HopeStreetWalker

Buying the place is now out of the question in light of the last few days posts. We owe the facility no loyalty goodwill or affection. In all my 40 + years in business, have never encountered such a contrived and complicated arrangement. Sever all ties and financial commitments to it. Our only involvement should be as a potential client hiring bits of the facility as and when required. It would be a prudent course of action cutting our overheads on one of our largest weekly outgoings of funds.

Yep ! just us.

There would have to be a delay for a number of reasons. There would be players out of contact and there would have to be some sort of ruling on signings short term to see the season out. Players would not want to sign if they were not sure what division they would be playing in. There would have to be training and shake down matches for fitness and wellbeing of the players. Hopefully the ruling authorities have this ready to go when life starts to get back to normal.

Agree with the sentiments of the post. It's the need for clarification that is so frustrating. What would be helpful was if FFC were to lay out exactly who owns what and in what % of the Stadium facility. We know the club monitors this forum. So whoever read this - It would improve relations with the fans if this information was made public. Over to you FFC !

Yes ! hindsight is a great thing. But alarm bells should have been ringing right from the start. Number 1- This is Falkirk Council we are dealing with. No further comment required.

The game of endless scenarios continue. Interesting point on the hotel suggestion. That would depend on the Council giving planning permission - aye I can see going well - - Not !

Get what you mean ! but that leaves FFC still in the hands of the stadium company that own the building the seats are on. Therefore at the mercy of the council that can up costs at will. Out of the frying pan and into the fire - It's madness ! We must be the only football club that owns seats but not the grandstand. As for the 4th Stand. There is the new synthetic pitch to consider. Where would the parking be ? Got it in one the council owned carpark opposite.

But we would have to get all the parties and Uncle Tom Cobblie's that have invested in this money making scam at FFC's expense to agree to sell at the same time. Never going to happen !

One thing I have learned Shadwell from the last days posts on this subject. There are so many fingers in the pie regarding the stadium. FFC buying it outright is impossible and was never a workable option. We have to sever all ties regarding having a share in the Stadium. If that means handing our shares in the Stadium Company over to the council so be it. Nothing to lose as it has never made money. Lets be nothing more than a company that hires the venue when required. It would save FFC a fortune per season.

There is just no clarity regarding who own what in the stadium. Whether this is intentional or just being inept is for each individual to make their mind up. People have posted in good faith what they have managed to find out and it is a farce what is being exposed. The Council own the Community stadium company. They own everything apart from the South stand which is owned by Alexander, the seating in the whole stadium and the pitch is owned by FFC. What a way not to run a business. Those involved at FFC that resulted in this situation should be named and shamed. It just reinforces my opinion we get out and leave them to it. Hire the place when required just as companies hire it for a concert.

To be blunt - we were outclassed in every department. It always looked they had a couple of gears to go up if they wanted. That was about 50 years ago ! that alone indicates how impressive they were.

Suspect the South Stand Development is leased from the Community Stadium Company. Nothing is clear cut and what is published is open to interpretation. The more you look at it the more it is obvious it is to cut all ties with the company. Rent for the match day picking and choosing the capacity game by game. Offices above a club shop in the High Street and train at Stirling University.

What was frightening was it always looked like they could go up a couple of gears. Some goal he scored there, even under pressure he did what he wanted to do when he wanted to do it.

The best foreign team ever to play Falkirk was Gornik in the early 70's. They had a centre forward called Lubanski. Did that guy have it all in spades. Pace, Two footed, Pass it short and long, Could tackle, Great in the air, Team player, Great striker of the ball, Hard as nails. It was a football education and a joy to watch a truly world class player. Remember in the Royal Bar for a few post match pints and everybody was talking about him. John Markie and George Gibson had a torrid time against him.

It is a maze that's for sure. It comes down what is interpreted as part of a stadium. Stadium- definition- Sports arena surrounded by an area for spectators. To me that is the surface where the sport is preformed and the infrastructure where the spectators congregate to watch. Get you point though ! where it does not say they own pitch and seating but on the other hand it does not say they don't, they could just be taking the stadium dictionary definition stating the obvious. Can't see the stadium company building a grandstand but for some reason not owning the seating that was the point of building it in the first place. Maybe what they are referring to is a 3rd party leasing a certain stand who then operate it as a franchise. It is a contrived complicated mess that is open to interpretation with no clarity at all. What we can agree on is that the current FFC arrangement with the community stadium is not in the long term interest of the football club. As we are nothing more than a never emptying honey pot for the council.

Hi Shadwell. According to company check and the website this is not the case.

From what I can ascertain from the website and company check sites. The Stadium and all facilities are owned by Falkirk Community Stadium Ltd. People or organisations that funded certain infrastructure do not own it. The funding of the 3rd stand for example is an arrangement with the Stadium company, whether that is a soft loan or a share in the company would require clarification. As for stadium valuation,it was posted that the council value it at 10 million. Something is only worth what somebody is willing to pay. If FFC move out and rent infrastructure to cope with crowds on a game to game basis. Then instead of the stadium being a money pit for the council and starts to be a drain on resources. They will want shot of it and value it accordingly.

Yes. Build the money making facilities in the fourth stand, undercut the council. Use the main stand as a stand only. f**k buying out the council. Smoke them out instead. Building a 4th stand would be a matter for the Falkirk Community Stadium Company. There is not a commercial case for building one, just cannot understand why people keep bringing it up. As for how much the council value their stake in the company. Has anybody asked how much they want or got a valuation on it ? Would be a good starting point. There is another option. Sell to the council FFC share of the company. Rent it for games and have nothing else to do with it. Train at Stirling University. Office administration can be done from rented or leased premises, Plenty about in Falkirk High Street that could be incorporated into a shop downstairs and offices above. FFC are not looked on as a partner by the council. They are seen as a lucrative reliable income stream who have nowhere else to go and treated accordingly.

Yep ! Hindsight is a great thing. What annoyed me the most was the council selling the land to the stadium company where the council was the majority stakeholder. ie - they sold land to themselves diluting FFC share of the stadium and it not costing themselves a penny. If ever there was an opportunity for a bit of accountancy slight of hand to work to your advantage it was this. Long term objective is to buy the stadium outright before indulging in 4th stand fantasies.

Don't disagree ! We needed either a revamped Brockville or a new stadium and as you stated made a c**t of the deal as I outlined.

The Council owned 2/7th of the Brockville site. They persuaded FFC to go in with them on the new stadium and insisted on a main stand of that capacity. Now this is the clever bit from the Council. They formed the Falkirk Community Stadium Ltd and sold their own land to themselves at an inflated price due to the potential of a Hotel attached to the stadium. FFC sign up and end up near skint while the council win big time. Few months later no hotel due to the blast zone. Council therefore become major stakeholder in stadium company. Council get a tenant with nowhere else to go. Paying of a land price that is nothing short of fraud. Lease of the stadium increased every season and a nice casher every financial year. FFC must have paid the cost of the thing a few times over. We cannot walk away as we have nowhere else to go. The council for one would never give planning permission. For that reason a buyout comes before any 4th Stand.

Westfield Stadium is owned outright by the Falkirk Community Stadium Ltd. Its a mess and football clubs like Raith and Falkirk are getting taken to the cleaners because of it.

Yes ! it would be an opportune moment to make a casher one off offer to the Council to buy the Stadium Company outright. Along the lines of ' Hey Council since we moved to Westfield we have paid you X mount. Know you are strapped for cash so 1.5 million in your bank tomorrow and FFC own the Stadium-Car park and surrounding land. How about it' They would bite your hand off. Money is cheap to borrow, what we pay the stadium company every month would more than cover say a 20 year payback period. We would also have an asset to borrow funds on in the future.

No 4th stand until FFC own the stadium, car park and surrounding land outright. FFC got well and truly screwed over Westfield. We should never have allowed that ego trip of a main stand to be build. Far to big could have got another stand built for the same money.

Agree ! we got well and truly screwed not only in the selling of Brockville but in the whole Westfield shambles.