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When is a football banning order, not a football banning order?


Falside Jag

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I have just caught up with the news that Brian Martin, formerly of Musselburgh, has been given a banning order after his actions at the Scottish Cup Final last May.  He claims that he's now retired as he can't play for Berwick (his current club ).  So, can anybody explain, because I'm genuinely puzzled, how can Craig Wojtwocyk (apologies if that's spelt wrong) play for Tranent?  Could Martin, if he wished, drop down and play Junior again?

 

 

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At a rough guess -

If he's been banned under The Football Banning Orders (Regulated Football Matches) (Scotland) Order 2013 (which also covers the Offensive Behaviour at Football Act) then

(1)A football banning order is an order which— prohibits the person against whom it is made from entering any premises for the purposes of attending any regulated football matches in the United Kingdom;

however that means,

(a)football matches anywhere in the United Kingdom where one or both of the participating teams—

(i)represents a country or territory;

(ii)represents a club which is for the time being a member of the Scottish Professional Football League;

(iii)represents a club which is for the time being a member (whether a full or associate member) of the Football League, the Football Association Premier League, the Football Conference or the League of Wales;

(aa)football matches anywhere in the United Kingdom, not falling within paragraph (a)–

(I) which are part of a competition or tournament organised by, or under the authority of, the Federation Internationale de Football Associations (“FIFA”) or the Union of European Football Associations (“UEFA”); and

(ii) where one or both of the participating teams represents a club which is for the time being a member (whether a full or associate member) of, or affiliated to, a national football association which is a member of FIFA;

 

Or to sum up - they are probably banned from the 42 SPFL club grounds and all the appropriate grounds in England and Wales as well but in terms of Junior grounds it comes down to whether or not the SJFA and its clubs fall under the final paragraph in terms of affiliation etc with the SFA but I'd say playing Junior would be fine.

 

FYI, whats classed as offensive behaviour,

56 “Violence” and “disorder”S

(1)This section applies for the purposes of this Chapter.

(2)Violence” means violence against persons or intentional damage to property and includes—

(a)threatening violence; and

(b)doing anything which endangers the life of a person.

(3)Disorder” includes—

(a)stirring up hatred against a group of persons based on their membership (or presumed membership) of a group defined by reference to a thing mentioned in subsection (5), or against an individual as a member of such a group;

(b)using threatening, abusive or insulting words or behaviour or disorderly behaviour;

(c)displaying any writing or other thing which is threatening, abusive or insulting.

(4)In subsection (3)(a), “presumed” means presumed by the person doing the stirring up.

(5)The things referred to in subsection (3)(a) are—

(a)colour;

(b)race;

(c)nationality (including citizenship);

(d)ethnic or national origins;

(e)membership of a religious group or of a social or cultural group with a perceived religious affiliation;

(f)sexual orientation;

(g)transgender identity;

(h)disability.

(6)In subsection (5)—

  • disability” means physical or mental impairment of any kind;

  • religious group” has the meaning given by section 74(7) of the Criminal Justice (Scotland) Act 2003 (asp 7);

  • transgender identity” means any of the following—

    (a) transvestism;
    (b) transsexualism;
    (c) intersexuality;
    (d) having, by virtue of the Gender Recognition Act 2004 (c. 7), changed gender.

 

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2 hours ago, Falside Jag said:

I have just caught up with the news that Brian Martin, formerly of Musselburgh, has been given a banning order after his actions at the Scottish Cup Final last May.  He claims that he's now retired as he can't play for Berwick (his current club ).  So, can anybody explain, because I'm genuinely puzzled, how can Craig Wojtwocyk (apologies if that's spelt wrong) play for Tranent?  Could Martin, if he wished, drop down and play Junior again?

 

 

Hi Lee Wallace, hiya pal.

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Hi Lee Wallace, hiya pal.

Public domain surely? As far as I'm aware, given that Brian Martin spoke to a paper which is what I read this morning, and the other lads situation was well publicised at the time it's hardly that big a deal. Is it Craig? [emoji6]
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At a rough guess -
If he's been banned under The Football Banning Orders (Regulated Football Matches) (Scotland) Order 2013 (which also covers the Offensive Behaviour at Football Act) then
(1)A football banning order is an order which— prohibits the person against whom it is made from entering any premises for the purposes of attending any regulated football matches in the United Kingdom;
however that means,
(a)football matches anywhere in the United Kingdom where one or both of the participating teams—
(i)represents a country or territory;

(ii)represents a club which is for the time being a member of the Scottish Professional Football League;

(iii)represents a club which is for the time being a member (whether a full or associate member) of the Football League, the Football Association Premier League, the Football Conference or the League of Wales;

(aa)football matches anywhere in the United Kingdom, not falling within paragraph (a)–

(I) which are part of a competition or tournament organised by, or under the authority of, the Federation Internationale de Football Associations (“FIFA”) or the Union of European Football Associations (“UEFA”); and

(ii) where one or both of the participating teams represents a club which is for the time being a member (whether a full or associate member) of, or affiliated to, a national football association which is a member of FIFA;
 
Or to sum up - they are probably banned from the 42 SPFL club grounds and all the appropriate grounds in England and Wales as well but in terms of Junior grounds it comes down to whether or not the SJFA and its clubs fall under the final paragraph in terms of affiliation etc with the SFA but I'd say playing Junior would be fine.
 
FYI, whats classed as offensive behaviour,
56 “Violence” and “disorder”S
(1)This section applies for the purposes of this Chapter.

(2)“Violence” means violence against persons or intentional damage to property and includes—

(a)threatening violence; and

(b)doing anything which endangers the life of a person.

(3)“Disorder” includes—

(a)stirring up hatred against a group of persons based on their membership (or presumed membership) of a group defined by reference to a thing mentioned in subsection (5), or against an individual as a member of such a group;

(b)using threatening, abusive or insulting words or behaviour or disorderly behaviour;

©displaying any writing or other thing which is threatening, abusive or insulting.

(4)In subsection (3)(a), “presumed” means presumed by the person doing the stirring up.

(5)The things referred to in subsection (3)(a) are—

(a)colour;

(b)race;

©nationality (including citizenship);

(d)ethnic or national origins;

(e)membership of a religious group or of a social or cultural group with a perceived religious affiliation;

(f)sexual orientation;

(g)transgender identity;

(h)disability.

(6)In subsection (5)—
  • “disability” means physical or mental impairment of any kind;
  • “religious group” has the meaning given by section 74(7) of the Criminal Justice (Scotland) Act 2003 (asp 7);
  • “transgender identity” means any of the following—
    (a) transvestism; (b) transsexualism; © intersexuality; (d) having, by virtue of the Gender Recognition Act 2004 (c. 7), changed gender.
 


Pretty clear then. I wonder if he'll make himself available for a Junior side.
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11 hours ago, Falside Jag said:

Pretty clear then. I wonder if he'll make himself available for a Junior side.

 

I hope so. A very good player would be a great addition to any team.

Not surprised the gutter paper EN reports this and non stop tweets it. I must have missed the piece they did on him after he donated a defib to his last junior team.

The ban is pathetic. Stand on the park or surrounding area at hampden = a year ban and a huge fine.

If he had broke a players leg playing in the game = 3 match ban

Or buy Rangers for a quid,  rip them to pieces, put them in admin etc = nothing!

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I hope so. A very good player would be a great addition to any team.
Not surprised the gutter paper EN reports this and non stop tweets it. I must have missed the piece they did on him after he donated a defib to his last junior team.
The ban is pathetic. Stand on the park or surrounding area at hampden = a year ban and a huge fine.
If he had broke a players leg playing in the game = 3 match ban
Or buy Rangers for a quid,  rip them to pieces, put them in admin etc = nothing!


You do know that it's not the SFA who give the banning order right? Same as it's not the court who decides football suspensions?
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8 hours ago, Dindeleux said:

You do know that it's not the SFA who give the banning order right? Same as it's not the court who decides football suspensions?

 

That's the point. 

But when you compare the ban to the other examples it is extremely harsh.

The Russian tennis lass can test positive for banned substances and she is back playing within a year.

As he was a footballer and technically can't do that job, it would be interesting to see if all the other folk who did the same thing or the ones who were fighting etc have also lost their job.

 

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On 28/03/2017 at 08:37, Falside Jag said:

I have just caught up with the news that Brian Martin, formerly of Musselburgh, has been given a banning order after his actions at the Scottish Cup Final last May.  He claims that he's now retired as he can't play for Berwick (his current club ).  So, can anybody explain, because I'm genuinely puzzled, how can Craig Wojtwocyk (apologies if that's spelt wrong) play for Tranent?  Could Martin, if he wished, drop down and play Junior again?

 

 

Just caught with the news that falside jag is a bit of Snitch. 

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11 hours ago, The Faceman said:

That's the point. 

But when you compare the ban to the other examples it is extremely harsh.

The Russian tennis lass can test positive for banned substances and she is back playing within a year.

As he was a footballer and technically can't do that job, it would be interesting to see if all the other folk who did the same thing or the ones who were fighting etc have also lost their job.

 

If playing for shite like Berwick is your job then you're doing it wrong.

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4 hours ago, JPGR said:

If playing for shite like Berwick is your job then you're doing it wrong.

That's your view.

being good enough to play football at any level is what any kid dreams of. Personally would rather play for Berwick or any local side and enjoy it than work in a dead end job.

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