come on shire Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 16 minutes ago, Jaggy Snake said: While there are certainly parts where football can learn from rugby on the whole, the set-up is fundamentally too different to get any huge benefit from comparisons. Scotland only has two professional rugby teams, where the SRU play a huge role in how each club is run, including signing players. Last year Duncan Weir moved from Glasgow to Edinburgh, and Mark Bennett is about to do the same, because whilst they have done well for Glasgow, they are Scottish internationalists and will get more game time at Edinburgh. Imagine Celtic having three good, Scottish centrebacks and the SFA announcing one had to move to Rangers/Aberdeen/Hearts to get more game time. This also means most Scottish rugby players will have, at one point anyway, played for Edinburgh or Glasgow so the international squad already know each other very well. As far as I can see, the closest thing Scottish football could do to replicate this would be requiring a very high number of Scottish players in each team, eg 7 out of 11 starting players have to be qualified for Scotland. This could in the short term also damage Scottish football as Celtic, and whoever else is getting knocked out in the qualifiers each year, could struggle more in Europe. Which leads to the other big difference. Glasgow and Edinburgh play in a European league that includes most of the best Welsh, Irish and Italian players (obviously with a few other players off playing in England/France). So, though there is generally a step up in overall quality at international rugby, the players have plenty of club experience playing against similar calibre opposition from other major rugby nations. Until either, Scottish football teams improve in European competitions or, we get more Scottish players playing for top clubs around Europe, getting a whole squad of players who can comfortably adjust to high level international football* is a long way off. And, of course, the only way of improving the standard of Scottish player is by improving Scottish football on the whole – through grassroots football, a better league structure, better finance etc. *Note, I say high level international football as even with the players we currently have, we should be more competitive than we have been of late. Sums this debate up perfectly. We can learn from different sports but when it comes to the nitty-gritty we are just vastly different in terms of how the 2 sports are layed out and managed etc. Rugby's on the up and hopefully it stays that way instead of a one-off generation. In football, we need to go back to the drawing board. Success lies in the grassroots, domestic game, domestic teams in Europe THEN international footy in that order. It'll take many years, but it's the only option and can be done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Algebraist Posted February 28, 2017 Author Share Posted February 28, 2017 6 hours ago, come on shire said: Sums this debate up perfectly. We can learn from different sports but when it comes to the nitty-gritty we are just vastly different in terms of how the 2 sports are layed out and managed etc. Rugby's on the up and hopefully it stays that way instead of a one-off generation. In football, we need to go back to the drawing board. Success lies in the grassroots, domestic game, domestic teams in Europe THEN international footy in that order. It'll take many years, but it's the only option and can be done. I don't disagree with this necessarily but I think the national team has a lot more potential to play a leading role than you give it credit for. Every Scottish kid still wants to play for Scotland, if it's known Scotland play a certain way that's the coaching discerning mums and aspiring players will be after. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 Hire a decent foreign manager that will get us playing to our strengths rather that some clown and his cronies who picks players he's pally with to fit into his ball-achingly predictable 'system'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thisal Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 Why is everyone wanting the SFA to follow the SRU. All the SRU have done is copy the SFA. Back 2 teams at the expense of all others. Club rugby in Scotland has gone backwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
placidcasual Posted March 11, 2017 Share Posted March 11, 2017 [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
come on shire Posted March 12, 2017 Share Posted March 12, 2017 9 hours ago, placidcasual said: Awful defeat but generally a good campaign apart from that. At least our rugby team take their sport seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMMjag Posted March 12, 2017 Share Posted March 12, 2017 Yet another dismal failure for North British rugger. That's a wee shame Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
come on shire Posted March 12, 2017 Share Posted March 12, 2017 47 minutes ago, AMMjag said: Yet another dismal failure for North British rugger. That's a wee shame Fingers crossed the North British footy players get a win vs Slovenia. If not at least we've taken part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogmc Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 At least the sru had a decent exit strategy for the head coach when the shit interfaced with the fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkoRaj Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 Awful defeat but generally a good campaign apart from that. Sounds familiar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulloch Gorum Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 The national rugby team play a tournament against the same five teams every year, with an annual round of friendlies thrown in, and a world cup they're all but guaranteed to play in every time. The scales for measuring achievement in rugby and football are totally different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmag1888 Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 I don't think Football and Rugby are necessarily interchangeable, but there's definitely bits and pieces we could learn from another team sport. But forget looking to the SRU...surely someone at the SFA must have thought to send over a group to New Zealand to see what they do at youth level to produce so many world class players, from a population of 4.5 million? Probably the most dominant team in any team sport, over a sustained period. Surely there's aspects of that structure you could adopt here? I read that the SFA are looking into women's golf in Korea to come up with new adaptations to the structure in youth football here...surely NZ is a much better shout? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulloch Gorum Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 15 minutes ago, pmag1888 said: I don't think Football and Rugby are necessarily interchangeable, but there's definitely bits and pieces we could learn from another team sport. But forget looking to the SRU...surely someone at the SFA must have thought to send over a group to New Zealand to see what they do at youth level to produce so many world class players, from a population of 4.5 million? Probably the most dominant team in any team sport, over a sustained period. Surely there's aspects of that structure you could adopt here? I read that the SFA are looking into women's golf in Korea to come up with new adaptations to the structure in youth football here...surely NZ is a much better shout? Good grief, really? That's a novel one, I'll gie them that. What muppet signed off the expenses form for those cretins to go and ogle young women in Korea, do you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmag1888 Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 http://www.bunkered.co.uk/golf-news/sfa-seek-inspiration-from-south-korean-golf Not exactly a peer reviewed source, but you catch my drift. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
come on shire Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 I have been to umpteen rugby internationals as that's my game but I don't follow the footy team that closely (only been to 3 games but I still want to see them win). Therefore, I couldn't talk about the footy team with even a modicum of authority. However, I DO know one thing. The 2 industries in Scotland are so, so different. The way they are run are different, the leagues they play in are different. It is ALL so different. Instead of looking at another sport, look at another country's footy set-up. Spain or Germany for example. However, that would be a long-term plan. In the meantime let's just get behind ALL Scottish teams/athletes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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