with Middlesbrough’s Toyosi Olusaniya a winger that seems not to have played a lot of games in his career but seems to get moves.

Apparently we’re after a permanent deal 

St Mirren and Motherwell also meant to be interested in him, wage wise we'd be 3rd choice for him, though our profile has gone up with a lot of English clubs giving us players on loan so you never know. 

[ATLIS]

2 hours ago, LIVIFOREVER said:

St Mirren and Motherwell also meant to be interested in him, wage wise we'd be 3rd choice for him, though our profile has gone up with a lot of English clubs giving us players on loan so you never know. 

You'd imagine we could be the choice for a career stepping stone, Motherwell for the chance to play in Europe and St Mirren if he fancies doing f**k all for a year  

Edited June 7, 2022 by ATLIS

[ol1vercloff]

18 hours ago, ATLIS said:

We’re being linked with Middlesbrough’s Toyosi Olusaniya a winger that seems not to have played a lot of games in his career but seems to get moves.

Apparently we’re after a permanent deal 

Must be a big assister if he got a move to Middlesbrough at 22/23 after playing a handful of games and hardly scoring for a few non-league teams.

[Durnford]

4 hours ago, ol1vercloff said:

Must be a big assister if he got a move to Middlesbrough at 22/23 after playing a handful of games and hardly scoring for a few non-league teams.

On paper a 5'9" striker/forward doesn't fill me with confidence but then, on paper, Scott Pitman should never have got near the first team all those years ago so what do I know?

[LIVIFOREVER]

1 hour ago, Durnford said:

On paper a 5'9" striker/forward doesn't fill me with confidence but then, on paper, Scott Pitman should never have got near the first team all those years ago so what do I know?

Yeah Derek Lilley was only 5'10 and scored lots of goals for us, helping us lift the League cup too, and Griffiths is 5'9 too, i'd be pretty happy if he's as good as those two were for us. If we sign him anyway.

 

Bruce Anderson doesn't look that tall either, neither does Forrest, think if you've got pace then height doesn't really matter that much, unless you're played as a target man right enough, standing with a big CB behind you waiting on a high ball being lumped up in your direction.

Edited June 8, 2022 by LIVIFOREVER

[Guest]

Just as a general point, insistence on tall centre backs can be misplaced too. The last two centre backs to win the Ballon D'Or, Fabio Cannavaro in '06 and Mathias Sammer in '96, were both under 6ft (Cannavaro only 5'9" even). Carles Puyol and Roberto Ayala are 5'10". Ivan Cordoba only 5'8". Of current players, Thiago Silva has various heights attributed to him when I googled it just now but 5'11" was the most common. Marquinhos isn't much taller at 6ft. Jules Kounde is 5'10". There's also the occasional thing where an already wee defensive mid gets moved to centre back. 5'9" Mascherano most famously but Gary Medel, only 5'7" still plays centre back for Bologna.

Puyol, Cannavaro, Cordoba, Ayala and Silva were all fantastic aerially, too, each with a penchant for scoring headers from set pieces. So a wee guy with great athleticism and jumping can beat a big guy without those things.

[Cptn Hooch]

1 hour ago, FreedomFarter said:

Just as a general point, insistence on tall centre backs can be misplaced too. The last two centre backs to win the Ballon D'Or, Fabio Cannavaro in '06 and Mathias Sammer in '96, were both under 6ft (Cannavaro only 5'9" even). Carles Puyol and Roberto Ayala are 5'10". Ivan Cordoba only 5'8". Of current players, Thiago Silva has various heights attributed to him when I googled it just now but 5'11" was the most common. Marquinhos isn't much taller at 6ft. Jules Kounde is 5'10". There's also the occasional thing where an already wee defensive mid gets moved to centre back. 5'9" Mascherano most famously but Gary Medel, only 5'7" still plays centre back for Bologna.

Puyol, Cannavaro, Cordoba, Ayala and Silva were all fantastic aerially, too, each with a penchant for scoring headers from set pieces. So a wee guy with great athleticism and jumping can beat a big guy without those things.

The thing with these players is they tend to play in leagues where their prime job isn't heading the ball 100 times a game. The Scottish game calls for more big, physical defenders to swat long balls and crosses away. For sure there are exceptions and there might be world class CBs who are shorter than average but its horses for courses

[mozam76]

On 02/06/2022 at 10:46, ol1vercloff said:

For me, the frustrating thing is that he has bags of ability, but quite often doesn't like to pass to team-mates.  Maybe that's a lack of awareness or poor decision-making.  I often have to remind myself that we're a diddy team and will never have players that are the finished article, so we should come to expect and allow for mistakes like this quite often.  But sometimes he can definitely see the better option, but he wants the glory.  Typical of attacking players I suppose.  Good luck to him, but given how impatient Hearts fans are, I think they're either going to love or loathe him.

I have a fair few Hearts supporting pals, who openly admit to being almost bi-polar when it comes to the players in their team. I'm not saying that Hearts fans are unique in that regard, far from it, but as you said earlier in your post we are fans of a diddy club - a period of inconsistency from a player at our place is often quickly forgotten/forgiven if said player then has a good period.  I don't think a player like Forrest will be afforded the same grace by Hearts fans.

If he finds consistency in his performances he'll do really well at Hearts but I can't see him going beyond them.

[EdinburghLivi]

Good summary on Schwake, Mullin and Hamilton.

[LIVIFOREVER]

Mullin would be a useful utility player, even if it's just for his set pieces, but he's never going to be ahead of Nouble on the right wing.

Hamilton reminds me of Dylan Mackin, slow and lazy looking but could score goals when in and around the box. Whether he'll ever fit in with how we want him to play i'm not too confident, he just hasn't the pace to chase about closing down players. Reckon this will be make or break season for him, doubt he'll want to keep going out on loan to a Championship team, if he doesn't break into the team this season i think he'll want a move.

[Guest]

Mullin was excellent in the second half of the 20-21 season so I was surprised he was loaned out last season. He's proven Premiership standard so will make a really good back-up or rotation option, if he's happy with that squad role. 

[LIVIFOREVER]

3 hours ago, FreedomFarter said:

Mullin was excellent in the second half of the 20-21 season so I was surprised he was loaned out last season. He's proven Premiership standard so will make a really good back-up or rotation option, if he's happy with that squad role. 

He was great to start with, esp in the Betfred cup comp, but really dropped off by the time he was put out on loan, even his set pieces weren't that great. Dunno if there was some problem that he wasn't happy, but he wasn't putting in the application to get back in the team even when coming on as a sub.

Could maybe do a job as a utility player, coming on as a sub with Nouble switching over to the left side, but can't see him getting in ahead of Nouble on the right as a starter. Would have to show some of the form he had to start with anyway, to even have a chance of playing. 

Edited June 14, 2022 by LIVIFOREVER

[LIVIFOREVER]

I take it Kabia is still with us, not heard anything about him leaving, really hoping he can take advantage of Forrest's departure, and fill that place on the left wing. He's got the pace and trickery to be a decent player for us, could do with improving his finishing though. Between him and Mullin, with Nouble able to play on both wings (maybe Goncalves too), we should have a decent attacking threat on both wings, with Anderson, Pittman, and hopefully new signing Goncalves* getting us goals in the centre.

 

*Meant to be able to play on the wing and up front as a striker, think a CF is his best position though.

Edited June 14, 2022 by LIVIFOREVER

[kirktonlion]

Jade is back in Ireland afaik, still got a year on his contract but I don’t think he gets on with Martindale. I think he’s a decent player just needs to mature a bit and buy into the livi work rate, If he comes back. 

[DavideFernandezLoveChild]

Pre-season Friendly with Greenock Morton at the Macaroni - 2nd July

[Durnford]

14 hours ago, LIVIFOREVER said:

Mullin would be a useful utility player, even if it's just for his set pieces, but he's never going to be ahead of Nouble on the right wing.

Hamilton reminds me of Dylan Mackin, slow and lazy looking but could score goals when in and around the box. Whether he'll ever fit in with how we want him to play i'm not too confident, he just hasn't the pace to chase about closing down players. Reckon this will be make or break season for him, doubt he'll want to keep going out on loan to a Championship team, if he doesn't break into the team this season i think he'll want a move.

Bit unfair on Hamilton. Yes he doesnt possess the immediate acceleration but he's not got a bad top speed. Likewise he's definitely not lazy. Mackin really was a different class here; almost as if he thought the world owed him a living.

If you wanted to compare him against anyone surely Colin McMenamin would be a better comparison?

[LIVIFOREVER]

18 minutes ago, Durnford said:

Bit unfair on Hamilton. Yes he doesnt possess the immediate acceleration but he's not got a bad top speed. Likewise he's definitely not lazy. Mackin really was a different class here; almost as if he thought the world owed him a living.

If you wanted to compare him against anyone surely Colin McMenamin would be a better comparison?

Yeah don't think he is lazy, just looks it, and is a similar build to Mackin. Not his fault but the way we want our No9 to play is high intensity chasing down balls, and pressing opposition players bringing the ball out from the back, Hammy just hasn't the pace or stamina to do that. Even at Arbroath in games i've watched them he didn't do it for me, esp in their play offs.

Maybe the fans (or at least my) expectation is putting unfair pressure on him to be a star player for us, i'm bursting for him to be a 12-15 goal striker for us, and he has been here a while, and i'm getting a tad impatient waiting for him fulfilling that expectation.