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bluedragon

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About bluedragon

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  1. We have so far identified 2,525 players who have represented the Scottish Junior Football Association in both international and other matches. We have a forename(s) or first initial(s) for all but 97 of them. Of those, 34 played in international matches and we are concentrating on trying to find a forename/initial for this group. We are confident we can reduce that number a little further indeed this morning with a lead provided by a historian of Bo’ness junior clubs we reduced the list by one with a player from 1901. Here is the list (in club alphabetical order - current clubs shown with **) as it stands. Most of the players have common surnames, played for clubs that are now defunct and the most recent cap was in 1937. Despite this who knows perhaps a scan down the list may just come up with a few suggestions, leads, ideas, etc. that we can follow up. Airdrieonians 'A' - McKinlay (1896) Argyll (Aberdeen) - Cotton (1926) Benburb - Leslie (1890) **Blantyre Victoria - Robertson (1915) Burnbank Athletic – Hunter (1927); Thomson (1920) **Cambuslang Rangers - McIntosh (1921) Clydebank Juniors - Mills (1917) Coalburn - Kerr (1929) Corporation Cleansing Department - Wilson (1928) **Dalkeith Thistle - McBurnie (1932) Dalziel Rovers - Irvine (1907) **Darvel - Findlay (1927) Douglas Water Thistle - Henderson (1913) Drongan - Morrison (1920) Dumbarton Juniors - Hislop (1923) Dunaskin Lads - Logan (1921) Dundee Arnot - Graham (1908) ** Dunipace Juniors - Taylor (1927); Cairns (1928) Duntocher Hibernian - Grieve (1904) Earnock Rovers - Miller (1909) **Glasgow Perthshire - Bennie (1927); Keith (1926) Hamilton West End Rangers - Sneddon (1890) Moore Park - Hosie (1897) Morton Juniors - Fleming (1937) Mugiemoss - Tough (1911) Muirkirk Athletic - Grant (1915) Ormiston Primrose - Gray (1931) **Renfrew - Brown (1916 & 1920) Renfrew Victoria - Leitch (1910) Shawbank - Wilson (1894) Strathclyde - McMurray (1927) Thank you.
  2. Thanks very much for all the information and the photograph. Much appreciated.
  3. This is not Lowland League business but I hope someone might be able to help me identify two former Bo’ness United players in a photograph and give me any football career information on one of them. This photograph was taken in May 1968 and includes Benny McGuire and Frank Heenan who were both with Bo’ness at the time. The third player is Eric Black who had just been released from Airdrieonians. He is the father of Eric Black (Aberdeen, Metz & Scotland) who then had a long career in coaching. I think from left to right they are Frank Heenan, Benny McGuire and Eric Black. Can anyone help please with a positive identification. I do not know much about Frank Heenan’s career other than he had a spell at Newtown Park. Can anyone help with details of other clubs he played for. Thank you.
  4. Thanks for posting the photographs. Gordon Belcher was the first player from an Edinburgh club for 52 years to be capped for Junior Scotland. Result: Scotland 2 (1) Republic of Ireland 0 (0) Goalscorers: Tony McDonald 2 Venue: Prestonfield, Linlithgow Scotland: Mark Glynn (Ormiston Primrose), John Coughlin (Newtongrange Star), Eddie McAuley (Dundee North End), Allan McKeeman (Linlithgow Rose), Alex Coubrough (Pollok), Tom McDonald (Auchinleck Talbot), Alan Pirie (Auchinleck Talbot), Tom Donnelly (Vale of Clyde), Colin Crichton (Pollok), Tony McDonald (Arthurlie), Billy Muir (Kilbirnie Ladeside). Substitutes: Gordon Belcher (Edinburgh United), Jim Brown (Irvine Meadow XI), Raymond Day (Cumnock), Lewis Muirhead (Bon Accord [Aberdeen]), John Wright (Hill of Beath Hawthorn). MANAGER: Tommy Reynolds Gordon was the 20th and last player from an Edinburgh club to be capped for Junior Scotland. Before Gordon you need to go back to 1937 when William Clark and Thomas McIntyre were capped against England and Northern Ireland respectively. In 1952 Frank Mackay (brother of Dave) played for Junior Scotland against the Perthshire JFA while at Edinburgh City. However, he did not make the team that met the Republic of Ireland the following week. The Edinburgh clubs that supplied 20 players who won 28 caps were: Bainfield, Dalry Primrose, Dunrobin Athletic, Edinburgh Emmet, Edinburgh Myrtle, Edinburgh United, Edinburgh Renton, Granton Oakvale, North Western, Portobello Renton, Portobello Thistle and Woodburn.
  5. A great question but not easy to try and answer. As you say, some Junior clubs (Auchinleck Talbot, Bo’ness United, Bonnyrigg Rose, Irvine Meadow XI, Linlithgow Rose & Sunnybank), have achieved some great results in the Scottish Cup since 2007/08. It is difficult to say how the top clubs from earlier times would have fared without the evidence of matches in the Scottish Cup. My initial reaction would be to say that at least since the Second World War the top Junior teams would have always done well against lower level Scottish League clubs. A watershed moment was the gradual relaxation of the reinstatement rules and age limits that made it easier for Junior clubs to recruit older players with league experience to blend in with younger players. When the draconian reinstatement rules were in force (up to the 1950’s?) it would have been difficult for a club to bring in a few good and experienced heads that all good teams need. I would hazard a guess that the re-instatement rules were significantly relaxed by the late 1980’s (?) Having said all that, there were many, many excellent Junior players who chose to turn down offers to move to Senior football and these players would have provided the experienced heads in many teams. Junior Scotland regularly played Scottish League clubs (not forgetting Arsenal) and although these were not first team strength teams they were still strong opponents. Since the Second World War Junior Scotland have played 24 such matches involving 17 different clubs, winning 13, drawing 4 and losing 6. They scored 52 goals and conceded 43. Not a bad record.
  6. Without checking, I would say the practice of naming a Reserve XI stopped in the late 1950’s. As you say, if a player in the selected team had to call off then the player in his position was called into the team. Also one of the Reserve XI was selected as the travelling reserve. The travelling reserve also received a cap. Since we published the book on Junior Scotland we have continued our research and my co-author has found the names of many travelling reserves.
  7. The only Ferguson that featured in trials for and/or the Junior Scotland team at this time was James Ferguson (Strathclyde) but he was a Blackburn Rovers player in the 1907/08 season. As you probably know the newspapers of the day often used the term “junior internationalist” for players who were not SJFA caps but had represented their league against their Irish equivalents. No Ferguson played for the Lanarkshire Junior League or the Scottish Junior League against the Irish Junior League in this time. However, although the first initial does not agree Robert C Ferguson (Parkhead) might be a good lead. He was the centre forward in the Glasgow Junior League that played against the Irish Junior League on 17 February 1906 and scored a goal. He appears to sign for St Mirren in April 1906 and play some end-of-season matches before playing 4 league matches in the 1906/07 season. I cannot see him in the 1907/08 season in Scotland or England League football (Kelty Rangers?). He then re-appears to sign for Albion Rovers in June 1908 and play two league matches in the 1908/09 season. I hope this might be of help.
  8. Thank you for posting this photograph. There must have been many pre-War photographs of Junior Scotland teams taken but they are difficult to find. A couple of small corrections. The match was played on 8 April 1933 and the photograph was taken at St Andrews, Birmingham, the ground of Birmingham (later City) FC, where the match was played. By one of those strange coincidences I have seen this photograph before but the source was the grandson of the other Dundonian in the team, Jimmy Briggs. Thanks to your post we can now put a name to another face in the team photograph, Dickie Boag. Here is the line-up in the photograph as we have it. Names in bold are definite identifications (with Dickie Boag now added - thanks), the other names are best guesses using other photographs and at the end are the four players we cannot place. The players are difficult to identify as they are wearing their caps and are younger than other photographs taken later in their careers. One clue is that they appear to be wearing their club socks. If anyone can help pleas just let me know. Row 1 (Back row) from left to right: [official], [official], [official], DS Beaton (Dundee Violet), [official], [official]. Row 2 from left to right: [official], T Wallace (Bridgeton Waverley) (Trainer), [XXX], Archie Gourlay (Dunipace), Duncan Erskine (Alyth United) (Travelling Reserve), [XXX], [XXX]. Row 3 from left to right: [official], Robert Corrance (Renfrew) (Captain), Jimmy Briggs (Dundee Violet), [XXX], [XXX], Dicky Boag (Lochee Harp), John McDonald (Bonnyrigg Rose Athletic), Willie Lyon (Kirkintilloch Rob Roy]. Row 4 from left to right: Duncan McClure (Parkhead), [XXX], [XXX]. Bold indicates they have definitely been identified. Unplaced players: Malcolm McDonald (Tranent) Hugh Naughton (Larkhall Thistle) Alastair McKillop (Rosslyn) Harry Duff (Yoker Athletic)
  9. Thank you for posting this photograph and making a start to put names to faces. I would be very interested to see a photograph of the cap on display in the Edinburgh City Soclal Club to see if we can help identify who won it. The only player we have playing for Junior Scotland while at Edinburgh City was Frank Mackay, brother of Dave Mackay, in 1952. However, he did not play in a match where caps would have normally been awarded.
  10. There was at least one change with Hugh Gilshan (Johnstone Burgh) replacing an injured Andy Madden (Neilston) from the original selected team.
  11. Thanks for the information about the subs and goalscorer that I have now added to the records. Yes , it was the same Brian Heron.who went on to play for Rangers, Motherwell, Dumbarton, Oxford United and Scunthorpe United.
  12. I am afraid I cannot help with a team photograph but here are the twelve players who were selected in case it helps others find a photograph: John Chambers (Kirkintilloch Rob Roy) Kenny Dalglish (Cumbernauld United) Billy Elder (Jeanfield Swifts) Bobby Graham (Benburb) Brian Heron (Baillieston) Bobby Hodge (Whitburn) William Hume (Penicuik Athletic) Duncan Madden (Neilston) James McGregor (Yoker Athletic) Billy Murdoch (Kilsyth Rangers) Peter Nicol (Ardrossan Winton Rovers) Archie Young (Bonnyrigg Rose Athletic) If you are in contact with John again it would great to know if he can remember who was the substitute and who scored the goal in the 1-0 as that is missing information at present. Good luck in tracking a photograph down.
  13. Thank you Jambo'ness. That's gives me the information I was looking for. I am helping with some research on Scots youngsters who went to West Bromwich Albion and where they went next.
  14. I hope you do not mind me posting a question on your club thread. I am trying to find out if Doug Raeburn , came from Bo’ness, continued his football career after leaving West Bromwich Albion in 1963. I cannot find him playing for a Senior club and I am wondering if he returned home and played for Bo’ness United or another local Junior club. He joined WBA as an amateur in October 1962 but then moved down from Bo’ness to West Bromwich. He signed as a professional in February 1963 but left the club a year later in February 1964. If anyone can help or pass my question on to someone who can that would be very much appreciated. Thank you.
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