Sectarianism

[The_Kincardine]

15 minutes ago, Bairnardo said:

Imagine being this bothered about someone who has zero interest in anyones religion callling **** ****, but avidly defenedng the singing of the Sash and Derrys walls.

No 'avidly defending' anything from me but you are desperate to hold on to your casual sectarian slur.

[Melanius Mullarkey]

23 minutes ago, Bairnardo said:

the Sash .

Not Sectarian, though, remember.

Nothing to hear, here. Move along.

[Bairnardo]

6 minutes ago, The_Kincardine said:

No 'avidly defending' anything from me but you are desperate to hold on to your casual sectarian slur.

Please demonstrate thta it is sectarian. If you can do so, I wil no longer use it. 

 

You can't though, evidently.

[SilverWolfe]

See this one is heating up. I think Bairnardo got it very spot on on the other thread earlier when he said that it doesn't matter if the songs are actually sectarian or not, it's the underlying attitude that prevents it going away. 

I don't think the 2 clubs can take all that blame though, the media push it as some form of marketing tool knowing that they can influence the lowest form of our society, the SPFL/ SFA and even the government sweep it under the carpet because it's easier to do so. We still have seperate schools ffs.

Sectarianism isn't just a football issue in this country it is a problem in our society in general, especially in the West of Scotland. However, football is 100% used as the platform to keep it alive and until everyone involved pulls together and makes a conscious effort to stamp it out it will never go away. 

[The OP]

In all seriousness, in this day and age sectarianism is a bit of a non-event of an issue. Definitely overrated. I’m atheist so not a proper ****** b*****d but these days it makes no difference to your prospects and aside from pockets of scummy parts of glasgow, ayrshire and lanarkshire is barely an issue. The naranjas march by mine and act triumphalist but they’re more to be pitied than scolded.

[Joey Jo Jo Junior Shabadoo]

6 minutes ago, The OP said:

In all seriousness, in this day and age sectarianism is a bit of a non-event of an issue. Definitely overrated. I’m atheist so not a proper ****** b*****d but these days it makes no difference to your prospects and aside from pockets of scummy parts of glasgow, ayrshire and lanarkshire is barely an issue. The naranjas march by mine and act triumphalist but they’re more to be pitied than scolded.

[Jacksgranda]

9 hours ago, Dundee Hibernian said:

Fancy folk debating the niceties of certain songs being sung at football, for the reason of causing offence, and arguing whether these songs are sectarian or not.

 

It's football, why sing these songs, which are causing a diversion  from how shite the sport has become in the country? Football has become even more of a vehicle for maladjusted Scots than it ever was before. 

Aye, fancy that, when the title of the thread is "Sectarianism". If it was called "Sectarianism and Offensiveness" no debate. 

If there is going to be action on this by the SFA/SPFL the term "sectarianism" is going to have to be pretty much nailed down.

IMO, a lot of the songs sung are offensive rather than sectarian (in the religious sense). Muddy waters, I think. I don't know why folk can't be arrested under liable to cause a breach of the peace - seems pretty catch all to me.

[The_Kincardine]

21 hours ago, Bairnardo said:

Please demonstrate thta it is sectarian. If you can do so, I wil no longer use it. 

 

You can't though, evidently.

That 'the H word' is sectarian is beyond dispute and shame on you for using it and shame on P&B for tolerating it.

You are, though, the message-board equivalent of a 90 minute bigot.  You pepper your posts with 'H' this and that but would never use it in a social situation.  Why?  Because it's an unacceptable term and you'd be castigated for it.  But fine to do so anonymously.

I should be more understanding, though.  It can't be easy being a Borrower.

[jagfox]

2 minutes ago, The_Kincardine said:

That 'the H word' is sectarian is beyond dispute and shame on you for using it and shame on P&B for tolerating it.

You are, though, the message-board equivalent of a 90 minute bigot.  You pepper your posts with 'H' this and that but would never use it in a social situation.  Why?  Because it's an unacceptable term and you'd be castigated for it.  But fine to do so anonymously.

I should be more understanding, though.  It can't be easy being a Borrower.

^^^ *** sympathiser 

[Bairnardo]

2 minutes ago, The_Kincardine said:

That 'the H word' is sectarian is beyond dispute and shame on you for using it and shame on P&B for tolerating it.

You are, though, the message-board equivalent of a 90 minute bigot.  You pepper your posts with 'H' this and that but would never use it in a social situation.  Why?  Because it's an unacceptable term and you'd be castigated for it.  But fine to do so anonymously.

I should be more understanding, though.  It can't be easy being a Borrower.

Firstly, please simply provide the evidence that it's a sectarian term. Since it's beyond doubt this should be very easy for you. Given that this is about the fifth time I have asked you to do so, I won't hold my breath.

Secondly, I have no problem using the word in conversation.

Thirdly, why is it ok for you to pick on me based on my height but I can't pick on you based on your religion? (Hypothetically of course btw, I would never use sectarian insults)

And fourth, there is no doubt in my mind that your recent Old Firm threawd title was a (admittedly clever) child abuse type dig at Celtic. Truly disgusting behaviour from yuorself.

[wastecoatwilly]

Strict liability maybe the answer to this issue,clubs would need to act, fines to start with then closing parts of the stadium then points deducted.

[The_Kincardine]

36 minutes ago, Bairnardo said:

Firstly, please simply provide the evidence that it's a sectarian term. Since it's beyond doubt this should be very easy for you. Given that this is about the fifth time I have asked you to do so, I won't hold my breath.

Secondly, I have no problem using the word in conversation.

Thirdly, why is it ok for you to pick on me based on my height but I can't pick on you based on your religion? (Hypothetically of course btw, I would never use sectarian insults)

And fourth, there is no doubt in my mind that your recent Old Firm threawd title was a (admittedly clever) child abuse type dig at Celtic. Truly disgusting behaviour from yuorself.

1,  We know it's sectarian because it's been used on P&B as a term to describe 'proddies'.  We also know it's sectarian since Celtic fans staged a mock hanging of a representative Protestant above a 'death to ****' banner.  That you don't see this is very much to your demerit.

2. That you use said term in polite society makes you even scummier than I thought you were.

3. You're right to give me short-shrift here.

4. I've started many match-day threads.  My 'Best from the West' one was weather-related,  I don't post much about Celtic and post nothing about paedophilia.  You're trying to conjour an argument out of nothing.

 

Edited March 17, 2018 by The_Kincardine

[Bairnardo]

6 minutes ago, The_Kincardine said:

1,  We know it's sectarian because it's been used on P&B as a term to describe 'proddies'.  We also know it's sectarian since Celtic fans staged a mock hanging of a representative Protestant above a 'death to ****' banner.  That you don't see this is very much to your demerit.

2. That you use said term in polite society makes you even scummier than I thought you were.

3. You're right to give me short-shrift here.

4. I've started many match-day threads.  My 'Best from the West' one was weather-related,  I don't post much about Celtic and post nothing about paedophilia.  You're trying to conjour an argument out of nothing.

 

Because people on P&B have used it in such a way, really doesn't have any impact on how I use it. Pretty poor effort at proving something you have said was beyond doubt. Feel free to try again. 

What is in no doubt, is that your pishy arguement about your thread title being to do with the weather doesn't really stand up to much scrutiny tbh. It was a match between two teams, one of whom you titled "Best from the West", pretty clearly alluding to the other team being the "Beast from East" Whilst you may have been taking advantage of the weather patter at the time, we all know where you are going from there. At least stand by it rather than squirming about.

Like I said, vile. And you have the gaul to talk to me about polite society.... You think that kind of thing is ok clearly. I'd rather not actually discuss it any further because it's fucking disgusting.

Stick to the topic at hand, which is providing some credence to your claims that I am sectarian.

[The_Kincardine]

9 minutes ago, Bairnardo said:

Because people on P&B have used it in such a way, really doesn't have any impact on how I use it.

And here's the argument of the sectarian  writ large.  "I use a sectarian term but don't mean it in a sectarian way"

[Bairnardo]

2 minutes ago, The_Kincardine said:

And here's the argument of the sectarian  writ large.  "I use a sectarian term but don't mean it in a sectarian way"

You keep saying it's sectarian. Please provide proof of this. 

 

Thx ***

[The_Kincardine]

15 minutes ago, Bairnardo said:

And you have the gaul to talk to me about polite society

The Gaul

[The DA]

10 hours ago, Bairnardo said:

You keep saying it's sectarian. Please provide proof of this. 

 

Thx ***

I think the fact that Hearts fans are often described as mini-**** gives some weight to the word having sectarian connotations.  What else connects the two teams other than their perceived religious leanings? 

It's not how the H-word was used when I started going to the football but words change their meanings over time.  If the majority now intend a religious slur, that's what it means now.

If Rangers fans say they're offended by the term (although they didn't seem to mind being called **** during the 9-in-a-row period), then we should all bow to this.  We'd do the same for any other minority group - although most of those other groups aren't self-selecting.

I think we'd all agree though that, even if the H-, T- and F- words were immediately banned, both sets of fans would quickly find whichever words replaced them offensive and possibly sectarian.

 

[nsr]

The reason the two bigot clubs don't openly condemn such behaviour from the supporters is because they know full well the manufactured fake rivalry between them is all that keeps the idiots' money flowing in. Telling them to stop it = less money for the bigot clubs.

[Glenconner]

36 minutes ago, ancientnoise said:

Is "Hanoverian" a sectarian term?

Etymological query. Asking for a friend.

Only if it's said to a redcoat.

[Beano 3d]

Just watched the Patrick Kielty programme "My Dad, the peace deal and me". Should be made essential viewing for all bigots.