The Moonster Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 13 minutes ago, Mon Dieu said: Thanks for the link - I chuckled at the pre-match sequence until the video shown a higher resolution & superior quality to HibsTV (it is free too). Was the offside incident before the video clip of Hibs breaking forward & scoring? The only point that I noticed Commons ahead of the second-last man was when he received the ball in our own half. It's when Buchanan heads the initial cross out, Commons is standing behind him in an offside position. You actually hear our keeper shout to tell Buchanan to head it away but if he'd left it Commons is offside. As I said, by the rules he's not offside as he hasn't challenged for the ball but I feel he's having an effect on the play regardless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cedrick1 Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 Thought it at time and highlights confirm. No on really to blame in our defence for goal. Actually smith heads initial ball but just falls wrong side of Vaughan and Barr heads next ball clear . Don't blame any of named . Mad others have said possibly best we've played all season and crucial we can turn performances into points starting next week Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squeezeboxson Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 1 hour ago, Mon Dieu said: Thanks for the link - I chuckled at the pre-match sequence until the video shown a higher resolution & superior quality to HibsTV (it is free too). Was the offside incident before the video clip of Hibs breaking forward & scoring? The only point that I noticed Commons ahead of the second-last man was when he received the ball in our own half - which isn't an offside position. If you go to about 2.25 on the highlights. The ball is played in and David Smith (our RB) has to header clear. Commons in behind him. If he isn't there then we let the cross go out of play for a goal kick. As Moonster has said, this is where the rules are iffy to say the least. It is hard to see Commons as the ball is played in as he comes into the screen just after the ball is played in. But at the time myself and a couple of the other guys were pretty much in line with it and he was clearly beyond our last player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boghead ranter Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 13 hours ago, Kenny Ashwood said: I don't post very often. Choose my n Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cameron2000 Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 I don't post very often.Choose my moments.I was proud to be a DFC fan yesterday.That is as good a performance as I have seen from a Dumbarton team since probably the Scottish Cup tie away to Aberdeen.Stevie has done a great job since the Bonnyrigg fiasco.I think that the squad we have just now is more than capable of staying in this league.Very emotional to see Gordon Lennon's son Kai at at the game yesterday.I'm sure that Gordon would be immensely proud to see how far we have progressed since winning the 3rd division under his tutorage. Happy birthday Kenny! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nowhereman Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 5 hours ago, squeezeboxson said: If you go to about 2.25 on the highlights. The ball is played in and David Smith (our RB) has to header clear. Commons in behind him. If he isn't there then we let the cross go out of play for a goal kick. As Moonster has said, this is where the rules are iffy to say the least. It is hard to see Commons as the ball is played in as he comes into the screen just after the ball is played in. But at the time myself and a couple of the other guys were pretty much in line with it and he was clearly beyond our last player. Boyle looks as if he could be offside too when Commons' shot goes in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mon Dieu Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 8 hours ago, The Moonster said: It's when Buchanan heads the initial cross out, Commons is standing behind him in an offside position. You actually hear our keeper shout to tell Buchanan to head it away but if he'd left it Commons is offside. As I said, by the rules he's not offside as he hasn't challenged for the ball but I feel he's having an effect on the play regardless. 8 hours ago, squeezeboxson said: If you go to about 2.25 on the highlights. The ball is played in and David Smith (our RB) has to header clear. Commons in behind him. If he isn't there then we let the cross go out of play for a goal kick. As Moonster has said, this is where the rules are iffy to say the least. It is hard to see Commons as the ball is played in as he comes into the screen just after the ball is played in. But at the time myself and a couple of the other guys were pretty much in line with it and he was clearly beyond our last player. That's Boyle in both instances, not Commons. Boyle doesn't make a direct play for either ball and is not obstructing the play/keeper for the second instance. It is a fair point; Boyle's presence debatably makes the defender do something he may not have done, had he not been there, but it's a bit of a stretch. There isn't a rule for indirectly affecting play and I don't believe that Boyle directly affected play. I'd probably disown Third Rock From His Son's son had it happened to us though: I'd send him back to that monster without a second thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThirdrockfromtheSon Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 On 16 January 2017 at 15:38, Mon Dieu said: That's Boyle in both instances, not Commons. Boyle doesn't make a direct play for either ball and is not obstructing the play/keeper for the second instance. It is a fair point; Boyle's presence debatably makes the defender do something he may not have done, had he not been there, but it's a bit of a stretch. There isn't a rule for indirectly affecting play and I don't believe that Boyle directly affected play. I'd probably disown Third Rock From His Son's son had it happened to us though: I'd send him back to that monster without a second thought. Monster, eh! This gets better by the day! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King_Of_Kings Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 On 16/01/2017 at 06:41, The Moonster said: It's when Buchanan heads the initial cross out, Commons is standing behind him in an offside position. You actually hear our keeper shout to tell Buchanan to head it away but if he'd left it Commons is offside. As I said, by the rules he's not offside as he hasn't challenged for the ball but I feel he's having an effect on the play regardless. On 16/01/2017 at 07:34, squeezeboxson said: If you go to about 2.25 on the highlights. The ball is played in and David Smith (our RB) has to header clear. Commons in behind him. If he isn't there then we let the cross go out of play for a goal kick. As Moonster has said, this is where the rules are iffy to say the least. It is hard to see Commons as the ball is played in as he comes into the screen just after the ball is played in. But at the time myself and a couple of the other guys were pretty much in line with it and he was clearly beyond our last player. The rules regarding this are iffy but nobody forced Smith to head the ball. If Smith thinks that Boyle is offside which it's clear to everyone that he was then he should have just left it and if Boyle touched it he would have been flagged offside. As the ball is coming in Boyle is coming back out of that area to get back onside and wouldn't have been able to reach the ball if Smith had left it I don't think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aftershocker Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 5 minutes ago, King_Of_Kings said: The rules regarding this are iffy but nobody forced Smith to head the ball. If Smith thinks that Boyle is offside which it's clear to everyone that he was then he should have just left it and if Boyle touched it he would have been flagged offside. As the ball is coming in Boyle is coming back out of that area to get back onside and wouldn't have been able to reach the ball if Smith had left it I don't think. i think this flags up the problem with the current rules....defenders have to clear the ball..they cannot assume the ref or linesman will actually give an offside decision....I would suggest that any defender who has to rush into a clearance in this type of situation is surely being affected by the presence of the opposition player...who is therefore interfering with play Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 6 minutes ago, King_Of_Kings said: The rules regarding this are iffy but nobody forced Smith to head the ball. If Smith thinks that Boyle is offside which it's clear to everyone that he was then he should have just left it and if Boyle touched it he would have been flagged offside. As the ball is coming in Boyle is coming back out of that area to get back onside and wouldn't have been able to reach the ball if Smith had left it I don't think. Well, clearly everyone didn't think he was offside as our keeper quite clearly shouts "AWAY" as the ball comes in. No chance a player is going to leave a ball like that and hope for offside, you play to the whistle. Anyway, it's done and dusted and we should move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King_Of_Kings Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 7 minutes ago, aftershocker said: i think this flags up the problem with the current rules....defenders have to clear the ball..they cannot assume the ref or linesman will actually give an offside decision....I would suggest that any defender who has to rush into a clearance in this type of situation is surely being affected by the presence of the opposition player...who is therefore interfering with play I agree there's a problem with the current rules and they should amend them to cover this kind of situation but as of now there isn't. I can't remember the 2 teams playing but on Match of the Day a similar situation happened. The ball came in and an offside player was behind the defender and the defender tried to head the ball away to stop the attacker getting on the end of it but ended up heading it in to his own goal. The pundits were split as to whether it was offside or not due to the attacker affecting the play. 5 minutes ago, The Moonster said: Well, clearly everyone didn't think he was offside as our keeper quite clearly shouts "AWAY" as the ball comes in. No chance a player is going to leave a ball like that and hope for offside, you play to the whistle. Anyway, it's done and dusted and we should move on. It might be hard for the keeper to tell but the defender should be able to tell that he's a couple steps behind him. I suppose it's easy to say that now though looking back, with the speed of the game he may not have noticed him being offside. The rules being as they are I can't see how the ref or linesman can give it offside but I think all football authorities should look at amending the rules to cover this sort of situation. Anyway as you say it's done and dusted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squeezeboxson Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 37 minutes ago, King_Of_Kings said: It might be hard for the keeper to tell but the defender should be able to tell that he's a couple steps behind him. I suppose it's easy to say that now though looking back, with the speed of the game he may not have noticed him being offside. The rules being as they are I can't see how the ref or linesman can give it offside but I think all football authorities should look at amending the rules to cover this sort of situation. Anyway as you say it's done and dusted I'd agree with most of this. It is impossible for the defender to know with the speed in which the incident actually plays out. If he leaves it and Boyle knocks it in, he would be badly at fault if it wasn't given offside. I reckon there has to be a change of some kind in the rules. As more than one person has mentioned, surely the fact the defender and 'keeper aren't taking a chance on leaving it because the player is there, means the player is effecting play? The change wouldn't have to be great, but just that in situations where the players presence has effected the choice of any other player on the pitch, then they should be deemed as active. The biggest frustration in it is that we played so well and that was the only goal which stopped us gaining a point. But plenty positives to take forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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