Livvy v League Leaders 17.2.18

[paisleysaints]

That was a sore one least face it we were well and truly beaten no qualms whatsoever,   We cannot cope with long balls struggled all day long Livi played well all congrats go to them.  Good support through from us considering the beating we took it was the wee mans first away day and he enjoyed being right close the the drummer and the singing support big change from his family stand experiences  ,   i was expecting to pay £5 for him but the Livi gate woman let him go in for free unless i missed the trick for younger ones getting in for free.  steak pies brilliant sausage rolls and game were shi*te haha

[Bobby_F]

12 hours ago, LIVIFOREVER said:

Yeah pity Pitman and Halkett didn't see the tackles that left them needing treatment coming, wasn't a dirty game but those tackles by Hippo and Mullen were as bad as any in the game, and Mullen got booked for his. Rafa got a booking later on for a trip on a St Mirren player but the ref indicated it was on top of a couple of other fouls he'd done.

Yeah, those guys clearly carrying on bad habits learned at previous clubs. Hopefully we'll knock that out of them.

And as for 'requiring treatment' forgive me if I'm a little cynical when it comes to Livingston players wanting treatment when they're ahead in a game.

Sometimes they will actually need it, but I'm sure even the staunchest Livvy fan would admit your team go out of their way more than most to shorten the game as much as possible when you're ahead.

[Coventry Saint]

They needed treatment like the keeper needed to fall over every time he caught the ball, and like he needed to take his goal kicks from the opposite side to where the ball went out.

I'm not complaining, btw - I'd expect and demand us to do the same if the roles were reversed. 

[MacArab]

5 hours ago, Coventry Saint said:

Hopefully well timed, from that point of view. 

What if we'd played terribly but scraped a draw, or just lost 1-0 - lessons might not have been learned. There's no mistaking what went wrong at the weekend (only looking at our performance - Livi played very well). We just look too lightweight sometimes. 

 

@Young gun - you mentioned the jinx thing and it was too raw on Saturday to comment, but would you like to know the last time I saw Saints win a league game in the flesh?! 1999, 3-2 vs Morton.

Some of the worst examples include Pittodrie away (from Newcastle) - 16 hour round trip, pumped 4-0 (that c**t Miller scored two that day, too). I also saw us leading 2-1 away to Hearts, who went down to 10 men and still beat us 5-2. I really need to stay away! That trip cost me about £90 on Saturday. The singing was good, though.

Edit: crowdwank alert - that really is a great away support. I've circled the best looking guy there.

You coming to Tannadice a week on Friday?????

Please?.......

[Durnford]

Probably get shot down here but I actually thought there were periods in the first half when St Mirren looked like one of the most Premiership ready sides I've seen all season. We took time to settle whist St Mirren moved the ball well using the full width of the pitch and linked up well.

When their goal went in, ignoring the fact that we probably had umpteen chances to clear it properly, I though to myself "its going to be a long afternoon". Having already taken half an aspirin to counter the blood pressure I was wondering if it was going to be enough.

Our first one was a real keystone-cops moment; we'd threatened a few times before that but what Samson was thinking rushing out like that; he couldn't have handled the ball and was obviously going to be too late to head it; but he compromises be taking out his own player. Actually I wondered if he would have been better taking out Hardie; maybe he would have been given his marching orders and St Mirren would have had to play the remainder of the game with ten players but we already know from bitter experience how much trouble St Mirren can be when they go down to ten?  I don't like to single out individuals but his performance was directly responsible for two of our goals; was the option on the bench worse than that.

All this being said we were winning virtually everything in the air and was a very pleasing performance by Livi but I don't see this as anything more than a blip for the Saints. Ross will undoubtedly make changes to reinforce the defence and frankly the threat introduced by Hippolyte, particularly when he moved into the centre indicated that he can add an much needed threat to the Saints attack in the air and can be a real handful to control by the less mobile central defenders. He probably wont score many but will doubtless shake things up allowing others to capitalise on the proverbial loose ball.

By contrast I though Danny Mullen seemed to offer very little and seemed right off his game. Maybe he was feeling awkward about returning to his old club or was in the huff about not starting but hardly threatened at all - although strangely he seemed to be working on the right side of the field which is the opposite to left side he seemed to prefer. Incidentally I'm not sure why some morons chose to boo him or Hippolyte when they came on; apart from being disrespectful to former servants of the club it seems to ideal way to fire up a player to put in a performance to prove the detractors wrong.

We have twelve games to go (United have fourteen I think but are further behind) meaning that we need to win four more games than St Mirren in order to catch them up. So far we've won 12 out of 24 games  (50% obviously) and keeping up that average Saints would presumably have to lose nine of their remaining eleven games - an achievement even Hibs would struggle to manage. I wont give up hope of catching them but my head says St Mirren are already champions; From a positive note though we can no longer be caught by Brechin so definitely will avoid the automatic drop to league 1.

Championship Form Guide Points Last Six:

Livingston 13

St.Mirren 13

Falkirk 12

Inverness 10

Morton 9

Dunfermline 8

QoS 8

Dundee Utd 7

Dumbarton 2

Brechin City 1

[Durnford]

Genuine question - St Mirren released Gregor Buchanan during the January window and we snapped him up. 

He's put in a couple of excellent shifts for us; a tall defender winning lots of balls in the air and remaining calm under pressure. Compared to the defenders I saw on Saturday I'm led to wonder why he was released.

Granted I don't see St Mirren every week and it was probably a bad day for everyone but given the overall control we had in the air I'm still left to wonder why.

[Coventry Saint]

4 minutes ago, Durnford said:

Genuine question - St Mirren released Gregor Buchanan during the January window and we snapped him up. 

He's put in a couple of excellent shifts for us; a tall defender winning lots of balls in the air and remaining calm under pressure. Compared to the defenders I saw on Saturday I'm led to wonder why he was released.

Granted I don't see St Mirren every week and it was probably a bad day for everyone but given the overall control we had in the air I'm still left to wonder why.

Number of reasons, I guess. Though your strikers did far more to harass our defence than ours did to yours, which was a big factor.

Essentially, on their day, Baird and Davis are great players. Baird is young and one for the future, probably our most improved player, while Davis is quality, even if he still looks like he's changing direction slightly gingerly on his knee.

Greg found himself as third, possibly fourth, choice and he wanted games. Can't blame the guy for leaving, but yeah, he will have enjoyed Saturday against an isolated Gavin Reilly.

 

To be very, very kind to our defence, the angle of the sun won't have helped them in the first half. I'm not offering that as an excuse, especially as the 2nd and third goals came from balls in toward the sun, but it contributed to the overall shitshow and feeling of nervousness.

By the time we shifted things around, we went to a back three and that just created a huge gap behind Liam Smith that your number 11 (I think) was repeatedly drifting into. We also brought on Hippolyte and for some reason had him sitting deep behind Mullen instead of worrying your defence - and then we shoved Gary Mack up front. It was a tactical clusterfuck, TBH.

22 minutes ago, MacArab said:

You coming to Tannadice a week on Friday?????

Please?.......

 Naw. Going on holiday the next day. Though was meant to be going the Friday; managed to change so I can see the TV coverage. My jinx doesn't quite extend to matches on TV, thankfully.

[LIVIFOREVER]

Can see why Hippo got booed, he wasn't exactly popular with our fans after his sending off at Dumbarton, and that gleeful snap chat pic on the bus to Ibrox when he was suspended. It was hero to zero for Hippo after that.

Mullen though, well that was bad form, he always put in a shift at Livi giving it his all and deserved some respect, there were more Livi fans clapping him than booing him though. Might've changed after his naughty tackle on Scotty P right enough.

[Durnford]

36 minutes ago, Coventry Saint said:

Number of reasons, I guess. Though your strikers did far more to harass our defence than ours did to yours, which was a big factor.

Essentially, on their day, Baird and Davis are great players. Baird is young and one for the future, probably our most improved player, while Davis is quality, even if he still looks like he's changing direction slightly gingerly on his knee.

Greg found himself as third, possibly fourth, choice and he wanted games. Can't blame the guy for leaving, but yeah, he will have enjoyed Saturday against an isolated Gavin Reilly.

 

To be very, very kind to our defence, the angle of the sun won't have helped them in the first half. I'm not offering that as an excuse, especially as the 2nd and third goals came from balls in toward the sun, but it contributed to the overall shitshow and feeling of nervousness.

By the time we shifted things around, we went to a back three and that just created a huge gap behind Liam Smith that your number 11 (I think) was repeatedly drifting into. We also brought on Hippolyte and for some reason had him sitting deep behind Mullen instead of worrying your defence - and then we shoved Gary Mack up front. It was a tactical clusterfuck, TBH.

Fair enough but the stats did show that Buchanan made a number of appearances for you (although I don't know how many of those were off the bench) and scored two goals apparently.

Must admit being quite mystified by your defence's performance; some times they looked organised and prepared but often not; I wonder how much the cock-up by Samson earlier actually affected his confidence leaving him reluctant to communicate with his back line? As I say that's pure speculation; obviously your position in the league doesn't lie and implies a consistently solid performance so possibly just one of those days.

 

[LIVIFOREVER]

I noticed on Hardies Development game where he scored a hattrick for Sevco against St Mirren, he did the same to Buchanan as he did to their defenders on Sat there, forced him into a mistake and mugged him for one of his goals. 

[LIVIFOREVER]

1 hour ago, Bobby_F said:

Yeah, those guys clearly carrying on bad habits learned at previous clubs. Hopefully we'll knock that out of them.

And as for 'requiring treatment' forgive me if I'm a little cynical when it comes to Livingston players wanting treatment when they're ahead in a game.

Sometimes they will actually need it, but I'm sure even the staunchest Livvy fan would admit your team go out of their way more than most to shorten the game as much as possible when you're ahead.

 

1 hour ago, Coventry Saint said:

They needed treatment like the keeper needed to fall over every time he caught the ball, and like he needed to take his goal kicks from the opposite side to where the ball went out.

I'm not complaining, btw - I'd expect and demand us to do the same if the roles were reversed. 

You both couldn't be more wrong considering the 2 players that were injured, Pittman and Halkett don't feign injury, both would run through proverbial walls in games. In fact since DJ (our ex goalie), Hippo,  and Danny Mullen left I can't think of any of our players who go down easily and roll about. Nicky Cadden is a bit fragile but he's dislocated his shoulder twice so he isn't exactly pretending to be injured either, the rest are pretty tough and get stuck in.

 

Also, we weren't really time wasting much, other than Alexander taking his time, which all keepers do,  weren't even taking it into the corner to piss about wasting time, we didn't need to.

[Bobby_F]

7 minutes ago, LIVIFOREVER said:

 

You both couldn't be more wrong considering the 2 players that were injured, Pittman and Halkett don't feign injury, both would run through proverbial walls in games. In fact since DJ (our ex goalie), Hippo,  and Danny Mullen left I can't think of any of our players who go down easily and roll about. Nicky Cadden is a bit fragile but he's dislocated his shoulder twice so he isn't exactly pretending to be injured either, the rest are pretty tough and get stuck in.

 

Also, we weren't really time wasting much, other than Alexander taking his time, which all keepers do,  weren't even taking it into the corner to piss about wasting time, we didn't need to.

So, to summarise: the only Livvy players that used to play act have now left - and two of them have come to Saints.

Right....

[LIVIFOREVER]

Just now, Bobby_F said:

So, to summarise: the only Livvy players that used to play act have now left - and two of them have come to Saints.

Right....

LOL, afraid so.

 

Worst I saw was DJ when we beat Falkirk a few seasons back, it was real cringe the play acting he was doing to waste time, even our fans were finding it hard to watch.

 

Beany was well documented for it too but he left a while ago, and gets a lot of stick from the fans of every team he's played for, fantastic player for us though, as was Danny Mullen. Hippo's too inconsistent and his dive for Falkirk's penalty against the Pars was worth a 10 for entertainment alone.

[Coventry Saint]

30 minutes ago, LIVIFOREVER said:

 

You both couldn't be more wrong considering the 2 players that were injured, Pittman and Halkett don't feign injury, both would run through proverbial walls in games. In fact since DJ (our ex goalie), Hippo,  and Danny Mullen left I can't think of any of our players who go down easily and roll about. Nicky Cadden is a bit fragile but he's dislocated his shoulder twice so he isn't exactly pretending to be injured either, the rest are pretty tough and get stuck in.

 

Also, we weren't really time wasting much, other than Alexander taking his time, which all keepers do,  weren't even taking it into the corner to piss about wasting time, we didn't need to.

So I couldn't be more wrong, apart from the bit (most of my post, in fact) about the keeper, which you agree was correct? 

[Durnford]

24 minutes ago, LIVIFOREVER said:

LOL, afraid so.

 

Worst I saw was DJ when we beat Falkirk a few seasons back, it was real cringe the play acting he was doing to waste time, even our fans were finding it hard to watch.

 

Beany was well documented for it too but he left a while ago, and gets a lot of stick from the fans of every team he's played for, fantastic player for us though, as was Danny Mullen. Hippo's too inconsistent and his dive for Falkirk's penalty against the Pars was worth a 10 for entertainment alone.

Think I remember DJ's one where he caught the ball; let out a scream and threw the ball out whilst he rolled about on the ground clutching his hamstring. After about five minutes of treatment he was up with a miracle cure and we were already into time added on.  Really cringeworthy particularly as, I think, we were playing a lower league side.

I see there was one Livi player in this game booked for time-wasting (actually it wasn't the match I was looking for but it will do):

https://spfl.co.uk/championship/fixture/3636795/

And the attached didn't exactly endear Danny to the Saints crowd either.

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/st-mirren-2-livingston-3-6321446

Of the current first team I have to agree that there aren't any serial play-actors/timewaster that spring to mind. If really pushed I would suggest that sometimes De Vita goes down a little too easily and maybe on occasions Dylan Mackin seemed unsteady on his feet for a big man. I also recall Alexander has come under criticism by away supporters for kicking the post before taking a goal-kick; that being said I've seen a lot of goalkeepers doing that so am not really sure that can be classified as time-wasting. As for him dropping to the ground when he catches the ball I suppose it does use up more time (legally) but then again it stops him from quickly distributing the ball to one of the wingers so swings and roundabouts I suppose. I can see how some see it as time wasting however; albeit legal.

As already mentioned Nicky Cadden tends to be a big worry with the persistent weakness on his shoulder; a great player but if he falls wrongly he can easily be out for a couple of weeks despite the tackle maybe being nothing out of the norm.

At  the moment the spirit in the team means that everyone wants to play; if, as many had already predicted, this season had been a relegation dogfight the feeling might have been different. In such circumstances every point is precious. 

[ATLIS]

2 hours ago, LIVIFOREVER said:

Can see why Hippo got booed, he wasn't exactly popular with our fans after his sending off at Dumbarton, and that gleeful snap chat pic on the bus to Ibrox when he was suspended. It was hero to zero for Hippo after that.

Mullen though, well that was bad form, he always put in a shift at Livi giving it his all and deserved some respect, there were more Livi fans clapping him than booing him though. Might've changed after his naughty tackle on Scotty P right enough.

I lost a lot of respect for Mullen after hearing about the circumstances he left in and the reasons for most of his injuries which were absolutely inexcusable. His attitude was absolutely shite too getting booked nearly every week for arguing with the ref and his incessant diving.

Still clapped him off though for what he did with us and the sheer number of appearances he made for us, but after hearing how he left I'm glad we let him go. We've done far better out of it anyway bringing Hardie in

[LiviLion]

35 minutes ago, ATLIS said:

I lost a lot of respect for Mullen after hearing about the circumstances he left in and the reasons for most of his injuries which were absolutely inexcusable. His attitude was absolutely shite too getting booked nearly every week for arguing with the ref and his incessant diving.

Still clapped him off though for what he did with us and the sheer number of appearances he made for us, but after hearing how he left I'm glad we let him go. We've done far better out of it anyway bringing Hardie in

Unless I've missed something all that happened was he said he wanted to leave in the summer rather than extending his contract, so Hopkin didn't play him and he found a new club. Was there more to it?

The booing of him was cringeworthy as f**k considering how long he was with us and how good he was for us. The same lot who boo Beany. 

[Durnford]

I wasn't aware of any bad blood with Mullen leaving either. A long servant to the club; my only criticism was that he never seemed to reach his true potential although in the last hear he seems to have bulked out a bit and become a bit less lightweight.

As for Hippolyte he's always remained friends with many of the team at the club and is in regular contact with a number of the supporters. Livingston offered him a chance to retrieve his career, after a less than auspicious start at Brentford and other non league sides, with a full time professional contract and it seems he remembers that.  He was a major contributor for our challenge cup victory. Getting sent off hardly seems a reason for forgetting all that; as for him smiling on the way to Ibrox well I don't know the reason behind that; I know a number of people made up their mind as to why that was and others seemed now to have accepted that as gospel. He does seem to have developed in his short period with St Mirren; the rare times he appeared with Falkirk I thought he'd lost the plot.

 

[AMC13]

I think there was very few boos for Mullen far more clapping him on, as for Hippo he left in quite a cunty way and to Falkirk as well. Doesn't matter about the booing though it's never spurred him on he's always been shite against us and I reckon his record against us must have quite a few losses

[ATLIS]

1 hour ago, LiviLion said:

Unless I've missed something all that happened was he said he wanted to leave in the summer rather than extending his contract, so Hopkin didn't play him and he found a new club. Was there more to it?

The booing of him was cringeworthy as f**k considering how long he was with us and how good he was for us. The same lot who boo Beany. 

Relatively sure he left because he didn't exactly see eye to eye with Hopkin. I'm sure he had an issue with his attitude and the reason for a majority of his injuries were one of the main reasons they didn't get on too well. A large reason he moved on though was his lofty wages which he didn't seem to justify though