Conspiracy theories

[Banterous]

Well done, the use of the "s" word has taken the level of debate to the lowest level yet, to make fun of people with Downs Syndrome must make you very proud of yourself.

I take it you have a 1st Class Honours from said University.

He represents what socialism is all about and that's well supported by his fellow idiot Danger. Inclusiveness and equality as long as you agree with everything we say in a society that "we choose to live in".

[punkstar_666]

They were. They sold the sofas to the debating chamber.

No, that was MFI. Sorry I'm out of ideas. The truth is out there.

Fantastic reply. When you laugh at MFI or MI5. Please post a link. As that would back up you're factious comment.

[QPSAFalkirkFirm]

Well done, the use of the "s" word has taken the level of debate to the lowest level yet, to make fun of people with Downs Syndrome must make you very proud of yourself.

I take it you have a 1st Class Honours from said University.

I take it you don't know what you are talking about. If you'd followed the thread it was aimed at one individual on here in the sense of damage to the brain, which he clearly has given the guff that get's spouted. And spastic relates to people with cerebral palsy, not Down's syndrome.

[itzdrk]

MFI UK’s Stance on Scottish Independence

We are a spiritual organisation; we propagate and advocate spiritual sciences among all nations and religions of the world. These spiritual sciences have been introduced by His Divine Grace Lord Ra Riaz Gohar Shahi and are designed to benefit all humanity without any prejudice to any nation. The headquarters of Messiah Foundation International are in the United Kingdom. We are very happy, pleased and grateful to be citizens of this country. I would like to express my emotions and sentiments on the issue of Scotland. I would like to request all MFI British Citizens to vote for the United UK. We want Scotland to remain part of the UK in the vast interest of the United Kingdom of Great Britain.

The referendum is taking place on the 18th of September, in a few days' time. We would like to extend all sorts of moral and spiritual support to all the political parties in the United Kingdom of Great Britain who are playing a supporting role for Scotland to remain in the United Kingdom of Great Britain.

United, we are strong. On one hand, many different countries of the western world are forming into a European Union and then we see one country from the UK wants to separate itself from the UK - it doesn’t really make sense to my intelligence. However, I would like to continue to support a united UK in which Wales, Northern Ireland, Scotland (including the highlands and lowlands of Scotland) remain together in a strong country.

I remember His Divine Grace Lord Ra Riaz Gohar Shahi appreciating the quality of British politics. HDG Lord Ra Riaz Gohar Shahi has praised the quality of politics in the United Kingdom of Great Britain.

http://www.goharshahi.us/news/view/mfis-stance-scottish-independence/

[QPSAFalkirkFirm]

They were. They sold the sofas to the debating chamber.

No, that was MFI. Sorry I'm out of ideas. The truth is out there.

Get stuffed.

[Banterous]

Seems to me that Salmond's legacy is paranoia and a sense of alienation as a badge of honour. Terribly sad

[ddfg]

I take it you don't know what you are talking about. If you'd followed the thread it was aimed at one individual on here in the sense of damage to the brain, which he clearly has given the guff that get's spouted. And spastic relates to people with cerebral palsy, not Down's syndrome.

I'd rather be wrong than use the term in the first place.

[QPSAFalkirkFirm]

Seems to me that Salmond's legacy is paranoia and a sense of alienation as a badge of honour. Terribly sad

Objectives and Values of MI5. Copied from their website.

The Security Service Act 1989 defines our role as being "the protection of national security and, in particular, its protection against threats from espionage, terrorism and sabotage, from the activities of agents of foreign powers and from actions intended to overthrow or undermine parliamentary democracy by political, industrial or violent means."

Overthrow parliamentary democracy by political means. UK Parliament, that is. Defence of the Realm, at any cost.

[Ad Lib]

Fucking superb. Moon wired c**t found.

[QPSAFalkirkFirm]

I'd rather be wrong than use the term in the first place.

Fair enough fella. No offence meant to you or yours.

[Confidemus]

They were clearly practices that were ripe for abuse. Postal voting being one of them, but I don't think the end result has actually been affected. The real rigging came long before the vote took place. By having the media be the mouthpiece of the Westminster and corporate elites. Giving one sided debates that was designed to terrify naive and undecided voters into voting No. That is something no lapdog or fake skeptic could deny.

This.

Whilst I don't believe in vote rigging or conspiracy theories, it is undeniable that the final outcome of the vote was engineered by those on the side of BTUKOKNOTHANKS, specifically over the final 10 days before the vote.

Terrifying old people with lies about pensions and manipulating their vote (even on the way into the polling booth), incorrect media threats about consequences of an independent Scotland, corporations being leaned on by Westminster to paint a worst case scenario depiction of a Yes vote, the BBC's unashamed bias are just a few examples.

In short what the establishment and the media combined to do was to create an utter perversion of democracy and under that amount of pressure, there was evidently no way Yes could win. How we got 45% is nothing short of a miracle.

So whilst I don't believe in vote rigging, the campaign itsself ended up being about as democratic as North Korea's Next Top Model.

[Lex]

This.

Whilst I don't believe in vote rigging or conspiracy theories, it is undeniable that the final outcome of the vote was engineered by those on the side of BTUKOKNOTHANKS, specifically over the final 10 days before the vote.

Terrifying old people with lies about pensions and manipulating their vote (even on the way into the polling booth), incorrect media threats about consequences of an independent Scotland, corporations being leaned on by Westminster to paint a worst case scenario depiction of a Yes vote, the BBC's unashamed bias are just a few examples.

In short what the establishment and the media combined to do was to create an utter perversion of democracy and under that amount of pressure, there was evidently no way Yes could win. How we got 45% is nothing short of a miracle.

So whilst I don't believe in vote rigging, the campaign itsself ended up being about as democratic as North Korea's Next Top Model.

Firstly, congratulations for not being a tin foil hat wearing nutter, unlike some on this thread.

Secondly, you've contradicted yourself. You said in the days running up to the election that YES was going to win, you were certain of it, tick tock, 60-40 for YES blah blah.

Now you're saying it's a miracle you got 44.7%. Indeed you ridiculed me for saying 45% would be a good result for YES a few weeks prior.

So, are you lying now or were you lying then? It's one or t'other.

Secondly I do actually agree with you, it is a miracle you got 44.7%. The polls narrowed considerably during the final few weeks of the election, from around 60-40 to 52-48. The polls narrowed due to the panicked nature of our campaign I feel.

Of course - as I had been saying all along - the polls were wrong as NO voters weren't telling pollsters they were voting no. The polls were doing YES a huge favour, a few months prior the real score was about 65-35.

So yes, you did extraordinary well to get almost within 10 points of NO. We should have won by far more, we should have won by 20 points at least. If we had a decent campaign we would have. We were always going to win - as I kept telling you - but we won inspite of our campaign, not because of it. Our campaign cost us circa 200k votes IMO.

[Banterous]

Firstly, congratulations for not being a tin foil hat wearing nutter, unlike some on this thread.

Secondly, you've contradicted yourself. You said in the days running up to the election that YES was going to win, you were certain of it, tick tock, 60-40 for YES blah blah.

Now you're saying it's a miracle you got 44.7%. Indeed you ridiculed me for saying 45% would be a good result for YES a few weeks prior.

So, are you lying now or were you lying then? It's one or t'other.

Secondly I do actually agree with you, it is a miracle you got 44.7%. The polls narrowed considerably during the final few weeks of the election, from around 60-40 to 52-48. The polls narrowed due to the panicked nature of our campaign I feel.

Of course - as I had been saying all along - the polls were wrong as NO voters weren't telling pollsters they were voting no. The polls were doing YES a huge favour, a few months prior the real score was about 65-35.

So yes, you did extraordinary well to get almost within 10 points of NO. We should have won by far more, we should have won by 20 points at least. If we had a decent campaign we would have. We were always going to win - as I kept telling you - but we won inspite of our campaign, not because of it. Our campaign cost us circa 200k votes IMO.

Do you think "the vow" lost us votes? I do and it's because people treated it with the cynicism that it warranted. If we had have ramped up the intensity earlier on, the gap would have been 30+ points

[Confidemus]

Firstly, congratulations for not being a tin foil hat wearing nutter, unlike some on this thread.

Secondly, you've contradicted yourself. You said in the days running up to the election that YES was going to win, you were certain of it, tick tock, 60-40 for YES blah blah.

Now you're saying it's a miracle you got 44.7%. Indeed you ridiculed me for saying 45% would be a good result for YES a few weeks prior.

So, are you lying now or were you lying then? It's one or t'other.

Secondly I do actually agree with you, it is a miracle you got 44.7%. The polls narrowed considerably during the final few weeks of the election, from around 60-40 to 52-48. The polls narrowed due to the panicked nature of our campaign I feel.

Of course - as I had been saying all along - the polls were wrong as NO voters weren't telling pollsters they were voting no. The polls were doing YES a huge favour, a few months prior the real score was about 65-35.

So yes, you did extraordinary well to get almost within 10 points of NO. We should have won by far more, we should have won by 20 points at least. If we had a decent campaign we would have. We were always going to win - as I kept telling you - but we won inspite of our campaign, not because of it. Our campaign cost us circa 200k votes IMO.

I actually predicted 55% 45%, not 60% 40%. I just got it arse about tit,

My view of the 10 days prior to the vote is one of hindsight. Prior to the vote, I was still gripped by stupid optimism and sky high, poorly placed confidence. It's only now looking back, with the "how they voted" stats and the full realisation of how much pressure the UK establishment and media exerted, can I see how badly democracy was twisted.

You actually won because of your campaign, not in spite of it. Because of it, admittedly, you (BTUKOK) made balls up after balls up, but tightening the screw so much in the run up to the vote made it a certainty. I actually think that the Yougov poll showing Yes at 51% was the worst possible thing that could have happened, as it kick started the nastiness and pressure from the No lads.

Had the polls maintained a slim lead for No, and had dishface and his chums not panicked, who knows what might have happened. What is in no doubt is that in the lead up to the vote, BTUKOKNOTHANKS and all their cohorts ran about as unfair a campaign as it's possible to do, including, in my opinion, breaking Purdah rules on several occasions.

[Banterous]

I actually predicted 55% 45%, not 60% 40%. I just got it arse about tit,

My view of the 10 days prior to the vote is one of hindsight. Prior to the vote, I was still gripped by stupid optimism and sky high, poorly placed confidence. It's only now looking back, with the "how they voted" stats and the full realisation of how much pressure the UK establishment and media exerted, can I see how badly democracy was twisted.

You actually won because of your campaign, not in spite of it. Because of it, admittedly, you (BTUKOK) made balls up after balls up, but tightening the screw so much in the run up to the vote made it a certainty. I actually think that the Yougov poll showing Yes at 51% was the worst possible thing that could have happened, as it kick started the nastiness and pressure from the No lads.

Had the polls maintained a slim lead for No, and had dishface and his chums not panicked, who knows what might have happened. What is in no doubt is that in the lead up to the vote, BTUKOKNOTHANKS and all their cohorts ran about as unfair a campaign as it's possible to do, including, in my opinion, breaking Purdah rules on several occasions.

Salmond probably looked at how to galvanise support and one of those ways was by encouraging separatism and isolation. He needed a scapegoat and that happened to be the source of information. Confi, nothing that the media said about the potential effects of separation weren't true. Your post is evidence that his ploy has worked....in the short term. Salmond reminded me of the way that Celtic blame everything around them and ensure that there is never any criticism of their own failings

[Lex]

I actually predicted 55% 45%, not 60% 40%. I just got it arse about tit,

My view of the 10 days prior to the vote is one of hindsight. Prior to the vote, I was still gripped by stupid optimism and sky high, poorly placed confidence. It's only now looking back, with the "how they voted" stats and the full realisation of how much pressure the UK establishment and media exerted, can I see how badly democracy was twisted.

You actually won because of your campaign, not in spite of it. Because of it, admittedly, you (BTUKOK) made balls up after balls up, but tightening the screw so much in the run up to the vote made it a certainty. I actually think that the Yougov poll showing Yes at 51% was the worst possible thing that could have happened, as it kick started the nastiness and pressure from the No lads.

Had the polls maintained a slim lead for No, and had dishface and his chums not panicked, who knows what might have happened. What is in no doubt is that in the lead up to the vote, BTUKOKNOTHANKS and all their cohorts ran about as unfair a campaign as it's possible to do, including, in my opinion, breaking Purdah rules on several occasions.

I'm sure i can find you predicting 60-40 YES if you want me to look for it?

You say we won because our campaign... Yet the final figure was less than polls were predicting when the campaigns opened. In 2012 before BT was launched historic polls showed 60-40 against independence. We *only* got 55.3%.

The simple fact is we lost at least 5% of our vote (I think it was more because of the Bradley effect) across the time of the campaign. Given that, how can you say we won because of our campaign? We were already winning, a good campaign would have increased the lead and got 65%.

We were winning 3-0 after the first leg, and we ended up winning 3-1. Although we won, the campaign lost votes so therefore it failed IMO.

When Westminster panicked Salmond and YES said it was good news for their campaign, and several YES posters on here said the same. I agree with them. Miliband walking around the streets of Glasgow trying to pretend he was a man of the people was pretty cringeworthy stuff, and I think cost us votes.

[Lex]

Do you think "the vow" lost us votes? I do and it's because people treated it with the cynicism that it warranted. If we had have ramped up the intensity earlier on, the gap would have been 30+ points

Certainly never gained us any.

The best thing for the English Westminster politicians to do would have been nothing IMO. Support the campaign from afar and say you really want us to stay etc. Don't get actively involved though.

Nothing riles Scottish voters more than patronising English posh boy politicians like Clegg, Cameron and Miliband. They should have stayed well clear of our campaign.

[Banterous]

Certainly never gained us any.

The best thing for the English Westminster politicians to do would have been nothing IMO. Support the campaign from afar and say you really want us to stay etc. Don't get actively involved though.

Nothing riles Scottish voters more than patronising English posh boy politicians like Clegg, Cameron and Miliband. They should have stayed well clear of our campaign.

Definitely. The hassle that Salmond encouraged worked in our favour though because most people found it distasteful especially Miliband in Edinbugh.

Salmond's complete refusal to acknowledge people's right to vote against independence backfired although the paranoia conspiracy nonsense probably got some lethargic voters whose anger was stirred up. it's exploitation though and in the long term, it's going to lose the SNP a lot of votes imo

[strichener]

Definitely. The hassle that Salmond encouraged worked in our favour though because most people found it distasteful especially Miliband in Edinbugh.

Salmond's complete refusal to acknowledge people's right to vote against independence backfired although the paranoia conspiracy nonsense probably got some lethargic voters whose anger was stirred up. it's exploitation though and in the long term, it's going to lose the SNP a lot of votes imo

What absolute made up pish. Next you'll be telling us that Salmond asked for their to be only one option on the voting paper.

[itzdrk]

Of course - as I had been saying all along - the polls were wrong as NO voters weren't telling pollsters they were voting no. The polls were doing YES a huge favour, a few months prior the real score was about 65-35.

No the real "score" was 44.7 - 55.3

There only ever was one "score"