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Scottish Junior Cup next season - byes/rounds


theesel1994

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This is frying my brains as to how this will operate next season.

There are 129 clubs (131 clubs in total less Cruden Bay and Johnstone Burgh who are excluded).

Four clubs get automatic byes: Banks o' Dee, Beith Juniors, Auchinleck Talbot and Girvan.

How many clubs/byes in Round One. Or are there byes in Round 2 as well? My brain can't cope with this.

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That's what I originally had but then my brain told me that was wrong. I think I'll stop listening to my brain.

Would it not make sense to have this one game earlier than normal and have the round two games played where Round One was previously?

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1 hour ago, theesel1994 said:

This is frying my brains as to how this will operate next season.

There are 129 clubs (131 clubs in total less Cruden Bay and Johnstone Burgh who are excluded).

Four clubs get automatic byes: Banks o' Dee, Beith Juniors, Auchinleck Talbot and Girvan.

How many clubs/byes in Round One. Or are there byes in Round 2 as well? My brain can't cope with this.

North 32

West  63

East 36

Total  131

Two clubs not involved  - 129 competitors

One Round 1 tie needed.

 

 

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6 hours ago, theesel1994 said:

This is frying my brains as to how this will operate next season.

There are 129 clubs (131 clubs in total less Cruden Bay and Johnstone Burgh who are excluded).

Four clubs get automatic byes: Banks o' Dee, Beith Juniors, Auchinleck Talbot and Girvan.

How many clubs/byes in Round One. Or are there byes in Round 2 as well? My brain can't cope with this.

 

5 hours ago, Khufu2 said:

North 32

West  63

East 36

Total  131

Two clubs not involved  - 129 competitors

One Round 1 tie needed.

Depends whether those 4 clubs get automatic byes to R2 or, with the reduced numbers, to R3.

If it's to R2 (the round of 128) then the 4 are just 4 of 127 byes so as you say just one R1 tie is required (making it basically a preliminary round).

If the 4 were to get byes to R3 (the round of 64) that leaves 60 qualifying places for 125 clubs, so 5 R1 preliminary ties would be required in R1 followed by 60 ties in R2.

Seemples!

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10 hours ago, energyzone said:
16 hours ago, Khufu2 said:
North 32
West  63
East 36
Total  131
Two clubs not involved  - 129 competitors
One Round 1 tie needed.
 
 

Are there not 125 teams if the four involved in the senior Scottish get byes? Or is this not guaranteed?

125 go into the hat, 1 tie is drawn, and 124 join the 4 clubs with byes in Round 2.   I'm not aware of the rules being changed to give the 4 a bye to Round 3 instead.

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I may be wrong here, but my recollection is that in the 1950's there were byes in both round 1 and round 2 but at that time the competition was regionalised up to round 3. There was certainly a much larger number of clubs entering the competition, probably around 200, but that does not require an extra round. Up to 256 can be accommodated within eight rounds. I think that pre WW2 the competition had 9 rounds at one time. Anyone confirm?

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1 hour ago, garrellburn said:

I may be wrong here, but my recollection is that in the 1950's there were byes in both round 1 and round 2 but at that time the competition was regionalised up to round 3. There was certainly a much larger number of clubs entering the competition, probably around 200, but that does not require an extra round. Up to 256 can be accommodated within eight rounds. I think that pre WW2 the competition had 9 rounds at one time. Anyone confirm?

There used to be byes in later rounds and even supplementary rounds  as the various regions whittled down the number of teams to the right number for the national draw.

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On 19/06/2018 at 11:05, Helen's Dad said:

I can see a lot of sense in keeping the rounds prior to the round with 64 teams within the regions. 

The downside is that the strongest Region , the West, will lose half its teams in Round 2 and the weakest Region, the North (mebbe!) will still have half of its teams in R3. An open  R2 draw would have more West teams in R3 and  would weed out the weakerNorth teams.

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Best suggestion I've heard yet, it would provide a good geographical spread of clubs in round three with only the best in each region still participating (usually). It would prevent small, weak sides having to travel the length of the country to play another weak side for little or no reward. The bigger, better clubs would still have the chance of a day out in a part of the country seldom visited but hopefully see a better game and get some financial reward at the same time.  We all enjoy an occasional visit to the other end of the country now and again, our visit to Burghead a couple of years ago was a great day out, but wouldn't want to do it too often!

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On 19/06/2018 at 08:12, Khufu2 said:

125 go into the hat, 1 tie is drawn, and 124 join the 4 clubs with byes in Round 2.   I'm not aware of the rules being changed to give the 4 a bye to Round 3 instead.

The Constitution specifiaclly only mentions byes in Round one, nothing about further byes;

CUP COMPETITION RULES
1.

 

2.
The competition for the Cup shall be annual, and shall be open
to all clubs of the Association, subject to the approval of the
Committee. All matches shall be played under the laws of the
Association game.
3.
The names of clubs entered for the competition by virtue of
membership, shall be placed in a receptacle and except that a club
may be balloted as having a ‘bye’ into the Second Round of the
competition, the clubs shall be balloted in couples to compete with
each other in the First Round of the competition. Those clubs who
have qualified to participate in the Scottish Senior Challenge Cup
will receive a bye in the first round of the Junior Cup.
The names of the winning clubs in the First Round, together with
the names of the clubs which may have received a ‘bye’ in the First
Round, shall be placed in a receptacle and balloted in couples to
compete with each other in the Second Round. This process shall
continue until the clubs qualifying for the Final Tie are known.
‘Byes’ shall be balloted in the First Round of the competition to
the number necessary to ensure an even run through the competition
to finality.
 
 
 
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