When will indyref2 happen?

[RedRob72]

All you ever do is reply with “no, that’s you” - I probably should have been expecting it. I don’t reach conclusions “all by myself”. But nor do I base them on my religion, football team, or anachronistic, thick knuckle-draggers that I associate with (unlike you, I avoid such people).

Let’s explore this a little, though. I can see circumstances in which I’d oppose Scottish independence: for example, if the UK was a left-leaning state and independence was championed by far-right Faragists. If you’re honest, I have no doubt that you could never envision circumstances in which you’d consider voting to remove Scotland from London rule, though. You’re too unthinking, too wedded to the ideological idea that Scotland is and always must be a happy northern region of an Anglocentric UK state. 

We have opposing views, that’s fine, I and millions of others are quite content with our place and role within a Union of Nations.

You can’t walk through life stereotyping anyone you disagree with though, it doesn’t work like that I’m afraid.

[RedRob72]

Or wanking sock or something creepy as f**k for a man on a football forum.

Both creepy and strange that it’s piqued your interest though eh!

[Brother Blades]

We have opposing views, that’s fine, I and millions of others are quite content with our place and role within a Union of Nations.
You can’t walk through life stereotyping anyone you disagree with though, it doesn’t work like that I’m afraid.

The main difference Rob is, that most other people are able to explain & attempt to justify their opinion on the matter of independence. Stereotyping is always wrong & you may have justifiable if disagreeable reasons for continuing in the union, but you never state them....
That’s perhaps why people assume that you may have similar reasons to other Unionists that are unable to articulate their stance & reasons for holding that stance?
I’ve heard arguments for the status quo that whilst I may disagree with, I feel are perfectly reasonable reasoning.
You have nothing.

[Kejan]

Rob went to see Northern Ireland in the Euros because he's a Glaswegian,Rangers fan.  

They have the cheek to call folk who support Yes as a cult, or Dons fans as sheep. 

[WILLIEA]

57 minutes ago, RedRob72 said:

 I and millions of others are quite content with our place and role within a Union of Nations.

 

I too was quite content within a Union of Nations. It is called the EU.

Now a choice has to be made and I reject England and all it stands for.

[RedRob72]

The main difference Rob is, that most other people are able to explain & attempt to justify their opinion on the matter of independence. Stereotyping is always wrong & you may have justifiable if disagreeable reasons for continuing in the union, but you never state them....
That’s perhaps why people assume that you may have similar reasons to other Unionists that are unable to articulate their stance & reasons for holding that stance?
I’ve heard arguments for the status quo that whilst I may disagree with, I feel are perfectly reasonable reasoning.
You have nothing.

I’ve stated countless times that I believe that the continued and future prosperity of Scotland is secure within the Union, perhaps even more so after the Brexit result. A union that has served its partners well for countless generations particularly in times of uncertainty. I’m quite content with the status quo, why should I continually question that and seek self justification through naval gazing? Why earnestly ponder over something that I am completely comfortable with?
I have family members, colleagues and friends who are indeed quite vocal in their support for independence, but if they want change, they will have to effect it by presenting a credible alternative as will the majority of posters on this thread.
I’d go with a 2nd Ref tomorrow, as I think we’d get a similar result. What happens then, do we continue to tear ourselves apart through bitter division?
Like I said, I’m ok with things just how they are, I can appreciate the views of those who disagree and if a break from the Union does eventually come to fruition, I’ll live with it, no problem.

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

I’ve stated countless times that I believe that the continued and future prosperity of Scotland is secure within the Union, perhaps even more so after the Brexit result. A union that has served its partners well for countless generations particularly in times of uncertainty. I’m quite content with the status quo, why should I continually question that and seek self justification through naval gazing? Why earnestly ponder over something that I am completely comfortable with?
I have family members, colleagues and friends who are indeed quite vocal in their support for independence, but if they want change, they will have to effect it by presenting a credible alternative as will the majority of posters on this thread.
I’d go with a 2nd Ref tomorrow, as I think we’d get a similar result. What happens then, do we continue to tear ourselves apart through bitter division?
Like I said, I’m ok with things just how they are, I can appreciate the views of those who disagree and if a break from the Union does eventually come to fruition, I’ll live with it, no problem.

Red rob, ok with Scotland being an afterthought, ok with barbaric tory policies like rape clause, atos assessments, austerity and bedroom tax, ok with foodbanks whilst we spunk millions bombing people in syria, ok with tory c***s like Boris Johnson and David Davies dragging us out of a union which actually benefits Scotland. Aye im alright jack.
Forelock tugging pish.

[Antlion]

3 hours ago, RedRob72 said:

We have opposing views, that’s fine, I and millions of others are quite content with our place and role within a Union of Nations.

You can’t walk through life stereotyping anyone you disagree with though, it doesn’t work like that I’m afraid.

Not “anyone” - just the unthinking, brainwashed UK nationalist that you choose to present yourself as on here. If you self-present as a stereotypical, flag-waving, unquestioning Uncle Tam, you can’t really complain when you’re viewed as one.

If you look like a buffalo, you should probably expect to get shot at occasionally.

Edited April 14, 2018 by Antlion

[Antlion]

45 minutes ago, RedRob72 said:

 

I’ve stated countless times that I believe that the continued and future prosperity of Scotland is secure within the Union, perhaps even more so after the Brexit result. A union that has served its partners well for countless generations particularly in times of uncertainty. I’m quite content with the status quo, why should I continually question that and seek self justification through naval gazing? Why earnestly ponder over something that I am completely comfortable with?
I have family members, colleagues and friends who are indeed quite vocal in their support for independence, but if they want change, they will have to effect it by presenting a credible alternative as will the majority of posters on this thread.
I’d go with a 2nd Ref tomorrow, as I think we’d get a similar result. What happens then, do we continue to tear ourselves apart through bitter division?
Like I said, I’m ok with things just how they are, I can appreciate the views of those who disagree and if a break from the Union does eventually come to fruition, I’ll live with it, no problem.

 

Would you vote for a “credible alternative” to being part of the UK? I have my doubts. If you couldn’t countenance ever doing so, you’ll have to give up condemning others for being blinkered, blind nationalists. 

[RedRob72]

Would you vote for a “credible alternative” to being part of the UK? I have my doubts. If you couldn’t countenance ever doing so, you’ll have to give up condemning others for being blinkered, blind nationalists. 

It’s a hypothetical question, but yes of course, how could anyone completely dismiss future possibilities, which surely also includes continued progression and prosperity within the Union no?
The credible alternative has yet to emerge, it certainly isn’t going to appear under the current stewardship at Holyrood in my opinion.
Sorry.

[Antlion]

11 minutes ago, RedRob72 said:

It’s a hypothetical question, but yes of course, how could anyone completely dismiss future possibilities, which surely also includes continued progression and prosperity within the Union no?
The credible alternative has yet to emerge, it certainly isn’t going to appear under the current stewardship at Holyrood in my opinion.
Sorry.

Excellent - as you ignored the query in the previous post, perhaps you could outline the circumstances in which you’d vote for Scotland to be a sovereign state. 

If you could also provide proof of this future progression and prosperity (which you now claim Brexit might help, despite voting against it), that would be useful. I’ve yet to see any case for Scotland remaining a region of the UK that involves the future than a mythical past. 

[RedRob72]

Excellent - as you ignored the query in the previous post, perhaps you could outline the circumstances in which you’d vote for Scotland to be a sovereign state. 
If you could also provide proof of this future progression and prosperity (which you now claim Brexit might help, despite voting against it), that would be useful. I’ve yet to see any case for Scotland remaining a region of the UK that involves the future than a mythical past. 

Your usual and predictable twist, the point being that following the Brexit result, the Union must surely hold to shoulder the weight of any negative impact, that neither you or I can accurately predict just yet. Recall I’ve said previously that it makes no sense whatsoever to try and sabotage the foundations when others are trying to fix the roof. You may see that wilful vandalism benefiting Scotland, I don’t.

[Peppino Impastato]

25 minutes ago, RedRob72 said:

 

Your usual and predictable twist, the point being that following the Brexit result, the Union must surely hold to shoulder the weight of any negative impact, that neither you or I can accurately predict just yet. Recall I’ve said previously that it makes no sense whatsoever to try and sabotage the foundations when others are trying to fix the roof. You may see that wilful vandalism benefiting Scotland, I don’t.

 

Give it a rest Wes you don't give a fk what benefits Scotland it's union at all costs cause you're brainwashed.

[Antlion]

1 hour ago, RedRob72 said:

 

Your usual and predictable twist, the point being that following the Brexit result, the Union must surely hold to shoulder the weight of any negative impact, that neither you or I can accurately predict just yet. Recall I’ve said previously that it makes no sense whatsoever to try and sabotage the foundations when others are trying to fix the roof. You may see that wilful vandalism benefiting Scotland, I don’t.

 

So we, as part of “the union” (the good one, not the one you’ve been told we’re leaving) will shoulder the weight of a negative impact that “the union” has caused us because two nations out of the four decided to leave a union? That’s some fucked up logic, right there. It’s like claiming a battered wife should stay in her marriage because she’s better placed to withstand the beating than a single woman.

In your analogy, it appears that the people who are trying to “fix the roof” are the same people who flew a Brexitcopter into it in the first place. This is really Jockholm Syndrome: the sick idea that the same union you recognise as causing us problems is going to fix them for us.

Incidentally, still no case for being incorporated into the UK from its most ardent cheerleader. No, “well it’s fucked us over with this whole Brexit thing, but we should now trust it to make good” doesn’t exactly sound a ringing endorsement. It sounds like the desperate mewling of a castrated sheep.

Edited April 14, 2018 by Antlion

[RedRob72]

So we, as part of “the union” (the good one, not the one you’ve been told we’re leaving) will shoulder the weight of a negative impact that “the union” has caused us because two nations out of the four decided to leave a union? That’s some fucked up logic, right there. It’s like claiming a battered wife should stay in her marriage because she’s better placed to withstand the beating than a single woman.
In your analogy, it appears that the people who are trying to “fix the roof” are the same people who flew a Brexitcopter into it in the first place. This is really Jockholm Syndrome: the sick idea that the same union you recognise as causing us problems is going to fix them for us.
Incidentally, still no case for being incorporated into the UK from its most ardent cheerleader. No, “well it’s fucked us over with this whole Brexit thing, but we should now trust it to make good” doesn’t exactly sound a ringing endorsement. It sounds like the desperate mewling of a castrated sheep.

It ain’t me that’s like a Rabbit in the headlights though!
Enjoy the game tomorrow!

[Peppino Impastato]

On 14/04/2018 at 22:58, RedRob72 said:

It ain’t me that’s like a Rabbit in the headlights though!
Enjoy the game tomorrow!

Did you enjoy it Wes?

[philyerboots]

[Colkitto]

16 minutes ago, philyerboots said:

Roads are being fixed. Education is thriving. NHS is NOT in crisis. Police force is functioning 

[philyerboots]

well there's yer thriving education.  aint gonna bother wi the rest as  it's much the same.

 

[Colkitto]

2 minutes ago, philyerboots said:

well there's yer thriving education.  aint gonna bother wi the rest as  it's much the same.

 

Education - Free childcare increased to 16 hours per week, by the end of this parly term 30 hours per week doubling spending to £840m.   Record exam passes. Record number of people leaving school going to positive destinations. Expanding Attainment fund by an additional £750m.  Free University tuition. Increasing number of modern apprenticeships to 30,000 each year. And the SNP are going to introduce a new back to work Jobs grant for 16 to 24 year olds . 

I could go on if you wish?