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The East Stirlingshire Thread


craigiemack

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Isn't there huge gaps between every other league in Scotland from premier to SPFL 2 though ? 

 



Aside from the Highland League, you couldn't make a list of six goal pumpings like that from any of the other leagues from tier five up. Crazy results happen on occasion but not with the regularity they seem to in the LL.
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2 hours ago, Marshmallo said:

That really isn't healthy. The league is too big, the gap between top and bottom is huge with some real dross in there. It's not just teething problems either, looks like it's getting worse as time goes on.

There was no need for the LL to have more than ten clubs, and hence no need to have any Fort William and Rothes type outfits on board. Having four clubs from a relatively sparsely populated rugby hotbed like the Borders was asking for trouble.

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1 hour ago, Marshmallo said:

 


Aside from the Highland League, you couldn't make a list of six goal pumpings like that from any of the other leagues from tier five up. Crazy results happen on occasion but not with the regularity they seem to in the LL.

 

Maybes no the humping But you do tend get the same clubs up for promotion and relegation year in year out though. LL looks like being no different, there's a pattern developing, top middle bottom clubs  ?? 

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13 minutes ago, 1320Lichtie said:

Wow that Andy Rodgers goal

Shire fans must be loving this relegation, looking like Barca in the LL. Could be a straight swap with you guys and city again come May.

Scoring for fun, cheap drink, cheap entry, free scran, excellent social clubs. Hope we stay down for another few.

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5 hours ago, Marshmallo said:

That really isn't healthy. The league is too big, the gap between top and bottom is huge with some real dross in there. It's not just teething problems either, looks like it's getting worse as time goes on.

 

It's not great. However, if you think that's bad there's about 3 times as many for HL - in much of last season they averaged 2 thrashings a week - so your subsequent post isn't right. Also LL had 7 last season versus 11 season before, and yesterday's is the first this season so the rate is reducing.

Most of those in LL have involved Preston, Selkirk and Threave (now in SOSL).

Edited by HibeeJibee
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Here are the extracted figures of winning margins of 5+ goals in the pyramid. In actual fact LL stands-up fairly well:

2013-14
  4   -   SPFL Prem
  2   -   SPFL Cham
  6   -   SPFL Lge One
  3   -   SPFL Lge Two
37   -   Highland Lge
  7   -   Lowland Lge
  5   -   EOS Premier 
11   -   EOS First     
20   -   South Lge

2014-15
  7   -   SPFL Prem
  6   -   SPFL Cham
  2   -   SPFL Lge One
  2   -   SPFL Lge Two
45   -   Highland Lge
12   -   Lowland Lge
10   -   EOS Premier 
14   -   EOS First     
33   -   South Lge

2014-15
  5   -   SPFL Prem
  5   -   SPFL Cham
  7   -   SPFL Lge One
  6   -   SPFL Lge Two
47   -   Highland Lge
16   -   Lowland Lge
30   -   EOS Premier (including 3 Kelso Utd before folded)
29   -   South Lge

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51 minutes ago, HibeeJibee said:

Here are the extracted figures of winning margins of 5+ goals in the pyramid. In actual fact LL stands-up fairly well:

2013-14
  4   -   SPFL Prem
  2   -   SPFL Cham
  6   -   SPFL Lge One
  3   -   SPFL Lge Two
37   -   Highland Lge
  7   -   Lowland Lge
  5   -   EOS Premier 
11   -   EOS First     
20   -   South Lge

2014-15
  7   -   SPFL Prem
  6   -   SPFL Cham
  2   -   SPFL Lge One
  2   -   SPFL Lge Two
45   -   Highland Lge
12   -   Lowland Lge
10   -   EOS Premier 
14   -   EOS First     
33   -   South Lge

2014-15
  5   -   SPFL Prem
  5   -   SPFL Cham
  7   -   SPFL Lge One
  6   -   SPFL Lge Two
47   -   Highland Lge
16   -   Lowland Lge
30   -   EOS Premier (including 3 Kelso Utd before folded)
29   -   South Lge

 

The Lowland League has less games than any of the rest I'm assuming? There's nothing below the HL so it's to be expected - it is also too big and should be split given the disparity between the teams at the top and the teams at the bottom. 

Approximately 9% of games ending with a minimum of a 5 goals between the sides in 2014/15 is not "standing up fairly well" IMO. Basically one every two weeks. The SPFL Premiership was around 1%. League Two was 3%.

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SPFL Premiership plays 38 games. SPFL Championship, League One and League Two plays 36 games.

LL plays 30 games. In previous seasons was 28, 26, 22.

HL plays 34 games.

EOSL plays 20 games this season due to shortage of clubs. Last season 28 (or 30 before Kelso folded). Season before that 24 in Premier / 28 in First. Season before that 18 in both.

SOSL plays 26 games. In 2013-14 was 20 due to shortage of clubs


My point was mainly in comparison to the other non-league levels. Also if you're considering HL differently then you should do same for LL as there has been no relegation (in practice) until now. As I observed most of the cases in the last 3 seasons have involved Preston, Selkirk and Threave - the latter resigned and are now in SOSL, while the former pair are in the bottom 2 places currently with 1 and possibly 2 clubs almost certain to be relegated this season.


It is an interesting point to consider it is terms of % although your figure of 9% seems out to me.

2013-14
  1.7%   -   SPFL Prem
  1.1%   -   SPFL Cham
  3.3%   -   SPFL Lge One
  1.6%   -   SPFL Lge Two
12.0%   -   Highland Lge
  5.3%   -   Lowland Lge
  5.5%   -   EOS Premier 
12.2%   -   EOS First     
18.1%   -   South Lge

2014-15
  3.0%   -   SPFL Prem
  3.3%   -   SPFL Cham
  1.1%   -   SPFL Lge One
  1.1%   -   SPFL Lge Two
14.7%   -   Highland Lge
  6.5%   -   Lowland Lge
  9.2%   -   EOS Premier 
12.5%   -   EOS First     
18.1%   -   South Lge

2015-16
  2.1%   -   SPFL Prem
  2.7%   -   SPFL Cham
  3.8%   -   SPFL Lge One
  3.3%   -   SPFL Lge Two
15.3%   -   Highland Lge
  7.6%   -   Lowland Lge
14.0%   -   EOS Premier (including 3 Kelso Utd before folded)
15.9%   -   South Lge  

Edited by HibeeJibee
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That appears to show LL has consistently had the lowest rate in the non-leagues... always under half that of HL - and last season about half that of all other non-leagues... and only in the South of Scotland League has the rate been falling. Admittedly still more significant than SPFL (whose overall average was 1.9%, 2.2%, 2.9% across the 3 seasons), and it would be better if the figure started coming down.

By the same token you'll always get a higher rate the lower down you go. It's just part of football. In the same way teams concede more goals as you go down the levels.

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12 hours ago, HibeeJibee said:

SPFL Premiership plays 38 games. SPFL Championship, League One and League Two plays 36 games.

LL plays 30 games. In previous seasons was 28, 26, 22.

HL plays 34 games.

EOSL plays 20 games this season due to shortage of clubs. Last season 28 (or 30 before Kelso folded). Season before that 24 in Premier / 28 in First. Season before that 18 in both.

SOSL plays 26 games. In 2013-14 was 20 due to shortage of clubs


My point was mainly in comparison to the other non-league levels. Also if you're considering HL differently then you should do same for LL as there has been no relegation (in practice) until now. As I observed most of the cases in the last 3 seasons have involved Preston, Selkirk and Threave - the latter resigned and are now in SOSL, while the former pair are in the bottom 2 places currently with 1 and possibly 2 clubs almost certain to be relegated this season.

How will possibly two clubs be relegated this season?  I thought there was only one relegation place with the East/South champions playing off for the promotion spot (or, more likely, the South champions going straight up as the East champions are likely to be unlicensed).  

Ah, if a Highland League team is promoted and the relegated League Two team goes down to the Lowland League.

Edited by stanley
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Correct. It looks very likely that SOSL winner will be licensed given Edusport, St Cuthbert, Threave and Wigtown all have theirs and Newton Stewart are supposedly getting close and need it (although they were let into this season's Scottish Cup anyway, tbf!). That means 3 scenarios for relegation:

0 relegated - LL winner wins playoff, defeating Arbroath/Elgin/Forfar/Montrose [this triggers '19 clubs' issue in HL]

1 relegated - SPFL2 club wins playoff and survives
1 relegated - HL winner wins playoff, defeating Arbroath/Elgin/Forfar/Montrose
1 relegated - LL winner wins playoffs, defeating Annan/Berwick/Clyde/Cowdenbeath/Edinburgh City/Stirling

2 relegated - HL winner wins playoff, defeating Annan/Berwick/Clyde/Cowdenbeath/Edinburgh City/Stirling


Early days yet: but with Forfar and Arbroath currently leading SPFL2 and Elgin, who finished 2nd last season, slightly behind it is possible the only 'north of Tay' team in the mix at the bottom may be Montrose.


As you say there is supposed to be a promotion playoff between EOSL & SOSL winners, but unless Leith, LTHV or Tynecastle pull a surprise the only licensed teams are Burntisland and Coldstream.

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I wasn't there on Saturday but from the facebook pages there seems to be a lack of euphoria compared to say winning away at Annan or Queens Park last season. Kind of recognition that we're not that good! Grant and Rodgers look really good but the defence is shakey. That team with Fisher and Buist at the back and Connor at full back would look pretty formidable. Looking to replace Fisher and Buist pretty quickly I think.Things will become clearer on Saturday. From the Youtube footage it looks a bit like playing a pub team on a public park. It's difficult to take a game that has 10 goals in the first half seriously. Coats for goalposts anyone? 

Edited by GoodyWoody
Thought of something else!
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