Rangers Have To Bow To Modernity
Rangers is a very troubled institution at the present moment. The magnificent, classical façade of the main entrance has lost none of its allure and as for the sheer scale and beauty of the fabled marble staircase, there are no words that can be added.
But the very bricklayers and stone masons who erected this quite startling edifice, would be shocked to see the inner turmoil within the hallowed corridors of Scotland's second team. There I have gone and said it. Rangers have been overtaken by their bitter rivals across the city, in the east end.
Just about the same time the artisans at Govan were putting the finishing touches to Ibrox Park, desperately poor Irish, Catholic immigrants were flooding into the Empire's second city.
Despised and feared, these poor souls were to form the huge pool of cheap labour which was exploited by unscrupulous and immoral employers. If the Irish immigrant remained the unskilled, feckless labourer then his native Scottish counterpart was more likely the foreman or boss.
This direct comparison was more or less the same relationship between Glasgow Rangers (note the proprietal use of the city's name) and Celtic.
As the big ships sailed up and down the Clyde, Rangers were secure in the knowledge that they prevailed over 'alien' figures within the city. The plight of the hapless, largely ignorant Irish immigrants was put into stark contrast with the Scottish emphasis on self education, natural intelligence and duty.
More than one hundred years later, the shoe is very much on the other foot. The big ships no longer go up and down the River Clyde. Heavy industry no longer exists in the west of Scotland.
The great grandchildren of those Irish immigrants are now an integral and essential part of Glasgow's identity. Their quick wit, wily ways and indefatigable charm makes them the face of ordinary Glaswegians. They are now far more likely to be in positions of authority and responsibilty.
Above all, it is in their own team we see their greatest achievement. A club made in their own image, an identity second to none and with a support that is the envy of the world, Celtic has come of age. They will play those fellow giants Manchester United on Wednesday evening. For Celtic right now a win, a draw or even a loss does not really matter. The fact that they are on the same stage as the English giants is the key issue. Celtic is run professionally and those in power never lose sight of the club's historic mission. The much maligned John Reid has proved to be an inspirational choice to replace the irrepressible Brian Quinn. He positively exudes passion when he discusses his beloved Celtic.
Back over at Ibrox, things are not looking good. The night of mass madness in Manchester cannot be easily erased from the nation's conscience. As a public relations exercise, it was an unmitigated disaster. The sight of policemen being attacked by drunken thugs put the club back fifteen years in terms of public perception.
Above all Sir David Murray himself conveys a sense of ennui, a man utterly fed up with trying to defend the red handed, red necks who are driving his club to the very edge. As the USA is poised to elect a black man as President, (a fact that would have been inconceivable just five years ago), Rangers still have fans in their midst who make the Klu Klux Klan look like an enlightened organization. Murray can announce as many campaigns as he wants to deal with sectarianism and racism, but deep down he knows that he is onto a loser. He cannot change hearts and minds, this is a societal problem and one which needs to be addressed by politicians, churches and above all the police. Time is running out for a dated, poisonous and ultimately anachronistic set of beliefs that do not belong in the year 2008.
Rangers have been put on warning, they really need to listen before the bell tolls for the last time.
Full Version: Rangers Have To Bow To Modernity
Is this your own opinion or is it an article from somewhere? If so, where?
Good Lord
QUOTE (glasnost @ Nov 3 2008, 14:30) 
Rangers Have To Bow To Modernity
Rangers is a very troubled institution at the present moment. The magnificent, classical façade of the main entrance has lost none of its allure and as for the sheer scale and beauty of the fabled marble staircase, there are no words that can be added.
But the very bricklayers and stone masons who erected this quite startling edifice, would be shocked to see the inner turmoil within the hallowed corridors of Scotland's second team. There I have gone and said it. Rangers have been overtaken by their bitter rivals across the city, in the east end.
Just about the same time the artisans at Govan were putting the finishing touches to Ibrox Park, desperately poor Irish, Catholic immigrants were flooding into the Empire's second city.
Despised and feared, these poor souls were to form the huge pool of cheap labour which was exploited by unscrupulous and immoral employers. If the Irish immigrant remained the unskilled, feckless labourer then his native Scottish counterpart was more likely the foreman or boss.
This direct comparison was more or less the same relationship between Glasgow Rangers (note the proprietal use of the city's name) and Celtic.
As the big ships sailed up and down the Clyde, Rangers were secure in the knowledge that they prevailed over 'alien' figures within the city. The plight of the hapless, largely ignorant Irish immigrants was put into stark contrast with the Scottish emphasis on self education, natural intelligence and duty.
More than one hundred years later, the shoe is very much on the other foot. The big ships no longer go up and down the River Clyde. Heavy industry no longer exists in the west of Scotland.
The great grandchildren of those Irish immigrants are now an integral and essential part of Glasgow's identity. Their quick wit, wily ways and indefatigable charm makes them the face of ordinary Glaswegians. They are now far more likely to be in positions of authority and responsibilty.
Above all, it is in their own team we see their greatest achievement. A club made in their own image, an identity second to none and with a support that is the envy of the world, Celtic has come of age. They will play those fellow giants Manchester United on Wednesday evening. For Celtic right now a win, a draw or even a loss does not really matter. The fact that they are on the same stage as the English giants is the key issue. Celtic is run professionally and those in power never lose sight of the club's historic mission. The much maligned John Reid has proved to be an inspirational choice to replace the irrepressible Brian Quinn. He positively exudes passion when he discusses his beloved Celtic.
Back over at Ibrox, things are not looking good. The night of mass madness in Manchester cannot be easily erased from the nation's conscience. As a public relations exercise, it was an unmitigated disaster. The sight of policemen being attacked by drunken thugs put the club back fifteen years in terms of public perception.
Above all Sir David Murray himself conveys a sense of ennui, a man utterly fed up with trying to defend the red handed, red necks who are driving his club to the very edge. As the USA is poised to elect a black man as President, (a fact that would have been inconceivable just five years ago), Rangers still have fans in their midst who make the Klu Klux Klan look like an enlightened organization. Murray can announce as many campaigns as he wants to deal with sectarianism and racism, but deep down he knows that he is onto a loser. He cannot change hearts and minds, this is a societal problem and one which needs to be addressed by politicians, churches and above all the police. Time is running out for a dated, poisonous and ultimately anachronistic set of beliefs that do not belong in the year 2008.
Rangers have been put on warning, they really need to listen before the bell tolls for the last time.
Rangers is a very troubled institution at the present moment. The magnificent, classical façade of the main entrance has lost none of its allure and as for the sheer scale and beauty of the fabled marble staircase, there are no words that can be added.
But the very bricklayers and stone masons who erected this quite startling edifice, would be shocked to see the inner turmoil within the hallowed corridors of Scotland's second team. There I have gone and said it. Rangers have been overtaken by their bitter rivals across the city, in the east end.
Just about the same time the artisans at Govan were putting the finishing touches to Ibrox Park, desperately poor Irish, Catholic immigrants were flooding into the Empire's second city.
Despised and feared, these poor souls were to form the huge pool of cheap labour which was exploited by unscrupulous and immoral employers. If the Irish immigrant remained the unskilled, feckless labourer then his native Scottish counterpart was more likely the foreman or boss.
This direct comparison was more or less the same relationship between Glasgow Rangers (note the proprietal use of the city's name) and Celtic.
As the big ships sailed up and down the Clyde, Rangers were secure in the knowledge that they prevailed over 'alien' figures within the city. The plight of the hapless, largely ignorant Irish immigrants was put into stark contrast with the Scottish emphasis on self education, natural intelligence and duty.
More than one hundred years later, the shoe is very much on the other foot. The big ships no longer go up and down the River Clyde. Heavy industry no longer exists in the west of Scotland.
The great grandchildren of those Irish immigrants are now an integral and essential part of Glasgow's identity. Their quick wit, wily ways and indefatigable charm makes them the face of ordinary Glaswegians. They are now far more likely to be in positions of authority and responsibilty.
Above all, it is in their own team we see their greatest achievement. A club made in their own image, an identity second to none and with a support that is the envy of the world, Celtic has come of age. They will play those fellow giants Manchester United on Wednesday evening. For Celtic right now a win, a draw or even a loss does not really matter. The fact that they are on the same stage as the English giants is the key issue. Celtic is run professionally and those in power never lose sight of the club's historic mission. The much maligned John Reid has proved to be an inspirational choice to replace the irrepressible Brian Quinn. He positively exudes passion when he discusses his beloved Celtic.
Back over at Ibrox, things are not looking good. The night of mass madness in Manchester cannot be easily erased from the nation's conscience. As a public relations exercise, it was an unmitigated disaster. The sight of policemen being attacked by drunken thugs put the club back fifteen years in terms of public perception.
Above all Sir David Murray himself conveys a sense of ennui, a man utterly fed up with trying to defend the red handed, red necks who are driving his club to the very edge. As the USA is poised to elect a black man as President, (a fact that would have been inconceivable just five years ago), Rangers still have fans in their midst who make the Klu Klux Klan look like an enlightened organization. Murray can announce as many campaigns as he wants to deal with sectarianism and racism, but deep down he knows that he is onto a loser. He cannot change hearts and minds, this is a societal problem and one which needs to be addressed by politicians, churches and above all the police. Time is running out for a dated, poisonous and ultimately anachronistic set of beliefs that do not belong in the year 2008.
Rangers have been put on warning, they really need to listen before the bell tolls for the last time.
ZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzz.............
....................sorry I fell asleep there.............................................I imagine that took you a while to write up that rubbish. I feel sorry that you have wasted such a large portion of your life on an ill fated fishing excursion. Yawn..................I think I will read the first few sentences again................it's better than jellies!
QUOTE (Colin M @ Nov 3 2008, 14:59)
Is this your own opinion or is it an article from somewhere? If so, where?
"The much maligned John Reid has proved to be an inspirational choice to replace the irrepressible Brian Quinn."
QUOTE (glasnost @ Nov 3 2008, 15:03)
"The much maligned John Reid has proved to be an inspirational choice to replace the irrepressible Brian Quinn."
Heh, I asked before I read it. Where's it from?
QUOTE (Colin M @ Nov 3 2008, 15:15)
Heh, I asked before I read it. Where's it from?
'Fly Fishing' by J.R. Hartley
QUOTE (fatman76 @ Nov 3 2008, 15:00)
ZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzz.............
....................sorry I fell asleep there.............................................I imagine that took you a while to write up that rubbish. I feel sorry that you have wasted such a large portion of your life on an ill fated fishing excursion. Yawn..................I think I will read the first few sentences again................it's better than jellies!
....................sorry I fell asleep there.............................................I imagine that took you a while to write up that rubbish. I feel sorry that you have wasted such a large portion of your life on an ill fated fishing excursion. Yawn..................I think I will read the first few sentences again................it's better than jellies!
It took me all of a few seconds to cut and paste it. In fact, it would have taken me less to do that than it did for you to post your reply above.
what's the source of the article?
QUOTE (Fizzy Gillespie @ Nov 3 2008, 16:46)
what's the source of the article?
I've no idea - but it's badly researched, viz:
1. The Ibrox facade may well be 'magnificent' but certainly isn't 'classical'. Not sure how you'd classify it, maybe Industrial Art Deco, but not Classical.
2. The facade was built in 1929. I doubt many, "desperately poor Irish, Catholic immigrants were flooding into the Empire's second city" then.
3. It's The Rangers Football Club plc. Glasgow Rangers is simply common usage rather than, "proprietal use of the city's name."
I'd say the qualitiative content of the piece reflects its factual inaccuracies.
The article is obviously written by a Celtic fan, the way No.8 (not the one on here, the FF one) does on FF.
QUOTE (glasnost @ Nov 3 2008, 14:30)
Rangers Have To Bow To Modernity
The great grandchildren of those Irish immigrants are now an integral and essential part of Glasgow's identity. Their quick wit, wily ways and indefatigable charm makes them the face of ordinary Glaswegians. They are now far more likely to be in positions of authority and responsibilty.
The great grandchildren of those Irish immigrants are now an integral and essential part of Glasgow's identity. Their quick wit, wily ways and indefatigable charm makes them the face of ordinary Glaswegians. They are now far more likely to be in positions of authority and responsibilty.
Even for the filth that article is ridiculously biased
And things didn't look so bad for Rangers when they humped you bunch of plastic paddys at home.
And things didn't look so bad for Rangers when they humped you bunch of plastic paddys at home.
QUOTE (glasnost @ Nov 3 2008, 15:30)
It took me all of a few seconds to cut and paste it. In fact, it would have taken me less to do that than it did for you to post your reply above.
So, any chance you could credit the site you copied and pasted from?
Or better still, just quote the first paragraph and give a link next time?
Or, even better still, just not bother?
QUOTE (fitbin @ Nov 3 2008, 18:57)
So, any chance you could credit the site you copied and pasted from?
Okay, hotmail.
QUOTE (fitbin @ Nov 3 2008, 18:57)
Or better still, just quote the first paragraph and give a link next time?
That wouldn't work.
QUOTE (fitbin @ Nov 3 2008, 18:57)
Or, even better still, just not bother?
No.
The solution is quite simple - you don't have to click onto the thread. Indeed, why not just put me on ignore.
so who is the author of the article, surely you should credit him/her?
honestly, haven't you been to university? sources, references, links.
honestly, haven't you been to university? sources, references, links.
QUOTE (Fizzy Gillespie @ Nov 3 2008, 19:04)
so who is the author of the article, surely you should credit him/her?
I have no idea.
Paranoia FC continues to forget they too are also bigots.
Murray is just biding his time before he gets a buyer and he will eventually.The currant buns struggles is holding Celtic back due to our boards lack of ambition.You would have thought that after reaching the last 16 twice we may have tried to build on that success but due to the troubles at the pox we are happy to be just in front of them.Not too much in front though because that would not be interesting.
Celtic could have twisted the knife into Rangers especially after Manchester by signing some real champion league quality players but we did not due to the them being in the shite.
As long as there is the "as long as we beat the Hnus" mentality Celtic will not progress in Europe ,instead we will go back the way.Last season we headed to Manchester with some hope not much but a little, this season there was none.
We are now competing with Aalborg for a place in the consolation cup after reaching the last 16 twice .As stated we are going back the way.
Celtic could have twisted the knife into Rangers especially after Manchester by signing some real champion league quality players but we did not due to the them being in the shite.
As long as there is the "as long as we beat the Hnus" mentality Celtic will not progress in Europe ,instead we will go back the way.Last season we headed to Manchester with some hope not much but a little, this season there was none.
We are now competing with Aalborg for a place in the consolation cup after reaching the last 16 twice .As stated we are going back the way.
The much maligned John Reid.Could this be because he was at the forefront of the the liars who demanded the invasion of a small country resulting in the death of hundreds of thousand Iraqis.He is and will forever be known as Celtic's shame.
QUOTE (glasnost @ Nov 3 2008, 14:30)
The great grandchildren of those Irish immigrants are now an integral and essential part of Glasgow's identity.
CODE
They run most of the bookies shops
QUOTE (glasnost @ Nov 3 2008, 14:30)
Their quick wit,
CODE
They're good at spinning pish
QUOTE (glasnost @ Nov 3 2008, 14:30)
wily ways
CODE
they've got 'fast hands'
QUOTE (glasnost @ Nov 3 2008, 14:30)
and indefatigable charm
CODE
and are past-masters at confidence tricks
QUOTE (glasnost @ Nov 3 2008, 14:30)
makes them the face of ordinary Glaswegians.
that we all treat with contempt.
Some decent points in that article but it's got the usual worrying undertones of racial superiority that you quite often get from Celtic's more wild-eyed fans.
QUOTE (Swampy @ Nov 3 2008, 20:11)
Some decent points in that article but it's got the usual worrying undertones of racial superiority that you quite often get from Celtic's more wild-eyed fans.
Not sure I could take any racial superiority from it, it is dewy eyed, nothing wrong in that, the Irish in Scotland have done well for themselves, against quite daunting odds too. They should be proud, and proud of the football club they built
QUOTE (seamus @ Nov 3 2008, 19:16)
Murray is just biding his time before he gets a buyer and he will eventually.The currant buns struggles is holding Celtic back due to our boards lack of ambition.You would have thought that after reaching the last 16 twice we may have tried to build on that success but due to the troubles at the pox we are happy to be just in front of them.Not too much in front though because that would not be interesting.
Celtic could have twisted the knife into Rangers especially after Manchester by signing some real champion league quality players but we did not due to the them being in the shite.
As long as there is the "as long as we beat the Hnus" mentality Celtic will not progress in Europe ,instead we will go back the way.Last season we headed to Manchester with some hope not much but a little, this season there was none.
We are now competing with Aalborg for a place in the consolation cup after reaching the last 16 twice .As stated we are going back the way.
Celtic could have twisted the knife into Rangers especially after Manchester by signing some real champion league quality players but we did not due to the them being in the shite.
As long as there is the "as long as we beat the Hnus" mentality Celtic will not progress in Europe ,instead we will go back the way.Last season we headed to Manchester with some hope not much but a little, this season there was none.
We are now competing with Aalborg for a place in the consolation cup after reaching the last 16 twice .As stated we are going back the way.
1 did you lot not win the league on the last day after everyone (including wee chesney) giving up the title. not exactly far in front is it
2 even the few who fell for peter liarwell's "we'll take the club to the next level" speech must still have realised that no player who is "champions league" class would actually move to scotland, if they are champs league class then they get signed by a PROPER champs league team. i.e a team that easily gets to quarter finals and CAN actually win away from home
3 manchester was 2 seasons ago and even then no one gave you lot a hope of taking anything from old trafford (seeing as you are rank rotten away from home in europe)
just thought i'd clear a few things up for you
QUOTE (fatman76 @ Nov 3 2008, 15:00)
ZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzz.............
....................sorry I fell asleep there.............................................I imagine that took you a while to write up that rubbish.
....................sorry I fell asleep there.............................................I imagine that took you a while to write up that rubbish.
It's a cut n paste. The cedilla in facade is the clue...
QUOTE (LordHawHaw @ Nov 3 2008, 22:08)
Not sure I could take any racial superiority from it, it is dewy eyed, nothing wrong in that, the Irish in Scotland have done well for themselves, against quite daunting odds too. They should be proud, and proud of the football club they built
Yes, a good read.
All I'd take issue with is the idea that Celtic belonged only to the Irish of Glasgow, as opposed to those from further afield (not least the Irish mainland itself).
QUOTE (Swampy @ Nov 3 2008, 20:11)
Some decent points in that article but it's got the usual worrying undertones of racial superiority that you quite often get from Celtic's more wild-eyed fans.
If you actually mean cultural superiority, then fair enough
For instance, I suppose it is something of an irony that those targeted by this forum's insane attempts to constrain language (ie. Celtic fans) are generally those who would be most resistant to such an attack - due in many cases to superior vocabularys.
QUOTE (loyalbluebear @ Nov 3 2008, 22:59)
1 did you lot not win the league on the last day after everyone (including wee chesney) giving up the title. not exactly far in front is it
2 even the few who fell for peter liarwell's "we'll take the club to the next level" speech must still have realised that no player who is "champions league" class would actually move to scotland, if they are champs league class then they get signed by a PROPER champs league team. i.e a team that easily gets to quarter finals and CAN actually win away from home
3 manchester was 2 seasons ago and even then no one gave you lot a hope of taking anything from old trafford (seeing as you are rank rotten away from home in europe)
just thought i'd clear a few things up for you
2 even the few who fell for peter liarwell's "we'll take the club to the next level" speech must still have realised that no player who is "champions league" class would actually move to scotland, if they are champs league class then they get signed by a PROPER champs league team. i.e a team that easily gets to quarter finals and CAN actually win away from home
3 manchester was 2 seasons ago and even then no one gave you lot a hope of taking anything from old trafford (seeing as you are rank rotten away from home in europe)
just thought i'd clear a few things up for you
We are well in front financially and the board should have built on our success by signing a couple of decent players,instaed we have went back the way in Europe .
There are still players out there who are attracted by playing in Europe's premier competition.I thought we played well in that game two years ago and could have got a point if it was not for a dodgy penalty.It is now evident from WGS body langauge that he is just happy to now be on the same park as them.
QUOTE (seamus @ Nov 3 2008, 23:06)
We are well in front financially and the board should have built on our success by signing a couple of decent players,instaed we have went back the way in Europe .
There are still players out there who are attracted by playing in Europe's premier competition.I thought we played well in that game two years ago and could have got a point if it was not for a dodgy penalty.It is now evident from WGS body langauge that he is just happy to now be on the same park as them.
There are still players out there who are attracted by playing in Europe's premier competition.I thought we played well in that game two years ago and could have got a point if it was not for a dodgy penalty.It is now evident from WGS body langauge that he is just happy to now be on the same park as them.
quite true but to say that celtic are far in front of rangers after winning the league on the last day, and seeing rangers get to a european final (even if it was only the uefa cup) is a major overstatement
celtic are ahead financially but fans dont give a shit about finances if the trophies dont sit in the cabinet
WHEN rangers win the league this year
the fans will surely turn on liarwell and co for not "taking them to the next level"
QUOTE (glasnost @ Nov 3 2008, 14:30)
Rangers Have To Bow To Modernity
Rangers is a very troubled institution at the present moment. The magnificent, classical façade of the main entrance has lost none of its allure and as for the sheer scale and beauty of the fabled marble staircase, there are no words that can be added.
But the very bricklayers and stone masons who erected this quite startling edifice, would be shocked to see the inner turmoil within the hallowed corridors of Scotland's second team. There I have gone and said it. Rangers have been overtaken by their bitter rivals across the city, in the east end.
Just about the same time the artisans at Govan were putting the finishing touches to Ibrox Park, desperately poor Irish, Catholic immigrants were flooding into the Empire's second city.
Despised and feared, these poor souls were to form the huge pool of cheap labour which was exploited by unscrupulous and immoral employers. If the Irish immigrant remained the unskilled, feckless labourer then his native Scottish counterpart was more likely the foreman or boss.
This direct comparison was more or less the same relationship between Glasgow Rangers (note the proprietal use of the city's name) and Celtic.
As the big ships sailed up and down the Clyde, Rangers were secure in the knowledge that they prevailed over 'alien' figures within the city. The plight of the hapless, largely ignorant Irish immigrants was put into stark contrast with the Scottish emphasis on self education, natural intelligence and duty.
More than one hundred years later, the shoe is very much on the other foot. The big ships no longer go up and down the River Clyde. Heavy industry no longer exists in the west of Scotland.
The great grandchildren of those Irish immigrants are now an integral and essential part of Glasgow's identity. Their quick wit, wily ways and indefatigable charm makes them the face of ordinary Glaswegians. They are now far more likely to be in positions of authority and responsibilty.
Above all, it is in their own team we see their greatest achievement. A club made in their own image, an identity second to none and with a support that is the envy of the world, Celtic has come of age. They will play those fellow giants Manchester United on Wednesday evening. For Celtic right now a win, a draw or even a loss does not really matter. The fact that they are on the same stage as the English giants is the key issue. Celtic is run professionally and those in power never lose sight of the club's historic mission. The much maligned John Reid has proved to be an inspirational choice to replace the irrepressible Brian Quinn. He positively exudes passion when he discusses his beloved Celtic.
Back over at Ibrox, things are not looking good. The night of mass madness in Manchester cannot be easily erased from the nation's conscience. As a public relations exercise, it was an unmitigated disaster. The sight of policemen being attacked by drunken thugs put the club back fifteen years in terms of public perception.
Above all Sir David Murray himself conveys a sense of ennui, a man utterly fed up with trying to defend the red handed, red necks who are driving his club to the very edge. As the USA is poised to elect a black man as President, (a fact that would have been inconceivable just five years ago), Rangers still have fans in their midst who make the Klu Klux Klan look like an enlightened organization. Murray can announce as many campaigns as he wants to deal with sectarianism and racism, but deep down he knows that he is onto a loser. He cannot change hearts and minds, this is a societal problem and one which needs to be addressed by politicians, churches and above all the police. Time is running out for a dated, poisonous and ultimately anachronistic set of beliefs that do not belong in the year 2008.
Rangers have been put on warning, they really need to listen before the bell tolls for the last time.
Rangers is a very troubled institution at the present moment. The magnificent, classical façade of the main entrance has lost none of its allure and as for the sheer scale and beauty of the fabled marble staircase, there are no words that can be added.
But the very bricklayers and stone masons who erected this quite startling edifice, would be shocked to see the inner turmoil within the hallowed corridors of Scotland's second team. There I have gone and said it. Rangers have been overtaken by their bitter rivals across the city, in the east end.
Just about the same time the artisans at Govan were putting the finishing touches to Ibrox Park, desperately poor Irish, Catholic immigrants were flooding into the Empire's second city.
Despised and feared, these poor souls were to form the huge pool of cheap labour which was exploited by unscrupulous and immoral employers. If the Irish immigrant remained the unskilled, feckless labourer then his native Scottish counterpart was more likely the foreman or boss.
This direct comparison was more or less the same relationship between Glasgow Rangers (note the proprietal use of the city's name) and Celtic.
As the big ships sailed up and down the Clyde, Rangers were secure in the knowledge that they prevailed over 'alien' figures within the city. The plight of the hapless, largely ignorant Irish immigrants was put into stark contrast with the Scottish emphasis on self education, natural intelligence and duty.
More than one hundred years later, the shoe is very much on the other foot. The big ships no longer go up and down the River Clyde. Heavy industry no longer exists in the west of Scotland.
The great grandchildren of those Irish immigrants are now an integral and essential part of Glasgow's identity. Their quick wit, wily ways and indefatigable charm makes them the face of ordinary Glaswegians. They are now far more likely to be in positions of authority and responsibilty.
Above all, it is in their own team we see their greatest achievement. A club made in their own image, an identity second to none and with a support that is the envy of the world, Celtic has come of age. They will play those fellow giants Manchester United on Wednesday evening. For Celtic right now a win, a draw or even a loss does not really matter. The fact that they are on the same stage as the English giants is the key issue. Celtic is run professionally and those in power never lose sight of the club's historic mission. The much maligned John Reid has proved to be an inspirational choice to replace the irrepressible Brian Quinn. He positively exudes passion when he discusses his beloved Celtic.
Back over at Ibrox, things are not looking good. The night of mass madness in Manchester cannot be easily erased from the nation's conscience. As a public relations exercise, it was an unmitigated disaster. The sight of policemen being attacked by drunken thugs put the club back fifteen years in terms of public perception.
Above all Sir David Murray himself conveys a sense of ennui, a man utterly fed up with trying to defend the red handed, red necks who are driving his club to the very edge. As the USA is poised to elect a black man as President, (a fact that would have been inconceivable just five years ago), Rangers still have fans in their midst who make the Klu Klux Klan look like an enlightened organization. Murray can announce as many campaigns as he wants to deal with sectarianism and racism, but deep down he knows that he is onto a loser. He cannot change hearts and minds, this is a societal problem and one which needs to be addressed by politicians, churches and above all the police. Time is running out for a dated, poisonous and ultimately anachronistic set of beliefs that do not belong in the year 2008.
Rangers have been put on warning, they really need to listen before the bell tolls for the last time.
That is a well-written, carefully thought-out post. Good and original. However, the good bits are not original and the original bits are not good.
QUOTE (loyalbluebear @ Nov 3 2008, 23:14)
quite true but to say that celtic are far in front of rangers after winning the league on the last day, and seeing rangers get to a european final (even if it was only the uefa cup) is a major overstatement
celtic are ahead financially but fans dont give a shit about finances if the trophies dont sit in the cabinet
WHEN rangers win the league this year the fans will surely turn on liarwell and co for not "taking them to the next level"
celtic are ahead financially but fans dont give a shit about finances if the trophies dont sit in the cabinet
WHEN rangers win the league this year
the fans will surely turn on liarwell and co for not "taking them to the next level"Celtic should be well ahead of Rangers on the field.Its almost as if our board want it to be tight .
QUOTE (seamus @ Nov 3 2008, 23:17)
Celtic should be well ahead of Rangers on the field.Its almost as if our board want it to be tight .
maybe, but sometimes being the "supposed" lesser of the two teams spurs on the players
look at MoN's first season, they players were told to expect a season of "closing the gap" yet they cantered the league. was it due to rangers players expecting just to turn up and win the league or were celtic spurred on to achieve what they did
you cant say the celtic board want it to be tight as the first thing the board are interested in is money and for the old frim money comes from champions league
just think if the title had went to ibrox last season, celtic would probs have either had to share the champs league money or have none at all, not exactly what the board/plc want
the reason chesney strolled to his first 2 titles is because the rangers team had no bottle to kick back when other teams were aggressive with them (no disrespecting other teams, that was the easiest way to beat rangers at the time). now that walter is back the grit is back at ibrox and there are players who are willing to run through brick walls to get the ball let alone win matches (some of the ugly b*****ds look like they have ran through brick walls)
QUOTE (Beyemystic @ Nov 3 2008, 23:01)
If you actually mean cultural superiority, then fair enough
For instance, I suppose it is something of an irony that those targeted by this forum's insane attempts to constrain language (ie. Celtic fans) are generally those who would be most resistant to such an attack - due in many cases to superior vocabularys.
For instance, I suppose it is something of an irony that those targeted by this forum's insane attempts to constrain language (ie. Celtic fans) are generally those who would be most resistant to such an attack - due in many cases to superior vocabularys.
I meant racial, which is why I said racial.
QUOTE (loyalbluebear @ Nov 3 2008, 23:41)
maybe, but sometimes being the "supposed" lesser of the two teams spurs on the players
look at MoN's first season, they players were told to expect a season of "closing the gap" yet they cantered the league. was it due to rangers players expecting just to turn up and win the league or were celtic spurred on to achieve what they did
you cant say the celtic board want it to be tight as the first thing the board are interested in is money and for the old frim money comes from champions league
just think if the title had went to ibrox last season, celtic would probs have either had to share the champs league money or have none at all, not exactly what the board/plc want
the reason chesney strolled to his first 2 titles is because the rangers team had no bottle to kick back when other teams were aggressive with them (no disrespecting other teams, that was the easiest way to beat rangers at the time). now that walter is back the grit is back at ibrox and there are players who are willing to run through brick walls to get the ball let alone win matches (some of the ugly b*****ds look like they have ran through brick walls)
look at MoN's first season, they players were told to expect a season of "closing the gap" yet they cantered the league. was it due to rangers players expecting just to turn up and win the league or were celtic spurred on to achieve what they did
you cant say the celtic board want it to be tight as the first thing the board are interested in is money and for the old frim money comes from champions league
just think if the title had went to ibrox last season, celtic would probs have either had to share the champs league money or have none at all, not exactly what the board/plc want
the reason chesney strolled to his first 2 titles is because the rangers team had no bottle to kick back when other teams were aggressive with them (no disrespecting other teams, that was the easiest way to beat rangers at the time). now that walter is back the grit is back at ibrox and there are players who are willing to run through brick walls to get the ball let alone win matches (some of the ugly b*****ds look like they have ran through brick walls)
For once that was actually not a bad post from you
I would bet Celtic directors would be happy finishing 2nd this year as long as the books were balanced
QUOTE (loyalbluebear @ Nov 3 2008, 23:41)
maybe, but sometimes being the "supposed" lesser of the two teams spurs on the players
look at MoN's first season, they players were told to expect a season of "closing the gap" yet they cantered the league. was it due to rangers players expecting just to turn up and win the league or were celtic spurred on to achieve what they did
you cant say the celtic board want it to be tight as the first thing the board are interested in is money and for the old frim money comes from champions league
just think if the title had went to ibrox last season, celtic would probs have either had to share the champs league money or have none at all, not exactly what the board/plc want
look at MoN's first season, they players were told to expect a season of "closing the gap" yet they cantered the league. was it due to rangers players expecting just to turn up and win the league or were celtic spurred on to achieve what they did
you cant say the celtic board want it to be tight as the first thing the board are interested in is money and for the old frim money comes from champions league
just think if the title had went to ibrox last season, celtic would probs have either had to share the champs league money or have none at all, not exactly what the board/plc want
I sometimes wonder if the Desmond and Murray meet up and discuss a joint plan so that both clubs are as competitive as possible.
QUOTE (Beyemystic @ Nov 3 2008, 23:01)
- due in many cases to superior vocabularys.
Classic!QUOTE (glasnost @ Nov 3 2008, 14:30)
Celtic is run professionally and those in power never lose sight of the club's historic mission.
It was John Reid himself who wrote it, right?
" ... Never lose sight of the club's historic mission." Anyone else baffled by that phrase or is it my 92-year-old brain? I would have hoped that the team's mission had changed since the days of its foundation and that maybe it succeeded in that before moving on.
Besides, it's now a company floating on the stock market. It's first duty is making profit for its shareholders. How about that for losing sight of the historic mission?
Besides, it's now a company floating on the stock market. It's first duty is making profit for its shareholders. How about that for losing sight of the historic mission?
I'm just trying to imagine the levels of bluster that would have consumed Beyemystic had someone penned an article as culturally chauvinistic in its praise of Scots over the Irish as that one is of the Irish over Scots. 
QUOTE (HeartsparkDollarsign @ Nov 4 2008, 13:24)
I'm just trying to imagine the levels of bluster that would have consumed Beyemystic had someone penned an article as culturally chauvinistic in its praise of Scots over the Irish as that one is of the Irish over Scots.
Oh come on, Beyemystic is the very epitome of humility and "indefatiguable charm", wouldn't you say?
Perhaps the original mission statement was all about lording it up over everyone else on a cloud of self-righteousness.
QUOTE (Beyemystic @ Nov 3 2008, 23:01)
Yes, a good read.
All I'd take issue with is the idea that Celtic belonged only to the Irish of Glasgow, as opposed to those from further afield (not least the Irish mainland itself).
If you actually mean cultural superiority, then fair enough
For instance, I suppose it is something of an irony that those targeted by this forum's insane attempts to constrain language (ie. Celtic fans) are generally those who would be most resistant to such an attack - due in many cases to superior vocabularys.
All I'd take issue with is the idea that Celtic belonged only to the Irish of Glasgow, as opposed to those from further afield (not least the Irish mainland itself).
If you actually mean cultural superiority, then fair enough
For instance, I suppose it is something of an irony that those targeted by this forum's insane attempts to constrain language (ie. Celtic fans) are generally those who would be most resistant to such an attack - due in many cases to superior vocabularys.
I think you'll find it is "superior vocabulary", regardless of the numbers involved. But please, you carry on with your battle against the constraints of language. You're doing so well.
QUOTE (Dr Koop @ Nov 4 2008, 13:22)
" ... Never lose sight of the club's historic mission." Anyone else baffled by that phrase or is it my 92-year-old brain? I would have hoped that the team's mission had changed since the days of its foundation and that maybe it succeeded in that before moving on.
Besides, it's now a company floating on the stock market. It's first duty is making profit for its shareholders. How about that for losing sight of the historic mission?
Besides, it's now a company floating on the stock market. It's first duty is making profit for its shareholders. How about that for losing sight of the historic mission?
I still think we give considerable sums to charity, I'd love to see us set targets for money raised over a year...might be a drop in the ocean, but something like build a hospital per year or something
QUOTE (Beyemystic @ Nov 3 2008, 23:01)
All I'd take issue with is the idea that Celtic belonged only to the Irish of Glasgow, as opposed to those from further afield (not least the Irish mainland itself).
You mean actual Irish people from Ireland?
QUOTE (seamus @ Nov 4 2008, 10:18)
I sometimes wonder if the Desmond and Murray meet up and discuss a joint plan so that both clubs are as competitive as possible.
They probably do - the two boards have much more in common with each other than either set has in common with it's own set of supporters (hence the 5% stitch up, joint Carling deals etc). Yet the magic is keeping the "divide" alive (and getting fans to believe it)
QUOTE (Beyemystic @ Nov 3 2008, 23:01)
If you actually mean cultural superiority, then fair enough
Surely the author of this piece is thinking along the lines of both cultural and racial superiority?
Or do the Glasgow Irish only become a race when they are the ones being discriminated against?
Once again, you're as erratic as ever
QUOTE (seamus @ Nov 4 2008, 10:18)
I sometimes wonder if the Desmond and Murray meet up and discuss a joint plan so that both clubs are as competitive as possible.
didnt the clubs use to arrange this in the early years of the old firm when cup games went to constant replays
fact is celtic are a plc company (which should stand for ProfitLadenCompany, as they never spend the money they have), and rangers are feeling the pinch because mighty murray wants to sell by looks of things and buyers will be put off by a shit load of debt
rangers and celtic have the ability to service a debt of up to 40million in my opinion, we have went far into this to try and obtain the champions league money NEXT season (seeing as not spending was the reason we lost out on it this year) and to also win the title back
the celtic board/plc are in a no win situation, do 4 in a row and fans will want big money buys to compete in champions league, lose the league and the fans win want big money buys to win back the league, and the plc will be raging at potentially losing champions league money.
murray was in a no win situation. he didnt want to spend the money incase potential buyers were put off by the debt level, he then had to because potential buyers dont want to buy a team that are miles behind their rivals at home. and as for europe.........................
old firm boards and fans are in no win situations always. until the two clubs find a way to increase revenue by 10x then it will be the same for years to come
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