Team 16?

[WaffenThinMint]

9 hours ago, Doonhamer doon south said:

Can I ask how many teams have gone defunct or gone to the juniors since the pyramid began few years back. I know EOS league is losing teams steadily?

9 hours ago, lowenan said:

None from the Highland League or Lowland League. Only if you start counting the unlicensed teams in the SOS and EOS. 

Just thought I'd show what Iowenan was actually replying before Burnie_Man stuck his oar in "answering" Iowenan.

8 hours ago, Burnie_man said:

Threave Rovers withdrew from the LL at the end of last season to return to the SoS.

The question was how many teams have gone defunct or gone to the Juniors. Voluntary moving back down to the SoS is neither. Nice try.

And by the way, as HtG pointed out, that same Threave that found the LL too hot to handle almost proved too hot for one of the two true cream of the Juniors to handle a few weeks ago - just to put matters into context.

[lionel hutz]

1 minute ago, gogsy said:

To put that into context, that's a team that hasn't won anything the last two seasons and is currently sitting sixth in their league.

They also made it to the Last 16 of the Scottish Cup last season

[Burnie_man]

43 minutes ago, gogsy said:

To put that into context, that's a team that hasn't won anything the last two seasons and is currently sitting sixth in their league.

I'd ignore his wafflings, after all he thinks Threave moved back to the EoS.........

[WaffenThinMint]

1 hour ago, gogsy said:

To put that into context, that's a team that hasn't won anything the last two seasons and is currently sitting sixth in their league.

1 hour ago, Marr1 said:

They also made it to the Last 16 of the Scottish Cup last season

Plus they've been Scottish Cup winners three times this century (& runners up twice) already, as well as Superleague winners three times this century too.

As the old saying goes - form is temporary, class is permanent.

46 minutes ago, Burnie_man said:

I'd ignore his wafflings..

Says the driver of the Juniors Clown Car on this thread - ten posts in the last 24 hours of droning on & on, the same broken record from the failed Junior committee hack these last three years, telling those that have progressed how they ought to be running their affairs from the perspective of the rabble that can't even manage something as simple as a season's fixture list. It's like some old wifey that's never run anything bigger than the church jumble sale saying how they'd run M&S much better than Steve Rowe.

[Burnie_man]

Here comes waffle to derail the thread, he doesnt even know what league Threave are in, that's how much he knows, dear God........placed on ignore.

[Burnie_man]

Entry licence for all tier 5 clubs, this doesn't currently require floodlights. Licence required on day 1. Can't drop current standards that clubs have worked towards because others haven't.

I've talked about compromise being required from both sides if we're to get anywhere, so do you think that perhaps allowing new clubs (Junior) in a revamped set-up a grace period to obtain a licence would help with integration?

Almost all Superleagues clubs have grounds that compare very favourably to most (non borrowed) LL grounds anyway.

[calmac25]

Here comes waffle to derail the thread, he doesnt even know what league Threave are in, that's how much he knows, dear God........placed on ignore.

I think the threave angle you take needs toned down a bit. Threave were hopeless in the lowland league, should've been relegated and are now struggling in the south of Scotland league where they are finding their level. Anybody with an interest in a pyramid can see that them going down was the right decision.

[parsforlife]

I've talked about compromise being required from both sides if we're to get anywhere, so do you think that perhaps allowing new clubs (Junior) in a revamped set-up a grace period to obtain a licence would help with integration?

Almost all Superleagues clubs have grounds that compare very favourably to most (non borrowed) LL grounds anyway.

It would probably help integration , but so would getting rid of licencing entirely. A 2-3 year period with a promotion ban to the spfl absolutely would be harmful to the pyramid.

The LL and the spfl have made there compromises, they are being asked for a further compromise and they may well give ground and accept a 3 region system but junior football must give its comprises, and there currently seems no suggestion they will do so.

[HibeeJibee]

In one respect I get Burnieman's idea but the result would be (say) unlicensed LTHV being denied promotion while an unlicensed Junior wasn't and at the expense of a licensed club.

[Burnie_man]

1 minute ago, calmac25 said:

I think the threave angle you take needs toned down a bit. Threave were hopeless in the lowland league, should've been relegated and are now struggling in the south of Scotland league where they are finding their level. Anybody with an interest in a pyramid can see that them going down was the right decision.

Only pointed out they withdrew from the LL, nothing more nothing less, waffle went off on one and made a tit of himself.

Re it being the right decision, surely they should remain at that level unless relegated through performances? they would not have gone down unless they withdrew. If we're saying that promotion in a Pyramid should be mandatory, then relegation should not be voluntary either surely?

 

[Burnie_man]

5 minutes ago, parsforlife said:

It would probably help integration , but so would getting rid of licencing entirely. A 2-3 year period with a promotion ban to the spfl absolutely would be harmful to the pyramid.

The LL and the spfl have made there compromises, they are being asked for a further compromise and they may well give ground and accept a 3 region system but junior football must give its comprises, and there currently seems no suggestion they will do so.

If the LL make compromises such as a grace period on licencing for those absorbed into the new LL East/West, then in return the SJFA's compromise would be to allow those EoS/SoS clubs who do not conform to basic Junior ground criteria (eg Peebles, Leith, Creetown, Upper Annandale etc) to join with a grace period to comply, otherwise they could be left without a league to play in. That's the sort of constructive discussion that needs to take place if this reform was ever to get off the ground, 

[calmac25]

Only pointed out they withdrew from the LL, nothing more nothing less, waffle went off on one and made a tit of himself.

Re it being the right decision, surely they should remain at that level unless relegated through performances? they would not have gone down unless they withdrew. If we're saying that promotion in a Pyramid should be mandatory, then relegation should not be voluntary either surely?

 

No, relegation should be mandatory too to allow teams to find their level. Threave were doing themselves or the lowland league no favours by persisting where they were.

As I posted before I think the system needs a shake up form top to bottom. You'll find me at hearts/whitehill/Bonnyrigg in equal measures so I feel completely neutral on this

[Burnie_man]

1 minute ago, calmac25 said:

No, relegation should be mandatory too to allow teams to find their level. Threave were doing themselves or the lowland league no favours by persisting where they were.

As I posted before I think the system needs a shake up form top to bottom. You'll find me at hearts/whitehill/Bonnyrigg in equal measures so I feel completely neutral on this

There's the crux though, Threave took relegation voluntarily so we can't have our cake and eat it. That said, you're probably correct in that it was the right thing to do for them as a club. Perhaps if they had less travelling in a LL West set-up, they may have fared better?

[The_Judge]

30 minutes ago, Burnie_man said:

Perhaps if they had less travelling in a LL West set-up, they may have fared better?

[WaffenThinMint]

1 hour ago, Burnie_man said:

Here comes waffle to derail the thread,

Derail the thread? Says the clown that's been droning on about Junior entry & their "rightful place" in the pyramid in a thread about who is Team 16 in the Lowland League.

Just like every other single Lowlands League section thread ends up the second you arrive - on & on & on & on about how the non-league Seniors, the SFA & everyone else should jump through hoops & "compromise" with the uncompromising: those now wanting a slice of the action they sneered was doomed to fail at the time now they've realised it's not.

(And that's another five posts on this thread in under 2 hours)

This time, how about sticking me on ignore which you said you'd done last year but like everything else you've said to date in the LL section has turned out to be bullshit?

The Lowlands League is here to stay, the pyramid is here to stay & the Juniors can f**k off until such times as they give tangible demonstrations of a willingness to work with the rest of Scottish football rather than looking to pick their pockets. Deal with it.

[The_Judge]

Looks like they lost 12 of 14 matches at home.......can't really ask for less travel than that surely 

[energyzone]

Derail the thread? Says the clown that's been droning on about Junior entry & their "rightful place" in the pyramid in a thread about who is Team 16 in the Lowland League.

Just like every other single Lowlands League section thread ends up the second you arrive - on & on & on & on about how the non-league Seniors, the SFA & everyone else should jump through hoops & "compromise" with the uncompromising: those now wanting a slice of the action they sneered was doomed to fail at the time now they've realised it's not.

(And that's another five posts on this thread in under 2 hours)

This time, how about sticking me on ignore which you said you'd done last year but like everything else you've said to date in the LL section has turned out to be bullshit?

The Lowlands League is here to stay, the pyramid is here to stay & the Juniors can f**k off until such times as they give tangible demonstrations of a willingness to work with the rest of Scottish football rather than looking to pick their pockets. Deal with it.

Or alternatively until the authorities present a solution to them that is reasonably attractive?

[craigkillie]

11 hours ago, parsforlife said:

 

Entry licence for all tier 5 clubs, this doesn't currently require floodlights. Licence required on day 1. Can't drop current standards that clubs have worked towards because others haven't.

 

People need to stop focusing on what did happen or what should have happened in the past, and work on what is going to be the best for the non-league game in the future. 

There shouldn't really be any major issue with loosening the standards in the short-term, for example by giving Junior clubs two years' grace.  It's not as though the Lowland League clubs are any worse off for having their license in place earlier.

 

[calmac25]

 

People need to stop focusing on what did happen or what should have happened in the past, and work on what is going to be the best for the non-league game in the future. 

There shouldn't really be any major issue with loosening the standards in the short-term, for example by giving Junior clubs two years' grace.  It's not as though the Lowland League clubs are any worse off for having their license in place earlier.

 

Clubs with licencing get payments of around £10k per year plus get more per round in the Scottish cup than unlicensed clubs. I'm not sure if that includes the qualifiers. So there would be some financial advantage for the licenced clubs.

I'd like to see the Scottish cup opened up to anyone who got into a new East/west lowland league but all payments given in grants that could only go towards obtaining a licence

[calmac25]

There's the crux though, Threave took relegation voluntarily so we can't have our cake and eat it. That said, you're probably correct in that it was the right thing to do for them as a club. Perhaps if they had less travelling in a LL West set-up, they may have fared better?

I doubt threave would have done better in a league with the big west super league clubs but I don't see why they couldn't hold their own in the future and aspire to be a superleague or lowland league (west) club