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Squad face Slovenia and Slovakia


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Burke was left out the squad because he hardly played last season. Need home to get some game time. Needs to work on his positioning as well as gets caught far too often.

5 starts and 20 subs appearances for RB wasn't amazing but it was hardly Alan Hutton territory. Given what Burke is (a potential freak star like, dread I say it, Bale) I think we should have consistently called him up. He would have been a useful sub given his lightning pace and strength. Strachan made a bit of a mess of the whole situation by sending him home from squads more than once. That said using him in the U21s and U20s hasn't been the worst alternative.
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Guest DAVIDB69


Burke was left out the squad because he hardly played last season. Need home to get some game time. Needs to work on his positioning as well as gets caught far too often.



Think he needs get games for West Brom before worrying about Scotland caps he is long way from the finished article
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Think he needs get games for West Brom before worrying about Scotland caps he is long way from the finished article


He is, but would you rather have Chris Martin coming on up front, or Oliver Burke? Who more often than not was trusted by the aide who finished second in the Bundesliga to come on and make an impact in one of the front three positions.
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11 hours ago, No_Problemo said:

 


He is, but would you rather have Chris Martin coming on up front, or Oliver Burke? Who more often than not was trusted by the aide who finished second in the Bundesliga to come on and make an impact in one of the front three positions.

 

Wasn't the problem that he wasn't trusted, hence why he was sold one year into a "project"?

And apart from the usual hate of Chris Martin, there is absolutely nothing to suggest that Burke would be more likely to "make an impact" than Martin.  Only one of them has scored a winner for us after coming off the bench.

At this stage, all evidence is pointing towards Burke being nowhere near ready for the hype that surrounded him.  He's been signed for an ambitious club in the Bundesliga, who say they want him for a long term project, but then gets punted the first sniff they get of recouping their money.  He gets called up straight to the senior Scotland squad, and yet gets sent home halfway through.  

Maybe the professional coaches and managers just don't think he's as good as your average fan does.  Yet.

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26 minutes ago, forameus said:

Wasn't the problem that he wasn't trusted, hence why he was sold one year into a "project"?

And apart from the usual hate of Chris Martin, there is absolutely nothing to suggest that Burke would be more likely to "make an impact" than Martin.  Only one of them has scored a winner for us after coming off the bench.

At this stage, all evidence is pointing towards Burke being nowhere near ready for the hype that surrounded him.  He's been signed for an ambitious club in the Bundesliga, who say they want him for a long term project, but then gets punted the first sniff they get of recouping their money.  He gets called up straight to the senior Scotland squad, and yet gets sent home halfway through.  

Maybe the professional coaches and managers just don't think he's as good as your average fan does.  Yet.

I think you're right that he's not the finished article (well done on not saying 'raw' btw). Mark McGhee said he still needs to learn how to play in a team, which kind of fits with the pattern we've seen from him so far: a few explosive moments for Forest and the odd flash for RBL, but so far rarely if ever a full 90 minute match-intelligent, tactically-aware performance.

Chris Martin isn't everyone's favourite, but he's worth a place in the squad just now as a foil for Griffiths if nothing else. Still though, why would I prefer Burke as an impact sub instead of Martin? Well, Martin simply can't do this kind of thing:

https://giant.gfycat.com/FlawedHoarseKitty.mp4

And maybe that's an ingredient we are missing - a powerful, fast and indeed raw maverick attacker to throw on late if and when we need to bag a goal. The tactical nous will develop in him over the next season or two I'm sure, but I'd hate to think we'll freeze him out of the squad until then.

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1 hour ago, Gordopolis said:

I think you're right that he's not the finished article (well done on not saying 'raw' btw). Mark McGhee said he still needs to learn how to play in a team, which kind of fits with the pattern we've seen from him so far: a few explosive moments for Forest and the odd flash for RBL, but so far rarely if ever a full 90 minute match-intelligent, tactically-aware performance.

Chris Martin isn't everyone's favourite, but he's worth a place in the squad just now as a foil for Griffiths if nothing else. Still though, why would I prefer Burke as an impact sub instead of Martin? Well, Martin simply can't do this kind of thing:

https://giant.gfycat.com/FlawedHoarseKitty.mp4

And maybe that's an ingredient we are missing - a powerful, fast and indeed raw maverick attacker to throw on late if and when we need to bag a goal. The tactical nous will develop in him over the next season or two I'm sure, but I'd hate to think we'll freeze him out of the squad until then.

We're not "freezing him out" though.  He's being used in the U21's for the most part, and when he wasn't he featured in most of the squads we had.  We may as well say that Kris Doolan has been frozen out if we're going down that road, when really he hasn't, he just isn't good enough.

Unless the U21s aren't playing, I'd always have him in that squad to be honest.  He'll learn more being the focal point of a team at his level rather than the chance of being thrown on for a few minutes in the hope that he'll magically do something.   We need to get away from the talisman complex we put around certain players that aren't getting a game.  They're invariably put on a lofty pedestal that they can never reach, meaning that eventually they'll just get turned on.  How dare you not reach the artificially high standards I've imagined up for you!  You've always been shite!  Burke may well end up being that, but he's a flawed player at the moment, and nowhere near ready.  I'd love to have a better option than anyone outside of Griffiths (hell, I'd love a better option than Griffiths) but Burke isn't that.  Again, yet.

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On ‎20‎/‎09‎/‎2017 at 21:18, No_Problemo said:

 


He is, but would you rather have Chris Martin coming on up front, or Oliver Burke? Who more often than not was trusted by the aide who finished second in the Bundesliga to come on and make an impact in one of the front three positions.

 

If it wasn't for Chris Martin we would already be out! Hes played his part this campaign with 2 goals and played a big part in ruffling England

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Still a few tickets left for the Slovakia game.  Granted Hampden isn't a place I really frequent but it's on the run up to my b'day so I'm considering it.  Would be a good night out [emoji4]

The game being a day before my birthday was a factor into me buying tickets too. Going along with the other big Scotland fans in the family
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Burke may well end up being that, but he's a flawed player at the moment, and nowhere near ready.

 

Agree with most of what you say but I think I this bit is overstating it (nowhere near ready).

I reckon a few consecutive starts for WBA is all that stands between him and a return to the full squad.

If he was Welsh or Northern Irish I don't think they'd be messing about with him in the underage squads at this stage. We simply don't have the squad to be choosy and Burke - flaws and rawness aside - offers something no other eligible player does.

 

Just to be clear I'm not touting him as a saviour or anything like that, but I think it's been a bit of an overreaction to drop him to the u21s and U20s.

 

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If it wasn't for Chris Martin we would already be out! Hes played his part this campaign with 2 goals and played a big part in ruffling England

His biggest contribution has been falling over against malta n England.....literally any other player could have scored his tap ins. Hes an utter waste of a jersey which frankly we cant afford. We need quick mobile players which despite his flaws burke is. An immobile lump who doesnt win headers n cant hold the ball is pointless.
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His biggest contribution has been falling over against malta n England.....literally any other player could have scored his tap ins. Hes an utter waste of a jersey which frankly we cant afford. We need quick mobile players which despite his flaws burke is. An immobile lump who doesnt win headers n cant hold the ball is pointless.

Tbf his finish Vs Slovenia was more than a tap in. I've grown to accept him as a useful option but certainly not our main striker as Strachan seemed to believe he was
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His biggest contribution has been falling over against malta n England.....literally any other player could have scored his tap ins. Hes an utter waste of a jersey which frankly we cant afford. We need quick mobile players which despite his flaws burke is. An immobile lump who doesnt win headers n cant hold the ball is pointless.


Yes, let's just completely ignore the last minute winner he scored from a tight angle, on his weak foot, against of one the finest young keepers in world football.

I don't rate him, he's a big huddy, but folk like you just completely making things up to slate him baffle me.
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Good to see Cooper in, no surprises otherwise - I think Russell Martin is injured which is why Hanley has been in Norwich squads lately and Martin hasn't?

Personally I'd have liked it if Bannan was as far away from the squad as possible as the presence of him and Ritchie gives me the fear that Strachan will revert to using them as wingers who cut inside all the time and that'll take us back to the abysmal pedestrian performances of the start of the campaign, but that was never likely. As long as Fraser is the one who starts if Phillips or Forrest drop out it's fine.

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