I know the SFA would probably never sack Burley after just two competitive games, but would you?

Yes, without hesitation.

As I've said in another thread, we left it at least a game too late with Berti and it cost us a play-off place.

We can't let that happen again.

The sooner we start playing to our strengths again, the better.

Nope. Our campaign will be as good as over if we lose, but pointles sacking him so new into the job with just two qualifying games under his belt. We will become a laughing stock. If we fail to finish 2nd at the end of the campaign, then get rid. I think people's expectations are to high.

I think we already are.

Didn't you see the Gordon Smith documentary on Friday night?

I would sodomise then sack him.

FYRM were far better than the Scottish media were making out. It was a hard game against a good team. Dont get carried away.

What Scotland need is a manager who can get the players fired up and tore in to the opposition, not a tactical genius or gash like that, its Scotland for gods sake!! We simply don't have the players for 26 passing moves etc... we need dare i say it, someone in the Souness mould, get some fire in the bellies!!!

and what are our strengths?? playing 4-5-1 get as many men behind the ball and try score on the odd counter attack??

Im not saying we are a talented side, but we do have enough talent to beat teams playing 4-4-2, thats if the players get the fingers out their asses, amd play to their abilities, instead of swanning around the pitch like the scottish fans should be thankful they are playing.

Theres more than one or two who need to realise that their selection is not a fore gone conclusion, and that if they dont make the effort and show up to the races, that they will be out the squad end of.

If the Scottish game is centered around hustle, commitment, bravery etc, WHY doesnt someone tell that to the likes of Hartley, Brown, Alexander and a few others.

Ive got a feeling with Burley that hes still finding his feet at this level, and still sussing out the players, and will in time turn out to be a very good manager for us frankly hes needing to grow some balls, and tell the doubters to GTF if they are not willing to support the side, stand by him or give 100% for the team. That includes, supporters, media and players alike.

He shouldn't be sacked. 4 games is nothing really.

I was severely pissed off reading that fanny Bill Leckie's column in the Sun today.

If you're reading this Bill.....

Go shag something with aids. Then header a knife.

Not sure about that, most people were very aware that Macedonia are a decent team and that Scotland would have a very tough game. Burley seemed overly aware of it though and gave them too much respect. I wouldnt call for his head on the back of the result but the team, tactics, preparation and the fact that some players were not allegedly 100% on what their role was is very worrrying.

Would Berti have taken 1 point out of 6 against Belarus?

1 or 0 - what difference does it make?

Daftie alert.

As soon as I read the subject title, I thought to myself "these guys should really get a grip" and now that I've read the posts my first instinct was right.

As disappointing it would be to lose in Iceland, how can you justify sacking a manager after only two games? For heaven's sake even Brazilian teams don't even do that and they're mental!

Sacking Burley wouldn't be productive in any way and you need to give him time. I think we'll come good tomorrow and hopefully some of you might get behind him after that.

Comparing Burley to Vogts is also way off the mark. Remember under that wee German turd, we were horsed against France in a friendly and didn't play much at all in the five games after that (Nigeria, South Korea, South Africa, Hong Kong Waiters XI and Denmark) before the Euro 2004 campaign.

Against Croatia and Czech Republic, we played some good stuff and while we didn't win, we looked ok. The Northern Ireland game was poor and the first half against Macedonia was dreadful, but we showed enough in the second half to have deserved a point. 45 minutes too late I know, but we have to take the postives out of it.

As I said, you guys really need to get a hold of reality and start supporting the team. Best supporters in the world? Don't make me laugh! Come off the medication and we might.

No.

I blame the SFA. They took too long to appoint their man, because i think, Smith and co wanted a bit of the action, as in, organising dates for the games.

But a loss in Iceland would realistically end our hopes of qualifying and we would have to start preparing for Euro 2012, by which time Burley's contract may have ended.

No he should be given to the end of the campaign.

Even though I would rather he wasn't there to begin with.

If we did lose to Iceland how would keeping Burley in place be anymore productive than sacking him. If we do lose tomorrow then the rest of the games would be nothing but glorified friendlies so surely would be a better bet to allow another manager time to build his own squad.

Scotland, are (unfortunately) dependent upon Barry Ferguson to keep possession, and to distribute the ball from midfield.
While the Scotland team's attitude to the match in Macedonia was deplorable, the fact that George Burley has been unable to utilise his best midfielder has made his job extremely difficult.

Therefore, I'm not sure "sacking" Burley would solve any of the problems - specifically the lack of quality in midfield.
The argument seems to be that Scotland should have enough quality to beat these team's without Ferguson, et al.They don't.

Who exactly would you bring in as his replacement? In my opinion Burley is the best option available at the current time.

posted this on Acciesworld yesterday, it's relevant here.

"yes. If we are out of the World cup after losing to Macedonia, and failing to beat Iceland, then he has to go.

It wouldn't be a case of, we've only played two games, it would be the manner in which we'd failed to beat the two minnows.

To have any chance of qualifying for this world cup, or any of the next two major tournaments, we need to finish first or second in this group. We can't afford to be drawn from Pot 4 or we've got no chance.

We can't let George Burley ruin the good work that Smith and McLeish did, by having a disastrous campaign."

For God's sake, what happened to judging the guy at the end of the campaign? Why are we judging him now? It's only one friggin' game!

There were positives be to taken from the Macedonia (namely the second half performance) and that can built on in Iceland and I'm certain it will. The players owe us a performance and they know it and they'll deliver it!

So instead of coming on and posting your drivel about why the manager should be sacked, let's get behind him and the team and judge him at the end, when it counts.

Macedonia was only one result and as I said on my first post on this thread, everyone should get a grip and give the guy a break. Sacking him now won't be productive in any way in the short term and what if he is dismissed and the next guy makes a James Hunt of it, is he to get the sack as well?

Since when did getting beat in internationals become a witch hunt on the manager? I think you lot got badly spoiled when we did what we did in the Euro 2008 campaign. Some of you probably jumped on the bandwagon of that campaign so I've got this to say to you...this is life as a Scotland fan. Get used to it.

We're not a great team, nowhere near it, but we'll never be world beaters and if you're now going through life expecting that then you're sadly mistaken.

We are what we are and as long we play with pride and passion (like the 2nd half in Macedonia) then the rewards will come.

I can't say it enough, but get behind the team, the manager and the players and show them we're on their side.

A disastrous campaign would see us slip from pot 3 to pot 4 which would pretty much kill our chances of qualifying for the next world cup as well.

I'll be behind the team, as usual tomorrow, and i fully expect us to beat Iceland, and to go on from there, but if, somehow, we don't, he has to go. We can't afford to slip into pot 4.

International managers don't get the buffer that club manager's have to turn things around. A bad club season, you start from the same place again next time out. A bad international campaign, and you start from a lower pot, and have more "better teams" to overcome next time out.

I thought we were we in pot two for this group?

We were, but don't let facts get in the way of a reactionist rant.

I do agree though that if we don't qualify from this group, then it's unlikely we'll qualify from the next one either. World Cup draws don't get fairer than this. Unless you are England.

Its true that failing to get good results in this draw will see a tough group next time around. If we were to lose tonight the campaign is effectively over. The SFA may feel they have to decide whether they want to keep Burley to the end of the schedule games and punt him or get rid now and let the new man have the remaining games as 'enhanced' friendlies to prepare for a touch Euro qualifying campaign. You could almost say that if you want to keep him to the end of this campaign you would be as well giving him the next one. Is there muchpoint in having him run the team for 6 meaningless matches to then change manager ? It doesnt sit well talking about ejecting a manager so early but then being all doe eyed over Berti effectively cost us an entire qualifying campaign. Gordon Smith will surely be under pressure to make the right decision because it is not just the immediate future which is at stake.

We were. However UEFA use a different system to seed the qualifying groups for European Championships.

I know it would be harsh but i probably would sack him, If we didn't get results back on track then it would be 2 years before Scotland had anything to get hyped up about again which would be torture. Losing our first two games would mean to me he isn't the man for the job and at least bringing in a new manager would add some sort of excitement to following Scotland for the next 2 years and might galvanise the team again.

Well, I'm just about to head to the pub for this one.

As i said in another thread, I think we'll win 2-0. No idea why.

If we do lose, i don't see any point in sacking Burley. We'll look like idiots ( okay, we are run by idiots, but still ) and i can't think of any other manager who wouldn't f**k off to England if we're doing well given half a chance.

i'd rather have a manager who did well and fucked off than a manager who did shit and stayed around.

No. Lets see how Burley does with the full squad or at least our strongest eleven at his disposal. That said I'm not impressed so far.

this thread is ridiculous. and to see so many people agreeing with this. why not wait til after the game before posting such shite.

Aye, sack the k*nt

Who else would work with those two fuckwits Smith and Peat?

2 competitive games and you want him sacked Give the guy a break and a chance.

im not giving him both, take your pick.

Fair play to Burley tonight - at times our football was good as I've seen from Scotland.
Really refreshing to see us with 3 or 4 players willing to run at defenders.

I do think we would have wrapped up the game by half-time with Boyd in the middle - he's never seen service like that and could have had a field day.

I'm still not convinced by Burley's interviews though - just make me cringe for some reason!

As for McManus, why does he continue to give away needless fouls?
He does it all over the pitch but to put your hands up there is just suicide.
He is a liability and I am not unhappy to see him miss the Norway game.

A chance for Broadfoot to stake a claim in the middle?
I'd go for Weir or Berra personally but you never know!

PS - well done Caldwell tonight.
Really showed who is the main man in Celtic and Scotland's defence tonight.

Thanks for introducing yourself Killie boy.

My point was that Berti would have been lucky to get us 1 point.
He was and is an absolute shambles.
Just ask the Nigerians.

I agree, but ask the German's the same question!

It's a fair point, although I reckon I could have led the German squad he inherited to glory!

Vogts was never actually that popular with the Germans despite his achievements with them. It was brought up in an interview with Rudi Voller in Four Four Two a while back.

I read this morning that he said last nights resulst was the greatest of his career. Whjat an utterly embarrassing thing to say.

Best result of his career, Macedonia are exceptional, Scotland were outstanding against Macedonia, and Broadfoot is a top class player.

Someone should catalogue his casual use of hyperbole, the man is a goldmine.

I agree. It was a decent result and a much needed 3 points but it was Iceland!!! A country with the population of Aberdeen. There is no way we should have been hanging on for dear life against a team like that, even with a man down.

Exactly. Embarrassing statement right enough.

Why was it utterly embarassing? He dosent mean Scotland beating Iceland is the greatest result, it means he is Scotland manager, something he'll be very proud of and that a lot of managers would love to acheive in their lifetime and this is his first win in that position, especially with the pressure and criticism he has taken since the job began.

Your comment is a classic example of where the negativity and crtitcism stems, totally misjudging comments just to make them laughable and stupid when in fact he is proud to get his first win being manager of his country.

He said what he said re greatest result for him. He managed a team that only just beat Iceland. Not Italy, not Brasil – ICELAND.

It’s the latest in a string of idiotic comments he has made over the past week or so – from the Macedonia game, to Broadfoot.

He either needs to keep his trap shut or stop drinking to excess.

What exactly did Smith and McLiesh achieve other than a false ranking in an incredibly flawed system?