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May as well contribute my tuppence worth to this debate. A lot of talk about what makes a club a big player in the junior grade. Many HAVE been big names over a fairly short period of time, Armadale were a fairly successfull club during the late 1940's , early 50's , likewise Broxburn and a few others. In the west Lugar and Annbank had short periods with great teams, Central League had Petershill, Ashfield , even Clydebank enjoying a lot of success. The common factor was a location in areas with thriving industrial and mining bases which have now gone into decline or disappeared altogether. No junior club has enjoyed almost unbroken success over their entire history in the way that the old firm have in the Senior grade. For me, that is what makes the juniors so fascinating, a new club can emerge and very quickly become a major force. Witness Johnstone Burgh in the early 1960's, Tayport in the 90's, and I suppose Kelty today. The hard part is sustaining it beyond the time when the founding group of people are no longer around. Clubs rise and fall, and no harm in looking back to a time when your own club ruled the roost, my own club, Kilsyth Rangers, were arguably the most successful club over a fifteen year period from the mid 1950's till the late 60's and I was very fortunate to be around to enjoy that success. Since then we have had some good periods, aznd some not so good but we are still around and competing and ever hopeful of winning a major trophy once again. Change is coming, no doubt about it, the setup in the lower regions of Scottish football will be unrecognisable in five years time from what it is at present. It may be forced from above, or the current administration may accept change, but it does need a major shift in thinking, many smaller clubs will have to admit they cannot continue in their present form and revert to local amateur leagues. The more ambitious clubs will look upwards, as Kelty have done, and decide to find their level within a new unified organisation. Dare I say it, along the lines of what happens down South?

But this wasn’t a spur of the moment decision, whilst fuelled with alcohol, was it? It’s not like, in the heat of the moment, they found somewhere in the stand to buy these fake eyes. These were purchased in advance, in order to go to a football match and mock a disabled man at his place of work. Why should the media ignore this? I don’t know of any other one-eyed professional players. It’s clearly very rare. Can you please point me in the direction of any evidence that abusing the disabled has “been happening for years at fitba”? Dean Shiels should be someone that children with similar problems can look up to, and give them some belief that they can achieve their dreams. If incidents like this are dealt with appropriately, it shows that they have the support of the media, SFA, police etc. If incidents like this are ignored, it will probably put these kids off of trying to play in professional football, as they will be subjected to discrimination and given no support or backing. Also, throwing the fake eyes may have been a small minority, but there were a lot of Falkirk fans singing about Dean Shiels having one eye, mocking his disability. Fans in all sections were getting involved in that. Why do you think that was acceptable? Let’s face it, things like that have certainly encouraged these morons with the fake eyes, to think they’re behaviour is acceptable. Even after these started getting thrown on the pitch, there was a good chunk of the away end joining in this song. Have a word with yourselves. If you joined in with that mockery, you’re part of the problem.

Why would he have names in mind? Do you deny that the East/West combined league was scuppered first and foremost by clubs not wanting to travel? That wasn't just the view of small clubs - it applied to a number of the larger ones. In future, some of them will need to set aside their misgivings on the travel issue and move forward with the rest or they'll need to nail their colours to a local football environment at whatever level that happens to be. For some clubs on a limited budget, amateur football may be the place to be. In a proper pyramid, amateur clubs would also find their level - those who play on a Saturday anyway. So nobody needs to disappear. They just play at the level that suits their ability on and off the pitch. The only thing that disappears is junior football - it's only a name.

If I was abused like this at my work I'd definitely want my employer to take all possible steps to ensure that the perpetrators were caught and punished.

Totally agree. Absolutely terrible throwing those eyeballs. 100% agree with the club. This is nothing to do with football, just purely nasty. Some people are born with mental, genetic, or physical deformations or illnesses. This could be family members. Sibling, parents, grandparents, or your own child. This is deeply hurting for the person involved, in this case Dean Shiels, who has had to live with a childhood accident which has caused the loss of site it one eye. I say fair play to him that he has overcome this, and has played to the standards he has in football. Those thugs today are a disgrace to themselves, Ffc, and their own family. Well done to Dunfermline today on their victory. Thoroughly deserved. Well done to Dean Shiels on his professionalism. He is a real fighter who has more bottle, character and determination than our whole midfield. Dean, you are an honourable man, and a man I would be proud to have in my team. Enough of the nastiness folks. Banter is acceptable, but never cruel

And that's it - what we have just now has clubs in different set-ups overlapping in terms of ability and locale. Team X could have a game vs Wishaw or Colville Park, Team Y vs Lochgelly or Leven United. It's football, 11 vs 11, winner gets the points and might even go up a level to play a higher standard of opposition. It's how it works in virtually all other parts of this universe. And it's not rocket science. It is however a wee bit complicated!

Dunfermline should be the ones getting hammered for allowing that kind of thing into their ground. This week it was fake eyeballs, but next week it could be grenades.

Perhaps the clubs themselves when they bleat about travelling beyond the cosy confines of their own locality?

It's OK to just say "Some of our fans are scumbags, and what they did was horrible", you know. Nobody will think it makes you any less of a Falkirk fan.

Fair play from the club, this shite isn't on. It's one thing O'Hara saying something in the heat of the moment then apologising, chucking those eyeballs onto the park was totally out of order. We'll rightly get a reputation for this pish.

My club members appear not to be keen on taking the line Kelty have taken. They've yet to express a view on something that is much wider and sees a wholesale revamp of non league football. You're managing to confuse 2 very different questions - quite deliberately of course. And to turn the comment back, we all know what your opinion is so you probably don't need to defend it at every turn - although I can see why you might feel the need given that there are very few others commenting who seem to agree with you whilst there are a whole raft of people on this topic who are happy to debate the shape of the change. I love it when it all boils down to "if you don't like it, f**k off". You'll find that offer being taken up with increasing regularity. The reason the game is struggling at this level is a result of inertia. The junior cup situation is a disgrace. It should never cost clubs hundreds or thousands a year to be part of the premier competition.

There's c***s on each side of it, it shouldn't tar the club and the rest of their fans though. There's having a laugh at games, and on here where we all 'hate' each other and have our bit of banter and it's all a laugh at the end of the day. Then there's the folk that genuinely want to go out their way and do the worst things imaginable. I might have a go at Falkirk and their fans and call them a diddy team here and there () but there's 100% a good amount of you lot that are good guys and at the end of the day a good laugh here. It goes without saying that the folk that go out of their way to cause the hassle that's already been dragged up aren't really fans of any team whatsoever. It'd be wrong and disrespectful to Falkirk and their fans to link what happened at the weekend to fans who support their local team weekly when they could easily just go on and watch one of the ugly twins from Glasgow.

Just a little extra to add to that. I play in the English pyramid, fairly low down admittedly, lvl 12. It's not uncommon for teams below this level to be promoted / relegated more than one league. For example a team starting at the bottom of the Bristol and district leage (B&D 5) may win every game by an 8 goal margin as they're a new team re formed from a now defunct one.... see 'rangers'. They might be promoted 3 leagues. Likewise teams can ask to be relegated more than one league. In practical terms, if tweedmouth got relegated into the east superleage, they'd be spanked every single week. They may well wish to be at the bottom league and be more competitive. In the SOSL, I dare say many of them wouldn't want to be in the top league in the west..... someone could just ask them? the point being this is really simple stuff. It's becoming apparent that self interest by blazers is making this a lot harder than it need be. Self interest in Scottish football - shock.

The SPFL don't run the Scottish Cup, champ.

Very pleased to see most Falkirk fans on here condemning this without the "what about the OF?" or "just a minority" shite. You don't deserve the reputation your support will gain because of this.

Totally agree. There seems to be a perverse mentality amongst some football fans in general and my club at the moment that any form of criticism, even if something as abhorrent is an act of betrayal or disloyalty. For me it is simple, those that carried this out don’t support any club that I associate with. They are not fans or supporters, they need to be rooted out and banned. Also fed up hearing some try to excuse or justify their actions. Claiming that it is ‘banter’, or that ‘they’ started it or that ‘other’ clubs do likewise. Also that those that find this offensive are just the easily offended. Total bullshit. It was a shameful act and in my opinion anyone that defends or it is part of the issue. The club statement was a good one but too little to late and should have been made after the SFA proceedings were completed initially . However I think regardless the statement will not make a difference to those involved as this type of behaviour is entrenched in a small minority who seem to live for this type of hate filled shit. Sadly this incident will just escalate what was once a fairly harmless rivalry into more hate. Although the FFC players should be given credit for taking direct action to stop it by ensuring we won’t be playing each other next year.

These games were funnier when it was all about pishy broon shoes and banjo music on the tannoy. There’s always a bunch of c***s willing to take it too far.

Shite from the fans but a very good statement from the club. Not much more they can do after that.

What a tumour of a club.

The league table surely?

Horrendous behaviour from some of our so called fans yesterday, absolutely vile. Hopefully both clubs can work with the police, get the CCTV viewed and get them identified. I love banter/rivalry but this is neither. As if this clusterfuck of a season couldn't get any worse.

I’d rather ‘Rangeman’ was introduced to a comma above all else to be honest.

It was a sizeable minority. Sickening, but not surprising, to see fellow fans behaving like that at EEP. Bad enough that Hartley has made us a laughing stock on the park, but now this. Terrible time to be a Bairn!

"The former Partick Thistle midfielder picked up a knock"

That would mean the Junior Superleagues at the same level as the LL, I very much doubt that will ever happen eg why should the East Superleague be considered above the EoSFL where Kelty are, the Juniors can't just expect to leapfrog a whole league that is already in the Pyramid. Simple solution, plug the East Superleague below the EoSFL, invite applications for the remaining three places to make it up to 16 (priority given to league position eg Linlithgow, Bo'ness, Bonnyrigg), and then have two up/two down from Superleague to EoSFL (or three up/down). Within two or three seasons the EoSFL will be 90% Junior clubs, and some of them will be have progressed through into the LL, the poorer EoSFL clubs will have headed downwards through the junior leagues to a more appropriate level. Within 4-5 seasons, everyone will wonder what all the fuss was about. Do the same in the West with a new WoSFL (which would be almost all Junior clubs anyway). The "North of Tay" clubs in the East can stay where they are for now until the situation with the HFL/North Juniors is sorted and in place. The Junior Blazerati can join with the EoSFL and SoSFL Blazerati to form a new board to oversee WoSFL / EoSFL / SoSFL. In time, merge the SoSFL into the West set-up.

I can't believe it may come down to fines because people were not frisked appropriately to locate potentially dangerous items or plastic eyeballs. At the end of the day we are not scum Old Firm fans and we mostly all know the line and not to cross it so for f**k sake lets all just get back to proper football and patter. Between two real, decent football clubs we shouldn't need the anti terrorism pish just to get a bridie and a sing song at a game.

Sadly you are right that DAFC could end up carrying the can for this. Our stewards should have prevented things being thrown onto the park. Personally I think action will be only taken if the cctv footage can identify anyone throwing things onto the park, otherwise it'll be some more statements Here's hoping our fans don't keep this going when we next come to Grangemouth.

Labels that the English done away with over 40 years ago. Senior/Junior/Amateur, pish, we're all just football clubs and we don't need umpteen National Associations to run our game.

Iv not submitted a score this week but my Mrs just got home with our new arrival today so once things have settled I will take them. Also as no-one set the final for the cup I will sort this for Kincardine and alang1993. My apologies gents but some things take priority lol

Whataboutery ahoy!

When it’s ok for a grown up to wear a football top on holiday.

The smoking ban is an SPFL rule and nothing to do with Queens. It is also the single worst reason I have ever heard for not attending a match. Presumably these same people also boycott public transport and places like the cinema as well?

“If these clubs are as ambitious as some on here would lead you to believe then why are they not leaving for the greener grass just now? I`ve no problem with ambition if that`s what you want to call it and clubs (office bearers, custodians etc ) can choose as they see fit but why the clamour to dismantle the junior grade (imperfect as it is and there`s already a thread running to cover it and how it could be improved) in the process. There`s a pathway there so why don`t they take it? If they are that confident then make the step/jump like Kelty already have. “ You’d have to ask the people in charge of their clubs that 1. Timing, seeing how Kelty do, seeing if the SJFA can lead from the front and bring change, fear of being the loud kids in the class, fear of the unknown, who knows. Dismantling the Junior grade? The only people that will ever be held responsible for that are the guys in charge of the SJFA, I’m afraid, no one else. The no sponsor for years for the Best Cup competition in Scotland outwith The Will Scot Cup is a massive sign to where they are at, Surely that’s 1 of the remits for the guys in charge so the grade is promoted to the best of their ability? The SJFA should have served their clubs correctly and been at the fore front for any SFA Licencing and being part of a pyramid, clubs are now wisening up and now slowly questioning why they aren’t part of it and are on the outside looking in. Can you tell me why the SJFA didn’t lead on the pyramid and make a real push to be part of it? The results of the feedback forms that clubs filled in a few years ago as regards to the pyramid and improvements to the Junior grade were never published as far as I’m aware, they would be interesting to see. I get being in charge of a grade or serving as an office bearer is mostly a thankless task and I have a level of sympathy for TJ and the guys leading the SJFA at times but the constant backward thinking that comes out is not half making things even more difficult for them. Their remit is surely to do the best for their associated clubs, if doing their best was to ignore the pyramid and SJFA clubs being refused an SFA licence then that will be the downfall.

If these clubs are as ambitious as some on here would lead you to believe then why are they not leaving for the greener grass just now? I`ve no problem with ambition if that`s what you want to call it and clubs (office bearers, custodians etc ) can choose as they see fit but why the clamour to dismantle the junior grade (imperfect as it is and there`s already a thread running to cover it and how it could be improved) in the process. There`s a pathway there so why don`t they take it? If they are that confident then make the step/jump like Kelty already have.

Do they have better rates than loan sharks?

Best post to date.

Was just going to post the same, a quick look at that stupid facebook group is an easy way to identify the arseholes.

You got it spot on with the young part. Young, uneducated, drinking on an empty heid bunch of goons. Half of which aren’t even fans but hangers on trying to be relevant. Instead making themselves look fucking stupid and bringing the name of the club down.

Dunfermline v Falkirk is a big game that always has an edge to it and saw Dunfermline get their second win in a row to stay in the top four despite coming into those games on the back of seven without a win, while leaving Falkirk six points adrift in second bottom. There are several narratives they could focus on there, along with one goalkeeper reportedly having an excellent debut while the other had a shocker and some unsavoury stuff off the park as well. What do the BBC focus on to begin their match report? http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/42481455 Sometimes people over-react, like 7-2 in that Hemmings story, but there's a reason the BBC have a reputation for shoehorning Rangers references in where they don't belong. Who gives a f**k about Falkirk's assistant manager in the context of this game?

Unsurprising to see horribly disgusting racist c***s like Brazilianlex defend fellow ill-mannered supporters. A genuinely deplorable character.

U2 - I Will Follow

IRA Tony plays for us ffs. This Bain lad will hardly be noticed in the dressing room.

Kelty Hearts now have a stature that surpasses that of the clubs you've mentioned, funny what a forward progressive thinking club can achieve isn't it?

Don't think there's anything at all that the club could have done about it other than ask that no-one attending did anything stupid at the game and, let's face it, the morons involved would just have ignored that.

I'm sure the SFA will find a way. The Falkirk statement is just simply far to late, the initial game and incident was months ago, the first player was convicted over 8 weeks ago and we've had it reported in the national press about the Falkirk fans up in Inverness, that's when this statement should've been released. I do appreciate there was a small tidbit at the end of some column in the sun but it wasn't nearly strong enough, if they do get a fine then it will be nothing that the board of Falkirk don't deserve.

As for the idiots throwing eyes, making racist comments and any other form of hissing/abusive chanting concerning people who actually DIED, can you all go somewhere else please on match days! Preferably somewhere you can maybe grow up/gain some perspective on how sad and regressive your world view is? Genuinely made me feel disgusted to be sitting anywhere near them let alone wearing the same colour shirt and scarf.

A true member of the Hibee clan. Bain will need to pull a holy goalie and display the proud tri-colours on his shirt to the fans before coming anywhere close to our black and tan eater.

Do not understand why Wright had to bring this subject into the public domain . Is he trying to create a division between the Fans and our Chairman ? . If so i think he is making a very big mistake . Tommy has given us all some great memories over past 5/6 years but Saints Fans should remember that none of this would have been possible without the excellent stewardship of The Browns during the past 25 years + . He had the right to ask the Chairman about the possibility of taking the players on a winter break but when this was turned down it should have been kept within the club . All managers have a shelf life and i wonder if Tommy Wrights is almost up at Saints.

He’s after my cheese and beer