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Juniors in the big Scottish do we deserve to be there?


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7 minutes ago, Quantum Leap said:

 


Of course there is.
There is a Malcolm jr who loves next door to me.
They call it non league or semi pro down in England.........
Senior thickos..emoji1.png

 

Not interested in your amorous liaisons with next door?

Junior is not the same as non league

Don't really visit the junior forum so thought the phrase junior thicko was just daft patter, but maybe not?

There is a saying " better to say nothing and be thought a fool than to open it and remove all doubt "

Same applies to typing on a keyboard

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No, if you want to play in the scottish cup, join the lowland or highland league.



That won't happen my friend. Their set up is poor from the ground level. Hardly any fanbase and it would ludicrous to have Talbot Beith Pollok and the likes travel hundred of miles to play a team for the sake of a silly pyramid system.
The SFA know it was a mistake but their arrogance to acknowledge it is what everyone had come to expect.
Remoulding the Juniors brands and amalgamate West/East/North would be a better option.
The fanbase proves The Juniors should have been the choice ahead of the HL/LL set up
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Strange, to me, many of the posts basically highlight the problems Scottish football has instead of talking about the positives (see below). Think back to the start of the senior season, Celtic drubbed by Barcelona,  not trying to compare, look at Celtic now, apparently unbeatable in Scotland, but still dreaming of greater things, perhaps next year, who knows. Then take the Scottish cup game yesterday, Morton proved (to me) they are a young fit team who pass the ball really well and had done their homework on how to beat Beith, they could push the top two in the championship for promotion, probably their dream, but why not. As for Beith, crowd was great, team tried really hard throughout, their game plan just came unstuck because of some clinical finishing (which Beith will continue to  do, hopefully in our own grade).

Positives:

If Scottish football keeps trying to reinvent,  try new ideas, copy others they have a chance of succeeding.

The more you encourage youths, the more chance you will have of success (crowd, lot of under 20's there yesterday, players age of in particular the Morton team)

Improvements being made to facilities/pitches in general, still some way to go with training facilities, park was great yesterday, committee and others deserve a huge pat on the back.

Try being positive even when you are drubbed, it happens, having a vision to succeed is what Scottish football needs more of, again three examples, Rangers response to troubled recent times or even their resuls yesterday after being outplayed by Hearts, Celtics response domestically to Deila era, Morton looking like they are on the up, 3rd in the Championship, narrowly beaten in a natinal cup Semi or Beith, we had never won the Scottish, our prize, doing brilliantly to get to yesterdays round and dream!

 

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12 hours ago, BS7 said:

Bonnyrigg very nearly emptied Brechin before Losing 6-0 at home. The best junior sides are easily on a level with the best part time senior clubs .

:lol:

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12 hours ago, AMMjag said:

Beaten. Beaten. Beaten... Seeing a pattern develop here.

When all you have are tear-stained hard-luck stories, the answer to the OP's question is fairly clear: stick to your pub leagues, and stop wasting everyone else's time.

Your top striker came straight from a pub team if that is the case.

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No, if you want to play in the scottish cup, join the lowland or highland league.



Would you have felt the same had the Bankies won the Junior Cup in 2008-09 and qualified for it?
Without going deep into the Clydebank debate, you're certainly seen as future league candidates.
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7 minutes ago, Whitburn Vale said:

Looks to me that the juniors arent the answer with Ed City on the way to establishing themselves and shortly EK too.

WV - you're a decent poster but seen you on FitbaNorth saying junior fans abuse senior teams and shouldn't be in the Scottish Cup - really? Think senior dafties calling clubs and fans thickos and speaking about bits in the West of Scotland in ways they wouldn't about bits up North is more abusive. 

Ed City and EK certainly are great outfits but does the Lowland run the risk of being like the Hghland League in that there are some great sides at top, much weaker at bottom - with few opportunities to change this (at least in the short-term)?

Sorry (kinda) to go over old threads but where you've said crowds aren't what they used to be for big junior/Whitburn games - its wasn't that long ago Peterhead (as a Highland League side) got 8500 against Raith Rovers in the Scottish Cup (in 1987 - I won't believe until I see photies) - nae just a junior phenomenon! 

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That won't happen my friend. Their set up is poor from the ground level. Hardly any fanbase and it would ludicrous to have Talbot Beith Pollok and the likes travel hundred of miles to play a team for the sake of a silly pyramid system.
The SFA know it was a mistake but their arrogance to acknowledge it is what everyone had come to expect.
Remoulding the Juniors brands and amalgamate West/East/North would be a better option.
The fanbase proves The Juniors should have been the choice ahead of the HL/LL set up


The juniors have been equally arrogant when it comes to the pyramid setup. Both sides are now firmly entrenched in their thinking so sadly I can't see any compromise being made by either side now.
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1 minute ago, Jack Burton said:

 


The juniors have been equally arrogant when it comes to the pyramid setup. Both sides are now firmly entrenched in their thinking so sadly I can't see any compromise being made by either side now.

 

individual junior clubs will start to jump ship and that will make wholesale change irresistible. IMO, of course.

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Cheerz for the praise sunrise and disagreement on a few of my points,thats what forums like this and fn are all about. Totally agree with you on the crowd thing,at all levels crowds are down but particularly in non-league,society is changing no doubt about it and fitba isnt the star atrraction it once was.Onto the junior v ll/hl debate,as you know i come from a town with a formally successful junior team and until recently always thought of them as a reasonably big non league club but i can't get away from the fact that clubs like Whitburn are being overtaken by clubs in the LL that have come from nowhere and are now going places while wjfc are not. Thats how it feels to me,only my opinion,i do however hope and pray that somebody,somewhere gets all of our non league sorted out and yes i do think 3 leagues, north,east and west is the way forward. The 3 champions could play off against the bottom team in league 2 for a place in the SPFL.

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Bonnyrigg very nearly emptied Brechin before Losing 6-0 at home. The best junior sides are easily on a level with the best part time senior clubs .



Junior sides have played 25 games against league one or two opposition and have recorded 4 wins. There clearly is significant gulf between junior sides and league one/two.

The highest ranked side to lose to a junior side was Arbroath who finished 9th in league one in 09/10 when they lost to Irvine Meadow.
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8 minutes ago, Shanner said:

individual junior clubs will start to jump ship and that will make wholesale change irresistible. IMO, of course.

The time has passed for this. The only one who have designs on it, should a vacancy arise is Linlithgow. No-one else has the foresight unfortunately. 

It seems moaning about no fixture list and a pile up of games at the end of each season is too much to give up.

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4 minutes ago, gogsy said:

Where will these junior clubs jump ship to? Lowland league and Highland league have no vacancies.

I'd imagine that if the will was there then vacancies would be made. It would be a major coup for the LL to snag a could of big Junior sides. I'm talking 10 - 15 years down the line, and really it's just my gut feeling as much as anything. 

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2 minutes ago, jimbaxters said:

The time has passed for this. The only one who have designs on it, should a vacancy arise is Linlithgow. No-one else has the foresight unfortunately. 

It seems moaning about no fixture list and a pile up of games at the end of each season is too much to give up.

It's abysmal and all the moaning in the world doesn't seem to have much impact on improving it. 

I don't really get why people are so fundamentally attached to something as deeply flawed as the current Junior set up. 

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Just now, Shanner said:

It's abysmal and all the moaning in the world doesn't seem to have much impact on improving it. 

I don't really get why people are so fundamentally attached to something as deeply flawed as the current Junior set up. 

Big fish in small pond syndrome....and I include my own club in that. 

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5 minutes ago, Shanner said:

It's abysmal and all the moaning in the world doesn't seem to have much impact on improving it. 

I don't really get why people are so fundamentally attached to something as deeply flawed as the current Junior set up. 

Scots are very conservative-with-a-small-c folk. We don't like change all that much, especially fundamental change of the type you (quite rightly) are advocating.

I like the junior grade and respect the history and traditional associated with it. If history and tradition is allowed to contunue to trump moving with the times, the junior game will become a fossilised irrelevance. I'm fine with junior clubs entering the Scottish Cup, it's just frustrating that their engagement with the senior ranks is reduced to that marginal status.

It'd be great to see the likes of Auchinleck, Beith, Clydebank, Linlithgow, Bonnyrigg, Pollok, Kelty all having the chance to climb a unified pyramid. It's a long way off though.

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1 minute ago, Ivo den Bieman said:

Scots are very conservative-with-a-small-c folk. We don't like change all that much, especially fundamental change of the type you (quite rightly) are advocating.

I like the junior grade and respect the history and traditional associated with it. If history and tradition is allowed to contunue to trump moving with the times, the junior game will become a fossilised irrelevance.

It'd be great to see the likes of Auchinleck, Beith, Clydebank, Linlithgow, Bonnyrigg, Pollok, Kelty all having the chance to climb a unified pyramid. It's a long way off though.

Of course there is an inherent charm about toddling into your home town team's park on a Saturday, seeing all your pals and spending under a tenner to have a shout at the ref. But people fail to see that the sport is changing, or has changed. Big matches like Talbot v Pollok or Beith v Talbot are a draw but 90% of the game is on the bones of it's bum. 

I miss the Juniors like mad but it won't survive for many more years. I can't for the life of me see how most of these posters who are attending games every week (I'm not) can't see it, or more likely, refuse to.

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