Pyramidic
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Posts posted by Pyramidic
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We seem to be struggling to find any new blood whatsoever for the EOSFL.
Perhaps another student oriented club:
Edinburgh Napier University - who currently play out of Ainslie Park Stadium on Wednesdays in the BUCS League Division 2A (Tier 2).
St Andrews University - who play in the same division.
Feels like clutching at straws!
Perhaps only way that vacancies in EOSFL Division Three could be filled would be from SPFL “B” teams with all the flack, hurt and bitterness that would bring.
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52 minutes ago, John mg said:
Think a straight three up three down within the eos three leagues would be a better option to try and resolve the ability issues within the three divisions
Agreed in general. But I think that we need to look more closely to the issues that are evolving for clubs participating in the new Second Division and Third Division.One would have thought that in normal circumstances that the promotion and relegation arrangements for the EOSFL 2022/23 season would have been properly sorted out at the AGM last Thursday.
However, the delayed final tranche of West Lothian clubs that joined the EOSFL for the 2021/22 season has created difficulties for the league management and indeed the clubs themselves in establishing a league structure that reflects current playing abilities and strengths. The issue now needs to be properly thought through by the league management. It is obvious that a number of the clubs in the Third Division are stronger than those in the Second Division. It will take a few seasons to sort out if left to piece meal movement of 2 or 3 clubs each season between Second and Third as the adopted approach. This may prove both unhelpful and difficult for weak Second Division clubs relegated into a largely “West Lothian” Third Division. At worst it could lead to club resignations from the EOSFL.
The alternative is for league management to follow a more structured approach to address the problem so that the Second Division and Third Division will both have 14 clubs for the 2023/24 season. This can be achieved in 2022/23 season by:
Second Division
3 Promoted to First Division (pos. 1 to 3) - replaced by 3 Relegated from First Division
8 Remain in Second Division (pos. 4-11)
7 Relegated to Third Division (pos. 12-18) - replaced by 3 Promoted from Third Division
Third Division
3 Promoted to Second Division (pos. 1 to 3) - replaced by 7 Relegated from Second Division
7 Remain in Third Division (pos. 4 to 10)
Using this structure we may indeed finish up with 15 clubs in each of the Second Division and Third Division for 2023/24 season. This would reflect the Premier Division champions not being promoted to the Lowland League but an east of Scotland located club being relegated from the LL creating movements down the EOSFL to the Second Division. At the same time there could be a new applicant to join the EOSFL in the Third Division.0 -
Are we now at Three Up and Three down under normal circumstances between:
Premier Division - First Division
First Division - Second Division
as predicted?
But what was agreed at the AGM for the
Second Division - Third Division
Three Up and Five Down?
or
Two Up and Four Down?
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League structure for 2022/3;
- Premier Division
- Blackburn United
- Broxburn Athletic
- Crossgates Primrose
- Dundonald Bluebell
- Haddington Athletic
- Hill of Beath Hawthorn
- Inverkeithing Hillfield Swifts
- Jeanfield Swifts
- Linlithgow Rose
- Lothian Thistle HH
- Musselburgh Athletic
- Oakley United
- Penicuik Athletic
- Sauchie Juniors
- Tynecastle
- Vale of Leithen
- First Division
- Burntisland Shipyard
- Camelon Juniors
- Coldstream
- Dunbar United
- Dunipace
- Glenrothes
- Kennoway Star Hearts
- Kinnoull
- Kirkcaldy & Dysart
- Leith Athletic
- Lochore Welfare
- Luncarty
- Newtongrange Star
- Preston Athletic
- Rosyth
- Whitehill Welfare
- Second Division
- Arniston Rangers
- Craigroyston
- Dalkeith Thistle
- Easthouses Lily MW
- Edinburgh South
- Edinburgh United
- Hawick RA
- Heriot Watt University
- Lochgelly Albert
- Newburgh Juniors
- Ormiston Primrose
- Peebles Rovers
- St Andrews United
- Stirling University EoS
- Syngenta
- Thornton Hibs
- Tweedmouth Rangers
- Whitburn
- Third Division
- Armadale Thistle
- Bathgate Thistle
- Bo'ness Athletic
- Edinburgh College
- Fauldhouse United
- Harthill Royal
- Livingston United
- Pumpherston
- Stoneyburn
- West Calder United
What relegation and promotion was agreed at last night’s AGM? Particularly between Divisions Two and Three?
Last edited: 44 minutes ago2 -
Notification of Harthill Royal joining the EOSFL subject to official confirmation by WOSFL:
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22 minutes ago, Robert James said:
And look where Kelty are now in 2022 !! They were the first trail-blazing Junior club, which started the 'rush' to join the pyramid.
Bonnyrigg soon followed suit. Congratulations to both clubs for leading the charge..
Of course there would be no reason now why Kelty Hearts could not apply to enter a “B” team in the EOSFL Third Division for the 2022/23 season.
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The case can be made that if there are “B” team applicants from SPFL clubs affiliated to the East of Scotland FA, it would be much better to avoid unnecessary speculation and debate on the P&B Forum at this stage. In such circumstances many would accept that it would be a sensible decision to avoid advanced publicity before the applications have been considered by EOSFL management and subsequently member clubs.
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For the last few seasons it was always a period of anticipation discussing the merits of the prospective new applicants to the EOSFL. I suppose the question this time around should be whether indeed there will be any applicants? Does anyone know when the EOSFL management will be considering applications (if there are any)?
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Interesting feedback. Just wondering if the concept of the top clubs of the Midlands League and the NRJFA League forming a SuperLeague has been totally binned or whether there is still some movement to deliver the initiative. The new road infrastructure around Aberdeen would make a Grampian and Tayside SuperLeague a realistic and achievable goal. It would also assist those clubs who would remain in the Midlands League and NRJFA League by creating more level and sustainable competitions feeding into the higher tier.
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Edinburgh City, Hearts and Hibernian are long-standing affiliated members of the East of Scotland FA. Just wondering what hoops they would have to jump through to enter “B” teams in the EOSFL Third Division next season? If the Third Division is to have only 9 teams there might be a case for allowing in one or more B” teams assuming that general ground requirements can be met.
Recent link: https://www.footballscotland.co.uk/spfl/scottish-premiership/hearts-b-shouldnt-go-straight-23058729
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No titbits in the press to date other than reference to Hearts “B” a couple of weeks ago which I am sure would go down like a damp squib:
https://www.footballscotland.co.uk/spfl/scottish-premiership/hearts-b-shouldnt-go-straight-23058729
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2 minutes ago, Marten said:
There have been rumours that there will be a joint North/Midlands "superleague" at tier 6, which would mean the remaining teams end up in tier 7. But I'm not sure how far those talks are.
Cheers Marten. This in my opinion would be a very sensible and meaningful move for the stronger East Region/Midlands and North Region clubs. It would also present those clubs dropping to Tier 7 with a more balanced competition. The new road infrastructure - AWPR - also helps facilitate such a ‘super league’ initiative.
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On a similar vein are there any bottom drawer plans to split the Midlands League into two divisions for season 2022/23 - particularly if there are a couple of applications from new clubs pending?
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On 21/12/2021 at 11:02, LongTimeLurker said:
Line of latitude completely gone so there is no longer any apparent anomaly where Luncarty, Letham, Scone and Tayport are concerned. I doubt there's any huge enthusiasm in EoS circles to drive to Dundee and beyond for away games so Forfar WE, Broughty and North End are unlikely to receive a positive response in the unlikely event that they tried again because they fancy trips to a West Lothian heavy tier 9.
The EoS managed to get the east region eliminated as a potential rival LL feeder over almost all of their perceived catchment before this rule change happened so any mission creep is more likely to be southwards by the Midlands League to expand on their somewhat limited numbers rather than northwards by the EoS to expand further on their already bloated ones but there probably won't be anything too dramatic going on if it ever happens.
Nothing retrospective in the rules to get Brechin City into the LL after the fact but that doesn't mean nothing is happening behind the scenes on that. It isn't Forfar, Montrose or especially Arbroath that were the main inspiration for this rule change. Brechin have been playing well enough in recent weeks that there is a fair to middling chance they will get promoted this season so that possibility probably has to unfold first.
It is fascinating the way that the Pyramid is evolving. Just when we thought that we were getting some certainty and common sense with the ERJFA Midland League feeding into the Highland League along with the NRJFA North Region League and North Caledonian League, the line of latitude separating the HL and LL gets blitzed.
I think the ramifications are much wider than SPFL2 clubs simply electing to determine whether they would drop into the HL or LL catchment in the event of relegation following play-off of Club 42. I think that dropping the HL/LL boundary will open the doors for ML clubs to participate in the Tier 5/6 LL Play-offs. It would not make sense for say Arbroath or Montrose choosing the LL over the HL as a destination, while Lochee or Broughty to the south would only have the option of playing in the HL.
It will be very interesting to see what the LL Working Group are going to determine for Tier 5/6 Promotion/Relegation. With potentially two promotion places from Tier 6, this would open up the possibility of both a western and an eastern play-off. The western play-off would be between the licensed champions of the WOSFL and SOSFL. The eastern play-off would be between the licensed champions of the EOSFL and ML. The ML champion might of course opt to participate in the play-offs to the HL, but in the case of Dundee clubs I believe this would be unlikely.
It will be interesting to see whether clubs like Luncarty and Kinnoull drift back to their family group in the ML. At the current time I think this to be unlikely as EOSFL Tier 7 will provide highly competitive football with most of the prospective opponents being reasonably accessible in terms travelling times. Newburgh and St Andrews, who potentially will be in Tier 8, will have a few trips to the Scottish Borders. However, the football will be competitive with the opportunity for advancement to Tier 7.
Looking in my crystal ball, I still feel that the SOSFL might eventually have a promotion link into the WOSFL Premier and similarly the ML into the EOSFL Premier. But this will take time to materialise. Time will tell.
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On 02/11/2021 at 17:56, LongTimeLurker said:
Hopefully they'll receive more of a welcome and flexibility on meeting ground requirements than Letham did. Still quite a few more large towns other than South Queensferry with no pyramid club such as North Berwick, Dunblane, Alva, Kinross and Cupar.
Agreed. From a recent visit to the Queensferry Sports Hub I did not feel that I was at a potential EoSFL ground. EOSFL management will need to show a high degree of flexibility so that new clubs can come on board. The distance from the new AWP to the changing rooms may be an impediment.
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How would the relegation of Vale of Leithen affect the structure assuming that Talbot (or another WoSFL club) win the promotion play-off to the Lowland League?
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Both Bo’ness sides drawn at home (not together).
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4 minutes ago, HibeeJibee said:
Applications and voting is long done. AGM is tomorrow. (I was partly jesting anyway... just because LTHV's first-team move on doesn't necessarily mean their facility lying empty. They have youth/amateur/womens teams... heavily used for athletics currently... doubt any Tom-Dick-&-Harry could acquire lease from Edinburgh Leisure just like that... etc. etc.).
Incidentally why would it be better to run with 12 rather than 11?
Same number of matchdays and you'd actually produce an imbalance in home+away games (17+16 / 16+17 not 15+15).Thanks for the feedback. With an 11 team division you will always have a club without a league fixture during each league round. I appreciate that the EOSFL are pretty good at filling in the void week with a cup game if you are lucky.
The possibility of Saughton or Peffermill being available for a new club(s) represents an interesting opportunity for 2022/23.
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1 hour ago, HibeeJibee said:
I've certainly seen claims here and on other websites the current expectation is actually October or November... e.g. check out Edinburgh City's thread in SPFL2 sub-forum.
City's home games in League Cup groupstage have - interestingly - been fixed upon non-standard Friday and Wednesday (and they don't clash with Spartans friendlies either).
Unlikely to bother Leith as they could just wait-it-out at Peffermill.
EDIT: if true perhaps City missing-a-trick... they should use Saughton, and let Scottish League action grace the Stenhouse San Siro
!
With the bottom “ex West Lothian” division running with 11 teams would there any benefit in the EOSFL allowing some flexibility and accommodating a late applicant - “club 12” - that would be focussed on using Saughton as their home ground? It would be much better to run the new division with 12 teams rather than 11.
Is it too late? The unusual position could be made known in the press.
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7 hours ago, Mr Positive, sometimes. said:
Not sure if someone has since came along and shed more light on this since I posted asking more about it a while back. I know you you were not being serious re the investigative journalism but I'm interested in knowing so I've been asking around...
I've been back playing football this week and the subject came up and one reason I was given is the dressing rooms are not attached to the pitch area. That was apparently an issue...
Another game later in the week so may hear more as that game has a few people involved that may know more about it.
I'm a nosey b*****d it seems...
There must be a few existing clubs in the EOSFL that do not have adjacent changing rooms - Peebles and Inverkeithing certainly come to mind. There are likely to have been other issues that also played a significant part in Letham not meeting league entry criteria.
I hope Letham can address the issues and reapply to the EOSFL for the 2022/23 season rather than try to join the emerging Midland League.
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New clubs in the East of Scotland
in East of Scotland Football League
Posted
Common sense should prevail in the EOSFL and Division Two/Three should be combined to create two sensible third tier regional groups. At long last we would have the beginnings of a proper pyramid.
SECOND DIVISION
NORTH
Armadale Thistle
Bathgate Thistle
Bo'ness Athletic
Burntisland Shipyard
Fauldhouse United
Harthill Royal
Kennoway Star Hearts
Livingston United
Lochgelly Albert
Newburgh Juniors
Pumpherston
Stoneyburn
Thornton Hibs
West Calder United
(14 teams)
SECOND DIVISION
SOUTH
Arniston Rangers
Craigroyston
Dalkeith Thistle
Easthouses Lily MW
Edinburgh College
Edinburgh South
Edinburgh United
Hawick Royal Albert
Heriot Watt University
Ormiston Primrose
Peebles Rovers
Stirling University EOSFL *
Tweedmouth Rangers
Whitehill Welfare
(14 teams)
* Stirling University EOSFL as a "B" team moved from its geographical grouping to balance the group numbers. Can also compete with the two other university/college teams.
Bo'ness Athletic and Armadale Thistle would be unhappy but the greater good of Scottish football for the future is much more important. New blood would want to join such a setup in particular Duns.