John Lambies Doos Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 We have really seen the ugly side of English Nationalism over the last 9 months. Watching QT last night and seeing some c***s spewing about the EU, Scotland etc.... whilst pushing a 1800s colonial agenda was cringe. This inward looking vile trait is completely opposite to the outward inclusive Scottish journey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fide Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 Yes, but Scottish nationalism is divisive. Vile, frankly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 I always feel uncomfortable entering a debate that centres around 'my nationalism is better than your nationalism' I wouldn't class myself as a Scottish Nationalist even though I am pro-independence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Gaines Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 1 hour ago, Karl Fletcher said: I always feel uncomfortable entering a debate that centres around 'my nationalism is better than your nationalism' I wouldn't class myself as a Scottish Nationalist even though I am pro-independence Unfortunately it's a debate that will have to be adressed by the Yes campaign at some point. Because people swallow bullshit thrown at them. I'd be happy for the Yes campaign to go tit for tat on any area that bullshit gets thrown from, and this is included in that. Don't be voiceless on any subject at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogmc Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 I always feel uncomfortable entering a debate that centres around 'my nationalism is better than your nationalism' I wouldn't class myself as a Scottish Nationalist even though I am pro-independence Many would say they just think the best route to a fairer more just society is escaping Westminster. The irony comes when britnats hammer supporters of independence for being nationalist whilst ignoring that they themselves are pushing an entirely nationalistic agenda since they are struggling to find a coherent argument in support of the union. They are reduced to union flags the queen and other nationalistic iconography. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1320Lichtie Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 If I'm a nationalist by wanting my country to make decisions for itself and have self governance then so be it. I would say that as I've gotten older the patriotic side of me has regressed massively. Used to think I was extremely proud to be Scottish, but when you get older and mature you realise that everyone's the same but just born on a different part of the worlds rock. Sort of makes you wonder what it is to be of a certain nationality anyway. It doesn't really mean anything. Right now I wouldn't say I was proud to be Scottish and I don't even really think about it in the same way. I just so happen to be born in this part of the world alongside a lot of other people, good and bad people. I think that could maybe change with independence, if the country as a collective group of people chose a progressive way to try and make life better for everybody that stayed here I think I would say I was proud to be Scottish, and it would be nothing to do with flags or history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fide Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 2 hours ago, Randy Giles said: Unfortunately it's a debate that will have to be adressed by the Yes campaign at some point. Because people swallow bullshit thrown at them. I'd be happy for the Yes campaign to go tit for tat on any area that bullshit gets thrown from, and this is included in that. Don't be voiceless on any subject at all. Agreed. The previous Yes campaign in 2014 was very wary of appearing overtly aggressive, I feel. Whilst we don't need to employ bully boy tactics, we shouldn't stand idly by this time while Project Fear spins more lies and bullshit, thinking they can do so unchallenged. It is true that a lie can travel half way round the world before the truth gets it's boots on. We need to be proactive and jump on their shite this time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotThePars Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 Some nationalisms are ultimately more valid than others as a political force. There's no need to push English nationalism when it's the dominant partner in a union of four and is oppressed by no one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Gaines Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 Agreed. The previous Yes campaign in 2014 was very wary of appearing overtly aggressive, I feel. Absolutely. They've got to be willing to take the gloves off this time out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Lambies Doos Posted March 28, 2017 Author Share Posted March 28, 2017 They are reduced to union flags the queen and other nationalistic iconography. And of course brexit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin_Nevis Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 Absolutely. They've got to be willing to take the gloves off this time out. Definitely this. If we lose this time I want us to go down fighting (not literally). We should absolutely stamp down hard on pro-yoon bullshit. We tried far too hard to.plrase everyone last time and paid the price both for that and not putting across the currency issue properly. A strong defendable currency policy, taking no shite and not sending bumbling fools like Fiona Hyslop to TV debates and I'll start to fancy our chances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Heliums Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 6 hours ago, 1320Lichtie said: If I'm a nationalist by wanting my country to make decisions for itself and have self governance then so be it. I would say that as I've gotten older the patriotic side of me has regressed massively. Used to think I was extremely proud to be Scottish, but when you get older and mature you realise that everyone's the same but just born on a different part of the worlds rock. We've got a great history and a beautiful country. Something to be proud of. We're no better than anyone else – but, crucially, no worse. If 195 other countries on this planet can make a go of it, we can too. The only time I ever feel a tinge of shame in being Scottish is when I hear the slavers of the most intransigent unionists – the ones who take pleasure in seeing Scotland doing badly as long as it furthers their point. I do wonder if any other country in the world has the same problem. I've never seen it anywhere else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambie's Pigeon Feed Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 Voting Yes doesn't make you a nationalist, it makes you a democrat. Colin Fox was saying that all last campaign and he is spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz FFC Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 10 hours ago, Fide said: Agreed. The previous Yes campaign in 2014 was very wary of appearing overtly aggressive, I feel. Whilst we don't need to employ bully boy tactics, we shouldn't stand idly by this time while Project Fear spins more lies and bullshit, thinking they can do so unchallenged. It is true that a lie can travel half way round the world before the truth gets it's boots on. We need to be proactive and jump on their shite this time. Definitely got annoyed in 2014 the way the media were allowed to just help better together with lies and completely unchallenged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Ferrino Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 Do you think Danny Dyer is a c**t? Yes or no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kincardine Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 7 minutes ago, Gaz FFC said: Definitely got annoyed in 2014 the way the media were allowed to just help better together with lies and completely unchallenged. This is revisionist bollocks. 'Leave' were well represented and given a fair hearing. That they couldn't make it stick was down to the message rather than the medium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz FFC Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 1 minute ago, The_Kincardine said: This is revisionist bollocks. 'Leave' were well represented and given a fair hearing. That they couldn't make it stick was down to the message rather than the medium. Is it any coincidence the age group who voted no (pensioners) are also the age group mostly buying crappy tabloids and believing every damn word? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kincardine Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 6 minutes ago, Gaz FFC said: Is it any coincidence the age group who voted no (pensioners) are also the age group mostly buying crappy tabloids and believing every damn word? I think that the 'no' vote last time was broadly right irrespective of demographics. I also think it's a shame on Scotland's electorate that wee Nicola and her brain-dead minions have asked for a new plebiscite and they must be seen as single-issue idiots. The shame is that there's no credible alternative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 I'm a big fan of Billy Bragg and his views of englishness. There are plenty of progressive voices down south but they've never really needed to be openly English (hence the far right have filled that gap).I would hope the Scottish independence movement would force a conversation to take place about englishness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotThePars Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 It took a world war and large scale plundering of far flung territories to get the one great achievement of the United Kingdom: the welfare state. I really don't know what England is supposed to be proud of. They couldn't even successfully overthrow the monarchy in any permanent sense of the word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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