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Upgrading my previous opinion to be that this, in context, is one of the greatest things ever posted on the internet.

Reading through pages and pages of this thread and the disparaging comments towards the South League is frankly embarrassing. We have a league that caters for football from Gretna to Stranraer. Yes, we may not have clubs that are of the same standard as some East Teams or Juniors, but so what? We've always been accommodating towards teams looking to get their foot in the door and offer nothing but a foundation to play football and progress. We have 4 licensed clubs and other clubs within looking to spend time money and effort to do the same. Maybe some clubs aspirations aren't to get the the LL or SPFL. Maybe we know our level, but maybe there are some who might want to give it a bloody good try. We are at T6, and whatever the future holds for our level we will deal with it. If any team in the South want to go to the WoSL I can assure you the other clubs will support them; because that's what's we do.

@MJC

Feel like we are all in agreement. YT = good Smashing another teams property = bad Kids making mistakes while peevied = normal Let’s move on and focus on the fantastic job John McG and Smudger have done.

Mumsnet type parents who have absolutely nothing in their lives but their arsehole kids.

I'd also point out that as someone with a big interest in junior football (and the future.... or non future of it ) I would always keep in mind that those who follow/ are involved in teams at this level should most of the time be listened too as opposed to told by someone like myself who isn't involved. It's quite odd to see things have done some sort of weird reverse where upon trying to read what the latest is on junior football, I'm reading about how my SPFL club should be in a regionalised league along with many others with little consideration/ understanding of what anyone involved with these clubs wants. Just like the vast majority of non league/ junior fans like the regionalisation, I'm fairly certain a vast majority of SPFL fans/ clubs like being national clubs playing in national leagues. Over the past two decades you've seen many clubs/ fans outside of the pyramid lobbying for change in a variety of ways - how many times have you seen fans of SPFL clubs or clubs themselves arguing to be regionalised.....? That tells you all you need to know.

"Future of Junior Football" Not "Future of SPFL" !!!!!!

People pointing out the grammar in a well-meaning statement from the young anes. There's always going to be the odd dafty or two in big groups; the more sensible ones just need to police them a bit better and try to instill a pride in the club and it's/their reputation. The positives of the YT far outweigh the negatives.

Oh I've no doubt all these arguments are coming out because of a particular agenda but some of these idiotic points are bafflingly persitant. The league structure, particularly at the sort of "top of the semi-proffesional game" is absolutely not there as a primary driver for producing top players, improving the national team or helping Scottish clubs be more competitive in European competition. It's such an utterly inane thing to think. You can pull all sorts of examples of countries who do things completely differently in terms of league structure, some of which ar succesful, some of which aren't. Uruguay, a country with a smaller population than Scotland has 16 teams in the Premier division, some of which are semi-proffesional and cannot even host games against the bigger teams at their own grounds. And their national team has had incredible success for a country their size. Is that an argument for a 16 team premier league in any way? No. The league structure is primarly about creating an entertaining and meangiful competition with sporting integrity that allows clubs to progress and find their own level in their own way.

BINGO!

Mr and Mrs Abel now confirmed to have coronavirus. What a shame.

Absolute gutter. Have no idea why St Mirren stopped playing in the second half, they were all over us in the first and we came out with zero centre halves. Still, great comeback from Well. O'Hara was brilliant, and still have no idea why Aarons didn't shoot when running through on goal late on. Some game all in, well worth £12. All the best to St. Mirren in the next round.

Which means 37% do. That's 37% too many.

Dial nein nein nein?

Here’s an idea, how about we keep the singing but stop the flares? That way we still have the atmosphere but we keep within the law and don’t get the club into trouble.

Interesting, seeing as we all know what a vivid imaginaton you have...

I saw them searching a wee lassie's rucksack the other week. She could only have been about 4 years old. I couldn't believe it. For me its not about the hassle as such, as it isn't all that much of a hassle as Ben's pointed out, but the treatment of football fans as people who are to be viewed with suspicion that goes back to Thatcherite attempts to demonise normal folk who just want to go along to games.

The idea that the results of national teams are significantly influenced one way or the other by the structure of tiers 3-5 in their respective domestic leagues is a bit daft. The comparisons with the likes of Spain and Germany seem to miss the point that larger countries are larger. Saying 'these countries are bigger and footballing powerhouses but they regionalise sooner so surely a smaller less successful country like us should too' misses the point that playing nationally is easier in a smaller country. It's feasible for a club with an average attendance of around 500 to play nationally in Scotland in a way that it isn't in Spain, and more often than not clubs playing nationally in Scotland will be travelling shorter distances even compared to Spain's regional Segunda B anyway. As for the Croatia comparison which at least compares us with a country with a similar population, not that we don't have our own geographic challenges but you have to consider the distances needed to traverse Croatia considering the shape of it. As the crow flies the distance from Split to Osijek is similar to the distance between Stranraer and Inverness, but the most direct route by road covers about the same distance as Inverness to Rhyl or Glasgow to Southampton. There's therefore a greater need to regionalise sooner in Croatia, and even at that the average attendance in their national second tier is consistently below 500. That takes us to the more pertinent point than geography, as there are clubs as small as any we have playing nationally in Croatia as well. Our lower leagues are just stronger than theirs, considerably, and that's something we should be happy about. Our lower leagues are strong compared to other European countries and we should be proud that we have so many clubs capable of sustaining playing nationally and averaging much better crowds than others at the same tiers across Europe. That's something to talk up, not a reason to try to cut the number of clubs playing nationally.

TBF I'll fucking lamp you is not a bad saying for that card before she went and killed herself. I can remember in 2016 being gutted one morning when David Bowie died. I was working with some girl who was a bit of an airhead and had no clue who he was. I mentioned that day I was totally scunnered because I had listened to Bowie all my days and I was in a mood because he died. "Oh he wisnae yer best pal so get on with it". Now that was a great put down. Truth be told I was quite impressed and I vowed to say the same if someone like Kardashian died. Well guess who was all greeting and tears today at work about this and guess what I said.

What a total wet boy.

No idea who the commentator on Sportsound is, but he is excellent. Knocks Rob McLean into a box.

^^Recently started 'supporting' Liverpool.

Personally I've made my feelings clear. The club have been told I wont be staying on if we stay juniors. It's not a secret I've made my feelings clear to everyone

Well, yeah, smoke in an enclosed space is liable to cause tears. As for the Germany argument, I've been to a half dozen games over there, mostly St Pauli in Hamburg and while the fans tend to be very loud and very engaged they also self police quite ruthlessly. In the stadium nothing ever gets out of hand, no one ever steps out of line. They are choreographed by lads hanging off the crush barrier with megaphones. It's actually very regimented. Your group has the ability to stop flares, and other behaviours that bring negative focus on yourselves and the club. What you've got here is the difficult situation of whether you want to be a bunch of mates with no responsibility beyond your own personal conduct or be an actual fans group which gives you a certain amount of clout, makes it easier to sustain and grow and organise but also comes with a group responsibility to uphold a minimum level of conduct. There is no point dying on a hill about flares and broken seats, neither is is going to win you friends in the support or the club, neither, surely is the difference for you between a good day out or not.

People are getting way ahead of themselves. The LL/EoS are helping set-up a West of Scotland League. They're not looking to swallow-up other leagues or steal clubs from other area's, they just want to provide a route into the Pyramid that is currently difficult for clubs in the west to access. I expect they will set geographical guidelines so clubs know where they stand. I think the future of the SoS does rest with some form of link-up with the WoS in future, but as far as I am aware that is not the intention for now, it's simply to get the WoS up and running and not over complicate matters.

Other irrelevant pish deleted. It gets spouted because it is a fact and an influencer on the way in which the parties approach this. The 27 doesn't have to cede to the 1 if they judge that the price of doing so damages the interests of the 27. If you think the EU are on the cusp of being spiteful, I suggest you're not taking a balanced view and from a UK perspective you ain't seen nothing yet.

Absolutely not, but I think the structure of the league set up has a lot less to do with the players we develop than things like facilities, coaching standards and the number of people who actively play sports. Switzerland have been outperforming their population size for the best part of the last decade. Facilities here are far greater in number not to mention better in standard, and relatively cheaper to hire than back home. Coaching I cannot comment on as I have never really been involved in that but if it's like anything else here, you won't get near that position unless you are qualified to the correct level. As for numbers playing, football probably just about edges it as the main sport, though Ice Hockey is close and Winter sports in general have huge numbers. Most kids will grow up playing a few different things regularly(the missus nephews for example play football, handball and go skiing through the winter, a few other folk I know have kids who play football, handball, basketball and ice hockey at organised levels). I think the multi discipline aspect of it has a bug impact on things. It is maybe not specific to one sport but you are learning things that can cross over and be useful. FWIW the Swiss league is regionalised below tier 3, sort of. It's a slightly confusing set up which goes Super League(Tier 1), Challenge League(Tier 2), Promotion League(Tier 3), 1. Liga is the start of the 4th tier, there are 3 leagues which are loosely regionalised but have a few anomolies, and below that there are a few other similar leagues at tier 4, though some are steadfast in the regionalisation, Then tier 5 is a mix of regionalised and semi regionalised leagues, then tiers 6 and 7 which are entirely regionalised. All are organised by the SFL and pretty much anyone can go from bottom to top provided they are good enough and have the facilities. Not uncommon here also for bigger teams to go bankrupt and be kicked out of the top league, only to reform and start again in the lower levels. Lausanne, Servette and Neuchatel have all done that in the last decade. They tend to put those teams in at tier 4 initially because there is no point in starting them lower and letting full time professionals play against guys who turn up half cut from the Friday night... ETA: It's also not uncommon for teams to have more than one side in the pyramid. Most top league sides have 2nd and 3rd teams in at tier 3 and below. Even the wee towns and village sides will have more than one team. Only stipulation there is that the teams cannot play in the same league and the 2nd/3rd/4th team cannot move above tier 3. This of course means players who aren't good enough to make it at the top can keep playing regularly at their own level, but also means the younger players are getting games against physically mature guys at a young age in an organised set up, which helps their development no end.

Will further reports reveal that the rock was in fact aimed at a seagull until it fell under the gravitational pull of Traynor's immense bulk?

It’s all about educating the Young Team, and ensuring they know the “Do’s & Don’ts”, most of which is common sense but that’s out the window when your 16-18 & pished! They’ve been excellent. However, reportedly broken seats at Falkirk, Livi & Partick, is no accident, that’s a reoccurring theme of vandalism (just stop breaking seats!) - that’s not to say accidents don’t happen. For the Pyro, I personally think it’s brilliant, however there is very much a time & a place for it, and enclosed spaces such as a concourse is not the place for it, it could have set a smoke alarm off and had Friday’s game abandoned, just a wee bit embarrassing...! Just don’t be stupid. And keep yourselves right. With the group getting as big as it is, some of you will need to step up and police your pals/area, and call out the folks that are doing the stupid stuff. Saves the Club sticking out Statements, leave that to the vile pair in Glasgow.

Excellent comment some football supporters are obsessed with full time football.I really think Queens need to have a major look at our current set up currently in my opinion we are picking up the dross of players who wish to remain full time that no other clubs want.

I think it’s abit silly really to be comparing our league structure to that of others, if your not looking fully into the details then it’s very easy to draw up odd conclusions. One of the worst(and yet most common) is companion to England. You see people mentioning that clubs up here shouldn’t be playing nationally when England only has 3 times the clubs playing nationally despite being 10 times the population. But it completely ignores that the national league north has clubs of similar size to our league 2 playing over a larger area. You get similar mistakes comparing with Europe. Yes Spain regionalises very early, but those regions can be absolutely huge. You can look at Netherlands or Belgium but there strong politics in those countries, they aren’t creating perfect systems. You also can end up comparing with structures with vastly different histories. When large chunks of Europe have had national leagues for Half (or less) as long as us then it’s not a right to compare. Each nation can only create what’s right for themselves, as things stand we seem to be approaching the correct structure for tiers 1-6. we can argue over what happens if as expected the lowland region gains a lot of licensed clubs and this results in a significant disparity with the HL. Should it split? should it get some form of weighting to increase the likelihood of promotion? Let’s discuss. theres absolutely no debate over scrapping the national status of full time clubs like rovers/Falkirk/Airdrie, none.

If Arbroath went full time right now we would almost certainly have to make do with a squad of worse players than we currently have just to fulfil that ambition, IMO it shouldn’t even be considered right now.

Woke up to the devastating news Andrew Weatherall, an absolute fucking pioneer had passed. Only last night the wife and i were listening to his 'Musics not for Everyone ' show on NTS, and we were planning our trip to Carcasonne in September for his festival Convanenza. Im sure many PnB'ers of a certian vintage will feel the same, we lost a musical savant , no nonsense amazing human and fucking astounding genius. Was lucky enough to see him a few times at Pure and the Blue Room. My wife was lucky enough to see him at ALFOS a few times. I hope they still run the festival in his honour. 56 fucking years old. So sad. Don those ceremonial robes 1 more time Gnostic traveler, rest in peace.

If Motherwell do go through, this will absolutely be one of the best posts I have ever read in my time on P&B.

Standard redneck chat on here if you're not posting some generic shit that plays to the masses. He epitomised the late 80s/early 90s indie/dance crossover with the the remixes you mentioned and others when the likes of The Stone Roses acted like a part of it but only were by association imo. Happy Mondays always had that edge over them. He should have left MBV - Soon alone imo but others say it's the greatest remix of all time.

I've been thinking about this post because I have, for quite different reasons, a strong affection for both Fauldhouse and Blackburn and have followed their development for a number of years. They have become quite different clubs. Blackburn is a community football club. Alongside the 1st team there is a successful U20s, women and girls teams, boys teams across most age groups. Blackburn's ground will be a hive of activity most days of the week. I like Blackburn's management of all this and pushing forward with ground developments with an eye on possible future licensing requirements. On the pitch Blackburn regularly have a number of players who have come through their own boys clubs (and now the U20s) and are competing now at a higher level than they have ever achieved previously and, fingers crossed, hopefully they can keep this up even on their shoestring budget. I know Fauldhouse have a dedicated committee and management team but the focus of the club feels much more limited to, or focused on, the next fixture. I've no doubt Fauldhouse would benefit from moving away from the shrinking East Juniors pool but I'm not as convinced they would be in as good a position as Blackburn to take advantage of the other benefits of EoS football.

Lost buildings - Renfrew Airport. I mean, just look at it, a work of art.

Aye, let’s get WoSFL up and running first.

The last thing we need on this thread is introducing politics into the mix.

For the visit of the club with the most major honors in this tin pot league, it's only right.

Some may feel it is an over reaction. I object to the fact that you can go through one entrance and not be searched and yet you go through another and you do get searched. Also there is one particular steward who is really rude. I stopped going to Queens games for a while and the main reason was the search. When I complained I was told I would not be allowed in. After 50 years of going to watch my team it made me feel uncomfortable enough to call it a day. It is not the searches that bother me, it is the fact that it is selective and sexist in that only males going through a certain gate get searched. If it does not bother you then fine, we all have different opinions. The same steward last season confronted a group of 14 year old away supporters just as they walked up with a tirade about one strike and you are out. The boys were well behaved and quiet and just looked at him in surprise. The whole thing is way over the top. Yes as a sixty year old reasonably respectable human being I object to being manhandled for no reason at all. I have come back to the occasional game but every time I do it hacks me off having to go through the search bit. Ok, maybe I am just old and grumpy but that's what I think. Great win and performance on Saturday. Team, not stewards.

Is this something we see only or more often among the twenty clubs at tiers 3 and 4 in Scotland though? You'll find Scottish clubs at tiers 1 and 2 who overspend, you'll find examples of Scottish clubs lower down the structure overspending or junior clubs who do. You'll find clubs all up and down the league structure in England (and every other country) who do it. Without proving this is something we see significantly more of among semi-proffesional clubs in national leagues in Scotland because of the league structure they're in, then a few random examples that you think seem to prove your point are absolutely meaningless. Also, does anyon beleive that Raith Rovers wouldn't have overspent if they'd gone into a regionalised 'League 1 North' instead of a national League 1? If anything, it might even lead to larger losses. The idea that these clubs would say 'Ah well, we're in a regional league now, better cut the cloth accordingly' is utterly deluded.

We were never going to be helped by a Council that included the Goldie twins of evil. They loathe anything to do with FFC.

But he didn't. He claimed Traynor was a bully that everyone agrees with. Even if they don't he still has a right to say it if he believes he is one. He did not claim Traynor leaked the Morelos brake tampering story, he maybe inferred it but stopped short. He did say Traynor's P.R. for The Rangers is a disaster and he's not wrong there. He relentlessly pilloried Levein and, even as a Hibee, I thought he over stepped the mark on occasions but absolutely nothing was done and no apology ever uttered from the BBC. If you can't see this as biased censorship and kowtowing to one of the nastiest businesses in World Football you need to wake up.

I thought HMRC put a stop to those?

Well yeah, anything sounds outrageous if you don't provide any sort of context. On the environmental policies, this is something that is in place with current FTAs with Canada, Japan, South Korea, Singapore, Ukraine etc. It's something that there has been recent demand for in the prospect of a US arrangement (which I think would be unlikely given their stronger negotiating position) and is just a common 21st century arrangement. 'Sustainable development' is a decent and very cheap way to keep on message and pressure to make sure that international cooperation continues. In all, I'm astonished if it would really get anyone knickers in a twist, it probably won't be anything that enforceable anyway. On subsidy, the FTA will allow the UK access of some sort to the single market with goods and services being traded between with some sort of prior agreement on low or non existent tariffs for most of the economy. When implementing an arrangement, what would happen if overnight, the UK bailed out or offered huge incentives to car manufacturers which subsidised them to a level where they had considerable advantage over manufacturers in the EU? Suddenly, companies are going bankrupt and the principles of the single market mean that the German government (for example) couldn't dive in with similar packages. It's common sense and both parties need to have some sort of agreement on state aid and it needs to be enforceable (through the use of some sort of arbitration process) to some degree - as exists with the agreements right now. The UK are stating their interests of having a Canada style arrangement with some bonus points (to try and harness the best of all worlds) and the EU are uncomfortable with giving a competitive advantage away but would not like the economic disruption of the UK leaving its sphere so is looking for a more comprehensive arrangement (more so than previous deals which makes sense given this is totally unprecedented). That's just life and anyone throwing a hissy fit about the 'big bad EU' and being emotive about it really has little credibility. We can only critique our own position which, for now at least, is heavily influenced by a lunatic SPAD who seems to have gained prominence by spouting pseudoscience nonsense in a blog and driven by financing that would be quite happy to see us shrink the size of government to nothing and eliminate workers rights. We've got an absolute shitfest of really vile human beings and nasty fuckers who have rode a wave of populism into office, let's look at our own house first and not get tricked into directing our inevitable anger into the wrong place.

It's East fuckin Fife. Nothing marks how low we've stooped that some think they might actually give us a game. M&M have cleared the negativity out of the dressing room so let's get these backwards hicksville c***s stuffed. 4-0 at least.

They'd have to be stark raven mad.

He already is.

Below Arbroath, and still coming out firing. Fair play.