Unions

[The Equalizer]

I am a plant manager in a manufacturing industry in B.C. The shop I run is unionized and it's a new experience for me having worked for UK based companies up until now. I like to think I am a fair guy and I try my best to balance production requirements, quality and the moral obligation I have to my employees.

I understand that this is my first experience of a union and they may not all be the same. You get good and bad reps/shop stewards just as you get good and bad staff/employees, however there are a few things I have noticed in my time here that really gets my goat.

Firstly the whole seniority thing is a massive pain in the arse. It creates a sense of entitlement and means when there is lay-offs you have to get rid of any new staff you have found who are cutting the mustard and keep the dross who have been here for years.

Where I work it’s a new industry for me but in terms of the manufacturing operation it’s pretty basic. I like to call it high volume, low difficulty. You don’t need superstars to run certain positions on the line you just need someone who will turn up every day with a good work ethic and willingness to learn. When I do find a good worker who has shown the right attitude and a position above general labourer is available I have to go through a lengthy posting process and interview everyone with seniority over the guy I want to hire and then have meetings with the union and put a case forward for the guy in question as to why he is more suited for the role. Even then any member who has been here longer than the guy I promote can file a grievance with the union. Getting the best man for the job is not easy.

If we are short-handed and I want to call the guys who I know will come in and put in a shift I can’t because I have to offer the overtime to people in order of seniority. This means you get the lazy fuckers coming in on double time when you could have given it to someone who you know would have worked a lot harder for you. It’s no coincidence that the guys at the top of the seniority list are the laziest fuckers in the place.

Secondly the whole “stealing union brothers jobs” thing. I worked my way up to a management role in my previous industry and that meant when we were short-handed I could get back on the tools and help the guys out when necessary. Something which I enjoyed and I felt it was necessary at times when working to deadlines etc. In my new role I felt it necessary to understand the challenges my employees face day to day and there was no better way to do this than get on the line with them and work the stations. I only ever did this when we were short-handed and I got a lot of respect and thanks from most of the guys on the line for doing this. A few weeks ago some fucker put a grievance in with the union because management was taking work away from the union and it transpired it was a day that I worked on the floor because we only had 7 guys on the crew (we usually run with 11).

Thirdly I see it as a conflict of interest. The union is here to look out for the rights of the workers but as far as I can see they only care about getting and keeping as many in the union as possible. They pay dues and the more people they have the more money they make. How can you look out for the rights and welfare of all workers when you fight tooth and nail to keep everyone in a position regardless of how incompetent/unsafe they are at work?

 

[pandarilla]

Unions are not perfect by any means, but the alternative is much worse.

[invergowrie arab]

am i f**k reading all that

Victory to the Workers !!

[Richey Edwards]

Hope lies in the proles.

[NotThePars]

When I had a work dispute last year, I signed up to Unite and had a callback within an hour where they helped sort out everything. Unions are good c***s.

[bennett]

Should be option two but option one sometimes happens.

We do need unions,  most reps are wanks tho.

[The Equalizer]

I completely understand the need for them in situations where mediation is required. I know there are a lot of b*****ds out there who see responsibility as a stick to beat people with.

I have worked with the union to get counseling and rehab for people who suffer with substance abuse, getting them the help they need and bringing them back to work and in those circumstances they have been great because we were on the same page. When it comes to dealing with them in matters of discipline they just fight it any way they can even in the most cut and dried cases. I get the impression they just have a standard response and don't really give a f**k about the circumstances or how the individuals transgressions has affected his co-workers.

 

The rep I deal with just wants to get a win anyway he can. It's a power game and all about point scoring against management, us and them mentality through and through. He doesn't seem to understand or just doesn't care that if we have good staff all pulling in the same direction it's a better environment for everyone involved.

[SlipperyP]

I'll read OP when I get back to work tomorrow, f**k reading all that on a day off.

[pandarilla]

He doesn't seem to understand or just doesn't care that if we have good staff all pulling in the same direction it's a better environment for everyone involved.

That's a very easy statement to make when you're on the management side of things.

[welshbairn]

I found the Union was handy as a card to hold in reserve, but negotiating with management was far more productive without them. We'd have a much better idea how to sell a deal and just how far to push than some bod sent down from the Union HQ. They were always trying to establish a precedent for other members, whereas as we just wanted the best pay and conditions we could screw out of them for ourselves, f**k everyone else. The management recognised it would be much quicker and less complicated to deal with us direct so were incentivised to wrap up a deal with us, knowing we would bring the Union in if they didn't.

[The Equalizer]

5 minutes ago, pandarilla said:

 

 

 

 

That's a very easy statement to make when you're on the management side of things.

 

 

 I wasn't always a manager. The minute you forget what it's like to be on the floor you're only half the manager you could be.

 

For a union rep to argue over the length of time you're going to extend an employees probation period due to poor attendance and then capitulate with the phrase "I just think you're trying to save money and I'm confident the guy won't work out anyway" is a pretty poor show imo.

As if I care about $1.25 p/h. Having someone show up for work is far more important. It's physical work in here and when people have poor attendance it means that the reliable guys have to pick up the slack. It's not good for morale and I have a responsibility to ensure that the reliable guys aren't penalized for being just that.

That's indicative of the way that rep operates though and I'm not tarring them all with the same brush.

[Cerberus]

There are ways to bust a Union. One trick is to tell them stories that don't go anywhere.

 

[pandarilla]

 I wasn't always a manager. The minute you forget what it's like to be on the floor you're only half the manager you could be.
 
For a union rep to argue over the length of time you're going to extend an employees probation period due to poor attendance and then capitulate with the phrase "I just think you're trying to save money and I'm confident the guy won't work out anyway" is a pretty poor show imo.
As if I care about $1.25 p/h. Having someone show up for work is far more important. It's physical work in here and when people have poor attendance it means that the reliable guys have to pick up the slack. It's not good for morale and I have a responsibility to ensure that the reliable guys aren't penalized for being just that.
That's indicative of the way that rep operates though and I'm not tarring them all with the same brush.

Can't argue with any of that.

There are plenty of arseholes in union positions. But in principle they're fundamentally important. It's like having a lawyer to defend you when you've been accused. Even if you're guilty there's a need for that lawyer.

[The Equalizer]

16 minutes ago, pandarilla said:

 

 

Can't argue with any of that.

There are plenty of arseholes in union positions. But in principle they're fundamentally important. It's like having a lawyer to defend you when you've been accused. Even if you're guilty there's a need for that lawyer.
 

 

That's fair enough but in the case of a lawyer they are only representing the defendants. A good union rep on the other hand surely has an obligation to the workforce as a whole and must balance that with the situation that an individual employee might find themselves in. As should any manager worth his salt.

[Newbornbairn]

I was in the CWU when I was a postie. In 1988 we went on strike because we were seeing the rise of "meter mail" - junk mail. Royal Mail got paid for it but we got sod-all for delivering it even though it was accounting for 50-60% of a delivery. It was a series of one day strikes around the country near Christmas and cost us a fair bit in the way of overtime. The union did a deal with management that gave extra money to the big sorting offices in Manchester, Birmingham and London but absolutely f**k-all to anybody else. When they presented the deal to the reps at a big hall in London they had to be given a police escort out the back doors. f**k the unions.

[D.A.F.C]

Totally necessary. Any company that doesn't have one is WFTW.

[chomp my root]

Never having been a member of a Union due to the nature of work I mostly did, I like the sound of them though.

My old man was a 'shop steward' of sorts although they were spread around and only a few worked together. He fell into it because he was fairly articulate and as much as he was a 'Union man' he wasn't very happy about a lot of the guys who held office in the Union. I suppose its like pretty much everything that people are involved with and ego's will come into play, as soon as that happens people want to 'win'.  Basically, life in a nutshell,  'good guy/w**k' scenario.

[Brother Blades]

I like pickled & rings.

[beefybake]

I am, and always have been very much in favour of unions. I also believe that where the balance of power

in a work environment sways too much in one direction, whether it's completely for the union, or a management

allowed to do exactly as it wishes, is very unhealthy.

 

I only ever really had one poor experience of unions, and that was as an outsider.

 

Long ago, I worked for a large computer manufacturer. I was a newly arrived programmer. Unlike the factories

where the the computers were made, there were no unions in the software section of the company. We were paid quite well,

and there was a kind of unofficlal flexitime, no dress code.  People like me, were basically living like students, except

being paid for it. . I was one of the geek types, who spent most of his time poring through program

code listings, hunting down bugs that customers had reported. 

 

One day I was asked to go to the Headquarters in Peckham, London

of a big union, then known as the AUEW, Amalgmated Union of Engineering Workers.

 

So,  on a Monday morning I showed up,  in company with the local sales support guy from the company. 

The problem was that the union's big old computer, a large mainframe, big air-conditioned room... had finally died

on them, and they'd had to order a brand new one very rapidly. Some vital programes needed to be amended to run on the new computer.

And I was the man.

 

The office manager welcomed the two of us,  and we went to his office. He gave me a bit of an odd look,  as he noticed the long hair,

and ex-Russian Army greatcoat. He then picked up the inter-office phone, and asked the IT manager to come through. Bloke arrived, and 

the Office manager set about giving the IT man an absolute roasting, never seen anything like it in my life in a work environment. He blamed the

IT guy for everything, computer dying on them ..etc, the lot. 

 

I was shown to an office where there were a couple of their computer guys.  And I set about my normal way of work. Pore through

a program, find what needed to be done. feet up on desk, or lean way back in chair on two legs, close eyes, and think about it to make sure 

I wasn't about to *uck something  up. Then into  the air-conditioned computer room, with my greatcoat on to stay warm. Do the mods, and return to the office

and do some more thinking with my eyes closed. 

 

Several times, the office manager would show up, and for some reason, my way of working seemed to make him nervous. It was as if

he really wanted to say..... "Are you sleeping or something,, get back to work...". ..., but couldn't., because, after all, I was saving his bacon. 

 

Come lunchtime, I went up to the canteen. All tables empty, apart from one which had 7 or 8 people at it, with mugs of tea. 

I went up to the serving counter.  Some tea and a sandwich. The woman behind the counter seemed a bit hesitant as she served me.

 

I wandered off to a table, and had taken only a few sandwich bites, when one of the blokes at the other table came over. 

He said that they were having a branch meeting, and it was private, and would I mind leaving. 

I was quite taken aback, didn't know how to handle this, and just said... "Yeah, OK.".

And I got up and went out. 

 

Office knock off time was 5pm. As 5 approached I was in conversation with the staff guy opposite me. At 5 a loud bell rang, and basically

in mid sentence, the guy got up, pulled his coat off the hook, with a "See you tomorrow....",   he was off.

 

All very strange to me. 

[Sergeant Wilson]

When I was a union rep I spent most of my facility time drinking in the union room, the rest of it I spent in the pub. Most union reps do the same until they get fed up. The principles are worthy, but anyone serious about it is usually a desperate goon, looking for pals, willing to hitch their wagon to any cause that will have them.

 

Up the workers!