Next UK Labour Leader - post Brexit

[Miguel Sanchez]

Chortle.

[welshbairn]

For whatever reason the comfy centrist Labour MP's have no place in New New Labour. They have to accept that they've been outmaneuvered by the Left and lost the battle, and either join the Lib Dems or create a new Social Democrat party. Sitting sulking in Parliament and undermining Corbyn is pointless. To start creating an effective opposition to the Tories the only answer is a coalition of committed parties, so a Labour party of newly selected Lefties (who would have zero chance of winning anything on their own), the SNP, Lib Dems and/or SDP mark 2.

[Dunning1874]

4 hours ago, DrewDon said:

If anti-Corbyn Labour members just blame 'the Trots' for Smith's failure, that would be a big mistake - and an extremely lazy analysis. Corbyn and his supporters have recruited and organised extremely efficiently in both leadership contests. If there is to be another before 2020, Corbyn's opponents won't only require a much more inspiring candidate and a clearer, more compelling vision for the Party and the country, but they will have to both recruit and organise much more effectively than they are currently doing.

Indeed. Regardless of the cult of personality that exists around Corbyn, the idea that this can all be blamed on SWP entryists when he's just received 313,209 votes is ridiculous. 

[dogmc]

For whatever reason the comfy centrist Labour MP's have no place in New New Labour. They have to accept that they've been outmaneuvered by the Left and lost the battle, and either join the Lib Dems or create a new Social Democrat party. Sitting sulking in Parliament and undermining Corbyn is pointless. To start creating an effective opposition to the Tories the only answer is a coalition of committed parties, so a Labour party of newly selected Lefties (who would have zero chance of winning anything on their own), the SNP, Lib Dems and/or SDP mark 2.

Theyre going nowhere. They wont split and risk losing safe seats and the attendant gravy train. Its personal gain before principles every time for plp.

[doulikefish]

2 minutes ago, dogmc said:

Theyre going nowhere. They wont split and risk losing safe seats and the attendant gravy train. Its personal gain before principles every time for plp.

Yeah they are all on the sunday morning shows bleating about "no deselection"

[jmothecat]

Splitting would be worse than staying in the party and having a general election with Corbyn as leader. Splitting may make them feel better about themselves but it achieves precisely nothing.

Deselections would be an absolutely terrible idea. If Corbyn is serious about unity he should announce that there will be 0 deselections and in return the moderates should agree to serve in Corbyn's cabinet.

[welshbairn]

31 minutes ago, jmothecat said:

Splitting would be worse than staying in the party and having a general election with Corbyn as leader. Splitting may make them feel better about themselves but it achieves precisely nothing.

Deselections would be an absolutely terrible idea. If Corbyn is serious about unity he should announce that there will be 0 deselections and in return the moderates should agree to serve in Corbyn's cabinet.

Don't see how Corbyn could ban deselections. If a local membership don't approve of a sitting MP how could he stop them choosing someone else for the next election? 

[Sherrif John Bunnell]

13 hours ago, dirty dingus said:

Kezia dugdale should stand against Corbyn for a laugh.

She would probably forget to vote for herself.

[Bully Wee Villa]

Splitting would be worse than staying in the party and having a general election with Corbyn as leader. Splitting may make them feel better about themselves but it achieves precisely nothing.

Deselections would be an absolutely terrible idea. If Corbyn is serious about unity he should announce that there will be 0 deselections and in return the moderates should agree to serve in Corbyn's cabinet.

The boundary changes make deselections inevitable, you'll have many instances where two sitting Labour MPs are competing for the same seat.

[WaffenThinMint]

1 hour ago, jmothecat said:

Splitting would be worse than staying in the party and having a general election with Corbyn as leader. Splitting may make them feel better about themselves but it achieves precisely nothing.

Deselections would be an absolutely terrible idea. If Corbyn is serious about unity he should announce that there will be 0 deselections and in return the moderates should agree to serve in Corbyn's cabinet.

Had a look through the Electoral Commission's list of registered political parties & registered minor parties (ie. eligible to contest community and parish elections only, which is usually the best place to look for any signs of a split being prepared), & the last entries were back in August - most of them this year appear related to the fallout from Brexit or those planning to be running as independents under a party tag at next years local elections.

Peter Johnson, the current boss of the rump Social Democratic Party, claimed earlier in the year that he'd been approached by Blairites wanting to effectively "buy" the party off its members. Whether this was with a view to defecting as a group if unable to topple Corbyn or simply to waive it as a threat behind NEC closed doors is anyone's guess. Johnson told them to piss off & that he looked forward to the "inevitable" defections (rather cheekily, their own two men & a dug annual conference started hours after Labour's latest membership vote - would have been funnier had they held it across the road from the Liverpool Echo Arena though!)

How much of all this is true is anyone's guess (not least of all the defections, not merely from the current SDP being a micro-party, but also being pro-Brexit unlike the Blairites looking to jump ship!), but New Labour did have a thing about "branding" & they wound up local branches "ooop North" no end with talking about the importance of "the Labour brand" & "marketing strategies", so it wouldn't be a surprise if some of the anti-Corbynista faction considered something this daft.

After all, if they do split, what are they going to call themselves? The recycling of old party names is commonplace (especially amongst the far-left & far-right), but the Electoral Commission rules are pretty strict in stopping people for whatever reason setting up parties with names similar to existing ones. Parties existing pre-1998 are exempt (hence Labour and Socialist Labour), but anyone trying to start up a party with the words Socialist, Social, Labour, Democratic/Democrats, etc are going to be stuck to come up with one that will be allowed to be registered, or that won't be lampooned mercilessly. Labour Democrats/Democratic Labour for example would be rich from ones unable to accept the result of a democratic vote of party members.

[WhiteRoseKillie]

Splitting would be worse than staying in the party and having a general election with Corbyn as leader. Splitting may make them feel better about themselves but it achieves precisely nothing.

Deselections would be an absolutely terrible idea. If Corbyn is serious about unity he should announce that there will be 0 deselections and in return the moderates should agree to serve in Corbyn's cabinet.

So how do you suggest they find enough seats for them all to maintain their status? Should someone lose the opportunity to represent people they've worked for for decades, just so that a sitting MP gets to stay in place? A sitting MP who is more likely than not against the new direction espoused by the democratically elected leader of the Party?

[Newbornbairn]

1 hour ago, welshbairn said:

Don't see how Corbyn could ban deselections. If a local membership don't approve of a sitting MP how could he stop them choosing someone else for the next election? 

 

Surely the local membership would do whatever the PLP told them to do?

 

Oh, wait...

 

Has Corbyn figured out where he's going to stand yet? Sure I'd read that his seat is disappearing, it's unlikely the racist Diane Abbott or Emily Thornberry would stand aside for him and any new seat would, by party rules, have a women-only shortlist. 

[WaffenThinMint]

17 minutes ago, NewBornBairn said:

Has Corbyn figured out where he's going to stand yet? Sure I'd read that his seat is disappearing, it's unlikely the racist Diane Abbott or Emily Thornberry would stand aside for him and any new seat would, by party rules, have a women-only shortlist. 

Exactly - there's a wonderful irony to all this he's going to be forced to become the very sort of carpetbagger his fanclub so despises. That said, on the back of yesterday's vote, he should in theory be able to pick & choose his seat (although there's a bloody big difference between those who are merely paper members for the leadership election & those who are actual branch activists year in year out guaranteed to vote in any local party nominations/vote).

Poplar & Limehouse appears to be the one earmarked for Comrade Corbyn. It's one of the worst "haves vs have nots" constituencies in the country, with Canary Wharf on one side, the Isle of Dogs on the other, & is ultra-safe Labour. Back in the bad old days when it was just Poplar & Canning Town (before the latter got hipstered to f**k), the BNP saved their deposit twice in a row at general elections, as did Galloway later during his Respect days (who incidentally quietly folded back in August, actively deregistering with the Electoral Commission). The minor parties appear to have given up here, leaving it to UKIP & the Greens to mop up whatever ultra left & right votes there are to push the Lib Dems into fifth place,

[Miguel Sanchez]

2 hours ago, Sherrif John Bunnell said:

She would probably forget to vote for herself.

[welshbairn]

It's ironic that the Collins review of Leadership election procedures, that was meant to reduce Union power over MP's wishes, ended up totally shafting the MP's, 80% of whom who are now stuck with a Leader they can't abide. They had no idea how unpopular they were if offered an alternative.

The man who fucked Blairism.

[harry94]

Some BBC journalist on twitter says he has a letter suggesting that there will be a mass resignation of the PLP tomorrow and it's embargoed until 07:45. Other rumours suggest up to 85 MPs could be involved.

I don't really quite believe it'll be that substantial tbh because I'd be surprised about it being kept a secret that well.

[ayrmad]

13 minutes ago, harry94 said:

Some BBC journalist on twitter says he has a letter suggesting that there will be a mass resignation of the PLP tomorrow and it's embargoed until 07:45. Other rumours suggest up to 85 MPs could be involved.

I don't really quite believe it'll be that substantial tbh because I'd be surprised about it being kept a secret that well.

In all honesty, anyone with a shred of decency that's attacked Corbyn from the outset and publicly crossed the line really should resign from the PLP, they've painted their party into a corner that has total and utter monumental General Election annihilation written all over it, extremely pleasing.

You could get a dozen of the most cerebrally challenged numpties in the country to run The Tories next General Election campaign and they'd still win a comfortable majority, jumbotheprat & co are too closed minded to realise this.

[milton75]

On 9/24/2016 at 13:37, jmothecat said:

Corbynistas actively trying to get Labour members to leave their party and join the main party they are opposed to. Is this the 'unity' Corbyn has the audacity to speak about?
 

 

No, unity is no-marks like Kezia immediately going on record slagging Corbyn off, while goons like Hothersall and McDougall cheer from the sidelines.

[John Lambies Doos]

Some BBC journalist on twitter says he has a letter suggesting that there will be a mass resignation of the PLP tomorrow and it's embargoed until 07:45. Other rumours suggest up to 85 MPs could be involved.

I don't really quite believe it'll be that substantial tbh because I'd be surprised about it being kept a secret that well.

Not sure this is happening?

[jmothecat]

It's definitely not happening. Moderates are emailing constituents, speaking at fringe events, doing basically everything they can do to try to keep moderate members in the party.