Ray Vaughn Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 As it's under 4 years to go, time for a thread methinks. Should we qualify, I reckon we will get Baku is calling us. Euro 2020 Finals Host City 1 (2xSF and Final) London, England Host Cities 2-5 (3 group & QF) Baku, Azerbaijan Munich, Germany Rome, Italy St Petersburg, Russia Host Cities 6-13 (3 Group & 1 R16) Brussels, Belgium Copenhagen, Denmark Budapest, Hungary Amsterdam, Netherands Dublin, Rep of Ireland Bucharest, Romania Glasgow, Scotland Bilbao, Spain Believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigkillie Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 The Nations Cup will be the first step in qualifying for this - a good Nations Cup finish essentially guarantees you a second chance if you fail in qualifying. As far as I can tell, the seeding for that will be based on the UEFA ranking in November 2017 (ie after World Cup qualifying is complete). It seems like the proper Euro qualifying groups will be drawn in November 2018 (ie after the Nations League games are played). It's not clear whether the seedings will be based on Nations League finishes, or based on the UEFA ranking system. The current rankings are outlined here, but they're a bit misleading, since France will have their results in 2018 qualifying double counted, while Russia's results won't count at all. We definitely have a chance of making Division B if we do well in World Cup qualifying, and that might give us a shot at being second seeds for the proper qualifying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordopolis Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 The Nations Cup will be the first step in qualifying for this - a good Nations Cup finish essentially guarantees you a second chance if you fail in qualifying. As far as I can tell, the seeding for that will be based on the UEFA ranking in November 2017 (ie after World Cup qualifying is complete). It seems like the proper Euro qualifying groups will be drawn in November 2018 (ie after the Nations League games are played). It's not clear whether the seedings will be based on Nations League finishes, or based on the UEFA ranking system. The current rankings are outlined here, but they're a bit misleading, since France will have their results in 2018 qualifying double counted, while Russia's results won't count at all. We definitely have a chance of making Division B if we do well in World Cup qualifying, and that might give us a shot at being second seeds for the proper qualifying. Simple as that! When are the Nations League games drawn and when do they begin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forameus Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 If FM is anything to go by (could change by the time it actually comes out) they'll be drawn the summer before they're played, with all games happening in the August/October/November international windows. The qualifying groups proper are then drawn in December/January time for a March start Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordopolis Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 If FM is anything to go by (could change by the time it actually comes out) they'll be drawn the summer before they're played, with all games happening in the August/October/November international windows. The qualifying groups proper are then drawn in December/January time for a March start Ah right, so summer 2018 will be the first NC draw? Aug-Nov is quite condensed. I had it in my head that each NC group would be played out over a year or more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forameus Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 Ah right, so summer 2018 will be the first NC draw? Aug-Nov is quite condensed. I had it in my head that each NC group would be played out over a year or more. Yeah, Summer 2018. if it follows the way it's coded in FM which is probably using a fair bit of assumption. Could well be earlier, or they could wait until WC2018 is over. Unlikely though. There's only going to be 3 or 4 teams in each group. Aug-Nov gives you six international dates. Teams in groups of 4 (us most probably) will play each team twice to make up the 6 games. Bigger sides in groups of 3 will do the same but have two dates free to organise whatever money-spinning friendlies they please. There's then ten dates the following year for the qualifiers to take place in (full for groups of 6, two free dates for groups of 5) March, June, August, October, November. No more playoffs for the main qualifying, but there will be a nations league playoff in March 2020 to fill the last few spaces in the Summers tournament. Then the cycle repeats every two years, but with no playoffs in the March of World Cup years. It's a good thing for us IMO, as it forces you to actually play games. Seems a simple thing, but it's something the SFA have conclusively failed in, preferring to have us either not meet up at all, or have a "training camp". This way, unless we reach the top two tiers of the Nations League, then we won't have any free windows that the SFA can avoid. In fact, if we follow that up by getting a 6 team group for qualifiers, we'll be playing on every single available international window. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
troopio Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 Only way we will be there is through hosting these games.........least we made it for a change!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordopolis Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 Yeah, Summer 2018. if it follows the way it's coded in FM which is probably using a fair bit of assumption. Could well be earlier, or they could wait until WC2018 is over. Unlikely though. There's only going to be 3 or 4 teams in each group. Aug-Nov gives you six international dates. Teams in groups of 4 (us most probably) will play each team twice to make up the 6 games. Bigger sides in groups of 3 will do the same but have two dates free to organise whatever money-spinning friendlies they please. There's then ten dates the following year for the qualifiers to take place in (full for groups of 6, two free dates for groups of 5) March, June, August, October, November. No more playoffs for the main qualifying, but there will be a nations league playoff in March 2020 to fill the last few spaces in the Summers tournament. Then the cycle repeats every two years, but with no playoffs in the March of World Cup years. It's a good thing for us IMO, as it forces you to actually play games. Seems a simple thing, but it's something the SFA have conclusively failed in, preferring to have us either not meet up at all, or have a "training camp". This way, unless we reach the top two tiers of the Nations League, then we won't have any free windows that the SFA can avoid. In fact, if we follow that up by getting a 6 team group for qualifiers, we'll be playing on every single available international window. I agree it's a good thing re forcing us to play as often as possible. Shame it's so complicated! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogmc Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 I agree it's a good thing re forcing us to play as often as possible. Shame it's so complicated!If we change mgr yes....current mgr sticks with forrest n Martin in friendlies.....we would be screwed in new format for progress cos there's no friendlies as such....all games count....no danger we would try new combos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forameus Posted July 1, 2016 Share Posted July 1, 2016 If we change mgr yes....current mgr sticks with forrest n Martin in friendlies.....we would be screwed in new format for progress cos there's no friendlies as such....all games count....no danger we would try new combos Nations League are technically friendlies. I don't think they matter any more than friendlies for World Rankings, with the extra bonus that being in a diddy league can mean a back-door qualification for the Euros. But aye, it's all Strachan's fault, waah waah waah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordopolis Posted July 1, 2016 Share Posted July 1, 2016 Nations League are technically friendlies. I don't think they matter any more than friendlies for World Rankings, with the extra bonus that being in a diddy league can mean a back-door qualification for the Euros. But aye, it's all Strachan's fault, waah waah waah. I stubbed my toe when I got up this morning. Bloody Strachan! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted July 1, 2016 Share Posted July 1, 2016 As noted above I don't think the Nations League games will count as competitive matches in the ranking: tournaments like the East Asia Cup, regional championships in Africa and Central America / Caribbean do not, although I appreciate those are not continent-wide. Did the CONCACAF Cup (played to decide which of the winners of the Gold Cup qualifies for the Confederations Cup) receive ranking points? Schedule-wise, it is not that complicated. On the September-October-November 2018 international weekends the Nations League sections are played, with the section winners promoted and the bottom places relegated. Sections of 3/4 countries each = 6 dates. (4 winners of the top division sections play a Finals Tournament in summer 2019 filling the empty summer every 4yrs). On the March-June-September-October-November 2019 international weekends the Euro 2020 qualifiers are played. Top 2 in each qualify. Sections of 5/6 countries each = 6 dates. On the March 2020 international weekend 4 sets of playoffs - each in the form of 2 SFs & 1 Final - are held in 4 neutral cities yet to be announced. There is 1 playoff for each division of the UEFA Nations League, involving the highest-placed country from each section which hasn't already qualified. Coupled with the fact there is no single host country for Euro 2020 itself, but instead 12 cities hosting group games and R2 / QFs and London the SFs & Final, it will seem a very fractured process and occasion IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordopolis Posted July 2, 2016 Share Posted July 2, 2016 As noted above I don't think the Nations League games will count as competitive matches in the ranking: tournaments like the East Asia Cup, regional championships in Africa and Central America / Caribbean do not, although I appreciate those are not continent-wide. Did the CONCACAF Cup (played to decide which of the winners of the Gold Cup qualifies for the Confederations Cup) receive ranking points? Schedule-wise, it is not that complicated. On the September-October-November 2018 international weekends the Nations League sections are played, with the section winners promoted and the bottom places relegated. Sections of 3/4 countries each = 6 dates. (4 winners of the top division sections play a Finals Tournament in summer 2019 filling the empty summer every 4yrs). On the March-June-September-October-November 2019 international weekends the Euro 2020 qualifiers are played. Top 2 in each qualify. Sections of 5/6 countries each = 6 dates. On the March 2020 international weekend 4 sets of playoffs - each in the form of 2 SFs & 1 Final - are held in 4 neutral cities yet to be announced. There is 1 playoff for each division of the UEFA Nations League, involving the highest-placed country from each section which hasn't already qualified. Coupled with the fact there is no single host country for Euro 2020 itself, but instead 12 cities hosting group games and R2 / QFs and London the SFs & Final, it will seem a very fractured process and occasion IMO. Thanks for that. Could it be a negative that the NL games are bunched together then the Euro Qualifiers too? Currently, teams use friendlies before/after/between qualifying games to try things/warm up. I suppose it'll have the same effect on all teams involved so probably not a negative as such. Will be interesting to see how it all pans out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted July 2, 2016 Share Posted July 2, 2016 There will be no dedicated space for friendlies - except for March 2020 if you're not in the playoffs and the pre-tournament build-up to Euro 2020 itself. However - rather like the League Cup sections in domestic football, I suspect many (especially big nations) will treat the Nations League like friendlies... It'll be interesting to see if 6 substitutes are allowed. Also worth saying that 5 of the Euro 2020 qualifying groups will have 5 nations instead of 6 - meaning the odd teams could play friendlies against each other - and the sections in the top 2 levels of UEFA Nations League (plus 1 section in the third level) will have 3 nations instead of 4, so again they can play friendlies when they're the odd teams. Equally if we end-up in the Nations League third level and not in Section A, and we end-up in Groups F-J in the Euro 2020 qualifiers, then we will have 16 competitive matches and no friendlies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Officer Barbrady Posted July 2, 2016 Share Posted July 2, 2016 Noticed on the Euro2020 qualifying page on Wiki, that the teams who progress to the final four from the 2018 autumn series, are selected in groups of five, as to allow the room for the semis and final in June. By my guess, the draw for the main qualifying series must be taking place after those fixtures then? And, as an aside, will there be 3rd/4th place matches in divisions 2-4, given that its highly probable the top division sides will qualify automatically, and it stipulates the 'best placed side from the next division, not already qualified.....'...there's a more than likely chance that the spot for Division 1, goes to Div 2, who's winners or runners up may already be through, and whereby a tiebreaker between the losing semi finalists may be needed..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Officer Barbrady Posted July 2, 2016 Share Posted July 2, 2016 As noted above I don't think the Nations League games will count as competitive matches in the ranking: tournaments like the East Asia Cup, regional championships in Africa and Central America / Caribbean do not, although I appreciate those are not continent-wide. Did the CONCACAF Cup (played to decide which of the winners of the Gold Cup qualifies for the Confederations Cup) receive ranking points? Schedule-wise, it is not that complicated. On the September-October-November 2018 international weekends the Nations League sections are played, with the section winners promoted and the bottom places relegated. Sections of 3/4 countries each = 6 dates. (4 winners of the top division sections play a Finals Tournament in summer 2019 filling the empty summer every 4yrs). On the March-June-September-October-November 2019 international weekends the Euro 2020 qualifiers are played. Top 2 in each qualify. Sections of 5/6 countries each = 6 dates. On the March 2020 international weekend 4 sets of playoffs - each in the form of 2 SFs & 1 Final - are held in 4 neutral cities yet to be announced. There is 1 playoff for each division of the UEFA Nations League, involving the highest-placed country from each section which hasn't already qualified. Coupled with the fact there is no single host country for Euro 2020 itself, but instead 12 cities hosting group games and R2 / QFs and London the SFs & Final, it will seem a very fractured process and occasion IMO. So are the June 19 and March 20 series pretty much the same for divisions 2-4....thus rendering it completely pointless to win the June one, as March decides the qualification? Its not something that ought to affect as much as four teams from D1.....so, there may be another place on the go before we've even started.....hardly seems a need for the Final in D2 either, in that instance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted July 2, 2016 Share Posted July 2, 2016 You're correct - the teams competing in the Nations League Finals Tournament in summer 2019 will go into 5-team groups in the Euro 2020 qualifiers, and will have both their idle dates then so they don't have to play lots of games at the end of the season. Has it actually been confirmed that the Finals Tournament will be knockout? I was hoping for the 4 finalists to play a group, then the top 2 a Final, in the same style as rugby league's Four Nations? Not sure about the last bit... They can run divisional playoffs with 2 or 3 nations or give the slot direct if there is 1. If there is 0 then the slot is passed to the next level. For example if it had existed this time around the Netherlands would have been the only top level nation not to have qualified - and they would have received the playoff slot and qualified automatically themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted July 2, 2016 Share Posted July 2, 2016 So are the June 19 and March 20 series pretty much the same for divisions 2-4....thus rendering it completely pointless to win the June one, as March decides the qualification? Its not something that ought to affect as much as four teams from D1.....so, there may be another place on the go before we've even started.....hardly seems a need for the Final in D2 either, in that instance. June 2019 is the Finals Tournament of the Nations League - entered by the 4 top-level section winners. It decides the Nations League champion. Everyone else (except the odd team in Group E) will be playing Euro 2020 qualifiers. March 2020 sees 4 sets of playoffs (or maybe not! see Netherlands comment), 1 set for each division of the Nations League... Those playoffs are contested by the highest finisher in each section not already qualified for Euro 2020. They're not title playoffs involving the winners of each division. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Officer Barbrady Posted July 2, 2016 Share Posted July 2, 2016 Didn't read the full thing properly, but yes, i guess having the June 2019 series for the top division, a little more meanigful, as you say given that unless two or more of the top 12 fail in the Qualifying group, they'll go through anyway. Only other thing is, there's more than a full year between the end of the NL groups....quite a long gap to.wait on qualifying is it not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted July 2, 2016 Share Posted July 2, 2016 Perhaps best to illustrate it visually. Imagine it had applied to Euro 2016 (and there was a Group J in qualifying topped by France and Turkey), and the UEFA Nations League had gone exactly according to UEFA Coefficients. Qualified for Euro 2020 via Euro 2020 qualifiers (March 2019-November 2019) Czech R Belgium Spain Germany England Nor Ire Austria Italy Portugal France Iceland Wales Slovakia Poland Switzerl Romania Russia Croatia Albania Turkey Final tables from UEFA Nations League (September 2018-November 2018) Qualifiers to UEFA Nations League Finals Tournament (June 2019) in blue Qualifiers to Euro 2020 in blue / green - these wouldn't be known until November 2019 Entrants to Euro 2020 playoffs (March 2020) in red - these wouldn't be known until November 2019 Germany Spain England Portugal Belgium Italy Netherl France Russia Switzerl Austria Croatia Bosnia-H Ukraine Czech R Sweden Poland Romania Slovakia Hungary Denmark Turkey Eire Greece Norway Slovenia Iceland Wales Israel Scotland Albania Monteneg Nor Ire Serbia Finland Bulgaria Armenia Estonia Lithuania Belarus Georgia Azerbaija Latvia Cyprus Moldova Macedonia Kazakhstan Luxembou Liechten Faroe Isl Malta Andorra Sar Mari Gibraltar Kosovo Euro 2020 playoffs (March 2020) Netherlands - qualify automatically (Semis) Bosnia-Herzegovina v Ukraine (Semis) Eire v Sweden (Final) (Semis) Norway v Slovenia (Semis) Finland v Montenegro (Final) (Semis) Belarus v Georgia (Semis) Azerbaijan v Latvia (Final) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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