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Project Brave rumbles on..

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stumigoo

stumigoo

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, coprolite said:

 


i disagree.

just because someone can do a spreadsheet of stats and convert it into a nice coloured chart then wibble on about targets etc it doesn't mean that they are any better at identifying weaknesses than a knowledgeable layman.

sports science as a discipline suffers from dodgy peer review and sponsored trials. For example, that tape that they used to put on is widely discredited but it is still "knowledge" amongst some practioners that it supports injured muscles.

you can find equally reliable information on wikipedia to plan your fitness

 

I don't think sports science is the be all and all but to ignore it in a performance related field would be wrong. If these methods can increase performance by even 5% or 10% it makes a massive difference over the course of a season or a person's career. An experienced coach can see a great deal but cannot see everything. Sports scientists probably don't claim to be better at spotting weaknesses but they might be able to pick up something that a coach or an observer cannot. 

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happyaccie

happyaccie

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14 hours ago, Marr1 said:

Left Accies before 2010-11, which is when I started looking from.

You clearly don't understand the concept of Project Brave then, which is to have a number of clubs who are tasked with the development of young Scottish talent, whether as individuals we agree with Project Brave or not and I personally don't, what cannot be questioned is Hamiltons record in Youth Development over the last decade, at a rough guess over this time Accies have introduced 30 young lads into first team football, in another post on this thread I have mentioned 4 players who were all products of our youth programme, all of them advancing their careers by securing moves to England 3 to the EPL and 1 to the championship, although I haven't done extensive research off the top of my head I can't recall another Scottish club having sold 4 products of their youth programme directly to the top 2 leagues in England, this I think merits Accies inclusion into Project Brave.

In another post on this thread I have highlighted reasons why Aberdeen FC & Dundee Utd FC may miss out on making the ' elite group ' I am aware Aberdeen have been included in the predicted elite group. If you look at my post/ posts regarding the Youth programmes these clubs had in the early 80s in particular, programmes which provided both clubs with numerous products which served both clubs well, this young talent indeed playing a huge part in their respective clubs successes  throughout the 80s, since the golden years of these youth programmes, imo both clubs have struggled to produce young talent on a regular basis which has been detrimental to both clubs.This may be a reason for United's exclusion along with not fully meeting the criteria.

 

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coprolite

coprolite

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I don't think sports science is the be all and all but to ignore it in a performance related field would be wrong. If these methods can increase performance by even 5% or 10% it makes a massive difference over the course of a season or a person's career. An experienced coach can see a great deal but cannot see everything. Sports scientists probably don't claim to be better at spotting weaknesses but they might be able to pick up something that a coach or an observer cannot. 


I agree with you, but I think it's a big "if".

as far as i can tell the requirement to get the funding is just to have these roles filled, not to have anybody who is effective in them.

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capt_oats

capt_oats

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12 hours ago, ayrmad said:

Unfortunately that handful won't get to play the other handful or 2 in those clubs that aren't elite.

100%. One of the biggest flaws of the whole thing IMO is the "best vs best" notion in so much as there seems to be a complete failure to recognise that having the "best" structure doesn't necessarily equate to  developing the "best" players.

Whether there's something more cynical going on IDK but if they really wanted to have the "best vs best" they'd be selecting their teams based on where they had been finishing in the league over a period of time. Though even that's flawed as the nature of Dev league football means that the teams are much more in flux as player age and become ineligible.

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craigkillie

craigkillie

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15 hours ago, ayrmad said:

Unfortunately that handful won't get to play the other handful or 2 in those clubs that aren't elite.

 

2 hours ago, capt_oats said:

100%. One of the biggest flaws of the whole thing IMO is the "best vs best" notion in so much as there seems to be a complete failure to recognise that having the "best" structure doesn't necessarily equate to  developing the "best" players.

Whether there's something more cynical going on IDK but if they really wanted to have the "best vs best" they'd be selecting their teams based on where they had been finishing in the league over a period of time. Though even that's flawed as the nature of Dev league football means that the teams are much more in flux as player age and become ineligible.

 

The Killie press release today confirms that Elite clubs will play each other 3 times per season and still play the Progressive (2nd tier) clubs once per season.

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Swello

Swello

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I guess Dundee's mega job advert was an admission that there was little of the (SFA) required structure in place - so I would assume that Dundee would move to the next tier quickly once that's done (two levels below accies has some meltdown potential though :) ) 

Interesting that County are down as appealing their placement - any background on that? Given that Uncle Roy was on the steering committee, I find that one odd....

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capt_oats

capt_oats

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The Killie press release today confirms that Elite clubs will play each other 3 times per season and still play the Progressive (2nd tier) clubs once per season.

Just read the press release there. It seems the ‘Progressive’ tier has been created after consultation. Also interesting to read that teams aren’t locked out, which seemed to have been one of the major issues with the initial draft.

Basically from the sound of it they’ve drawn up a list of criteria to meet, it’s up to the clubs whether they want to invest to meet the standard or not.
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Savage Henry

Savage Henry

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46 minutes ago, Ludo*1 said:

According to the SFA, Dundee aren't even in the second tier, we are in the third:

http://www.scottishfa.co.uk/scottish_fa_news.cfm?page=1961&newsCategoryID=3&newsID=17394

It's okay.  Just hire Ally McCoist and you can hoofball your way up to at least the Progressive league in next to no time.*

 

*Six years.

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capt_oats

capt_oats

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I guess Dundee's mega job advert was an admission that there was little of the (SFA) required structure in place - so I would assume that Dundee would move to the next tier quickly once that's done (two levels below accies has some meltdown potential though [emoji4] ) 
Interesting that County are down as appealing their placement - any background on that? Given that Uncle Roy was on the steering committee, I find that one odd....

Did Uncle Roy not allude to an issue when he spoke to the press about it? Something along the lines that he wasn’t prepared to have them travelling 200 miles on a Sunday (or words to that effect)?

If it’s a principle thing then you could see how it’d be open for debate:

“I’ve been disadvantaged because of geography. I was disadvantaged getting into the league because of it and now I’m being disadvantaged because of historical measurements like the Measurable Performance Outcomes they currently use.

“We’re not good on MPOs but we had a hard job convincing any Scotland youth coaches to ever watch our matches because we were too far away and obviously we’ve only been a top division club for six years anyway.

“It’s difficult to accumulate points for players representing Scotland when you’re coming up through the leagues and when no one comes to see you anyway.

“Another example? I refuse to allow primary school kids to travel 200 miles on a Sunday.

“We’re marked as As in every other category but because I refuse to let that happen, we’re marked as a C and in the bronze category.

“We have all the facilities but you pick up the lowest mark.”

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/roy-macgregor-slams-sfa-amid-11304165
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The Master

The Master

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12 minutes ago, Scotty Tunbridge said:

Dundee in accies shadow again.

Even as a wind-up that makes no sense, considering we've finished above you for so long now, I've lost count.

Only St Johnstone fans can make such a claim.

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Squirrelhumper

Squirrelhumper

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36 minutes ago, capt_oats said:


Did Uncle Roy not allude to an issue when he spoke to the press about it? Something along the lines that he wasn’t prepared to have them travelling 200 miles on a Sunday (or words to that effect)?

If it’s a principle thing then you could see how it’d be open for debate:

“I’ve been disadvantaged because of geography. I was disadvantaged getting into the league because of it and now I’m being disadvantaged because of historical measurements like the Measurable Performance Outcomes they currently use.

“We’re not good on MPOs but we had a hard job convincing any Scotland youth coaches to ever watch our matches because we were too far away and obviously we’ve only been a top division club for six years anyway.

“It’s difficult to accumulate points for players representing Scotland when you’re coming up through the leagues and when no one comes to see you anyway.

“Another example? I refuse to allow primary school kids to travel 200 miles on a Sunday.

“We’re marked as As in every other category but because I refuse to let that happen, we’re marked as a C and in the bronze category.

“We have all the facilities but you pick up the lowest mark.”

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/roy-macgregor-slams-sfa-amid-11304165

Image result for violin tiny

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coprolite

coprolite

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Posted

Did Uncle Roy not allude to an issue when he spoke to the press about it? Something along the lines that he wasn’t prepared to have them travelling 200 miles on a Sunday (or words to that effect)?

If it’s a principle thing then you could see how it’d be open for debate:

“I’ve been disadvantaged because of geography. I was disadvantaged getting into the league because of it and now I’m being disadvantaged because of historical measurements like the Measurable Performance Outcomes they currently use.

“We’re not good on MPOs but we had a hard job convincing any Scotland youth coaches to ever watch our matches because we were too far away and obviously we’ve only been a top division club for six years anyway.

“It’s difficult to accumulate points for players representing Scotland when you’re coming up through the leagues and when no one comes to see you anyway.

“Another example? I refuse to allow primary school kids to travel 200 miles on a Sunday.

“We’re marked as As in every other category but because I refuse to let that happen, we’re marked as a C and in the bronze category.

“We have all the facilities but you pick up the lowest mark.”

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/roy-macgregor-slams-sfa-amid-11304165


Sunday's the best day for kids to travel.

Another example of religion holding back progress.
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