Let's All Laugh At Celtic Thread

[Kneetrembler]

I also find Football songs glorifying political murder offensive. Its just not right. I know  people from the rural North East that have embraced the symbolism and pageantry sounding extreme elements of both sides of the old firm and have adopted sectarian views. Without football as a vehicle, these people are unlikely to have been exposed to this culture.   I also find Aberdeen fans chanting songs referring to Fen***ns offensive, I am not a Catholic, but I don't think anyone should have to listen to that shite. Whilst most posters on here are probably thick skinned enough not let hearing a few songs ruin their football experience, that's not true of everyone.  

I said after I came back from Bosnia in the summer that sectarianism should have no place in modern football. The old quotation that all evil needs to prosper is for good to do nothing is true. The SFA cant really sanction clubs for fans singing hate filled songs whilst  they use an anthem referencing revolutionary war with England.  Songs about war and killing each other are wrong and we shouldn't have to tolerate listening to them.  Not from any team.

 

[Jacksgranda]

18 minutes ago, Kneetrembler said:

I also find Football songs glorifying political murder offensive. Its just not right. I know  people from the rural North East that have embraced the symbolism and pageantry sounding extreme elements of both sides of the old firm and have adopted sectarian views. Without football as a vehicle, these people are unlikely to have been exposed to this culture.   I also find Aberdeen fans chanting songs referring to Fen***ns offensive, I am not a Catholic, but I don't think anyone should have to listen to that shite. Whilst most posters on here are probably thick skinned enough not let hearing a few songs ruin their football experience, that's not true of everyone.  

I said after I came back from Bosnia in the summer that sectarianism should have no place in modern football. The old quotation that all evil needs to prosper is for good to do nothing is true. The SFA cant really sanction clubs for fans singing hate filled songs whilst  they use an anthem referencing revolutionary war with England.  Songs about war and killing each other are wrong and we shouldn't have to tolerate listening to them.  Not from any team.

 

Correct

[vikingTON]

28 minutes ago, Kneetrembler said:

The SFA cant really sanction clubs for fans singing hate filled songs whilst  they use an anthem referencing revolutionary war with England. 

I'm no fan of the SFA or the Hamish Husband brigade but this is complete and utter bollocks. 

1) FoS can't refer to a 'revolutionary war' because err, Scotland was an established and distinct country for almost the entirety of the Anglo-Scots conflict down the centuries.  There is also nothing inflammatory in the lyrics towards England and the English: in fact it doesn't mention either term once. 

2) There is a patently obvious difference between national anthems, many of which do contain direct or oblique references to other nations, states, kings etc. and openly sectarian content directed towards a specific nationality, race or ethnic group.  They're on very different ends of the same scale and the SFA and all other footballing authorities correctly draw a line somewhere between the two when determining inappropriate or offensive conduct.  It does not at all follow that as the SFA plays a national anthem that it cannot legitimately sanction a club for sectarian chanting.

Thanks to the dimwitted contribution of Nil By Mouth and other lobbyists they've become a little too extensive in proscribing 'sectarian' terms IMO, but the penalties for the broader, scumbag antics of certain fanbases are entirely valid. The problem is that they don't go far enough and can be ignoredor swept under the carpet by clubs if they choose to do so. 

[Monkey Tennis]

1 hour ago, Tartantony said:

 

Why do you find it offensive? I'm genuinely interested in understanding your thoughts on it.

When you say bigotry, are you meaning actual bigoted OF fans who despise Catholics/ Protestants or are you just referring to fans signing Irish or English songs (which more than often are not actually bigoted songs).

I had never thought about it before Booker made his comment above but thinking about it now I think there is truth in what he says. The people that are most offended by it do tend to be bigot minded in themselves, hence why they take such offense. At least that's my experience from folk that I know.

Personally I have never once been offended by anything Rangers fans have sung or said, simply because I don't care about Ireland and England and their troubles. I am a Catholic but if someone hates me for being a Catholic I couldn't care less tbh

 

Singing such stuff is offensive, chiefly because it's designed to be.

I'm very well aware of the complexity of Irish history and the parallel story of other murderous acts that can be told.  However, those indulging in the singing aren't interested in any of that.  They're merely glorifying tribal  violence in order to be anti-social.

I reject totally the idea that only those 'on the other side' can be troubled by such stuff.  I think a great many people with no stake in the OF nonsense find it completely unacceptable.  

I'm not clear on why you say "when you say bigotry" either, given that I didn't say it at all, but hey ho.

You are of course quite at liberty to be perfectly relaxed about anyone disliking you for being a Catholic.  I'm not though - especially when there are so many better reasons.

Edited October 20, 2017 by Monkey Tennis

[Kneetrembler]

4 minutes ago, virginton said:

I'm no fan of the SFA or the Hamish Husband brigade but this is complete and utter bollocks. 

1) FoS can't refer to a 'revolutionary war' because err, Scotland was an established and distinct country for almost the entirety of the Anglo-Scots conflict down the centuries.  There is also nothing inflammatory in the lyrics towards England and the English: in fact it doesn't mention either term once. 

2) There is a patently obvious difference between national anthems, many of which do contain direct or oblique references to other nations, states, kings etc. and openly sectarian content directed towards a specific nationality, race or ethnic group.  They're on very different ends of the same scale and the SFA and all other footballing authorities correctly draw a line somewhere between the two when determining inappropriate or offensive conduct.  It does not at all follow that as the SFA plays a national anthem that it cannot legitimately sanction a club for sectarian chanting.

Thanks to the dimwitted contribution of Nil By Mouth and other lobbyists they've become a little too extensive in proscribing 'sectarian' terms IMO, but the penalties for the broader, scumbag antics of certain fanbases are entirely valid. The problem is that they don't go far enough and can be ignoredor swept under the carpet by clubs if they choose to do so. 

 Fair enough. I should not have used the word revolutionary. It is a song that references war with our neighbours though and my preference would be that our national anthem for sporting events didn't do so. 

I agree there is a gulf between FoS and openly sectarian singing, as you say, they are on the same scale, albeit at different ends. The main crux of my post was to present my position of being offended by all sectarian singing whilst believing that I am not bigoted. I would dearly like to see an end to sectarian chanting and to be honest, the Jimmy Saville stuff can GTF as well.

There is certainly nothing being done  about it currently.

[RandomGuy.]

I totally agree with that, the bigoted part especially. In my experience most people who don’t give a shit about it just ignore it and get on with their lives. The ones that are most offended by it are usually the most bigoted ones from the opposite side.

I had an argue ment recently on fb with a flute playing, marching, bigoted ex neighbour of mine who took great offence to a song some Celtic fans had sang. No one else seemed to care apart from the bigot, so I can relate to the point made by booker.

^ says only bigots argue with bigots, admits arguing with bigots...

[Jacksgranda]

3 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

 

^ says only bigots argue with bigots, admits arguing with bigots...

 

[SilverWolfe]

Singing such stuff is offensive, chiefly because it's designed to be.
I'm very well aware of the complexity of Irish history and the parallel story of other murderous acts that can be told.  However, those indulging in the singing aren't interested in any of that.  They're merely glorifying tribal  violence in order to be anti-social.
I reject totally the idea that only those 'on the other side' can be troubled by such stuff.  I think a great many people with no stake in the OF nonsense find it completely unacceptable.  
I'm not clear on why you say "when you say bigotry" either, given that I didn't say it at all, but hey ho.
You are of course quite at liberty to be perfectly relaxed about anyone disliking you for being a Catholic.  I'm not though - especially when there are so many better reasons.

What I want to understand is why it offends you, specifically you. What offends you about it?

What do you class as being a bigot? Singing non bigoted Irish/ English songs at the football? An entire stand at the football singing an IRA song where a lot of the people are likely not real bigots but just sing songs at the football? Or the actual proper bigots who hate the other side purely because of religion? I think it's important to gain an understanding of what you perceive as a bigot and why it in turn offends you.

Just as a wee additional, I'm wondering what all these better reasons are to hate me when you don't know me. I'm intrigued.

[Monkey Tennis]

2 minutes ago, Tartantony said:

 

What I want to understand is why it offends you, specifically you. What offends you about it?

What do you class as being a bigot? Singing non bigoted Irish/ English songs at the football? An entire stand at the football singing an IRA song where a lot of the people are likely not real bigots but just sing songs at the football? Or the actual proper bigots who hate the other side purely because of religion? I think it's important to gain an understanding of what you perceive as a bigot and why it in turn offends you.

Just as a wee additional, I'm wondering what all these better reasons are to hate me when you don't know me. I'm intrigued.

 

I've told you why I consider it offensive.  It's because it's meant to be.  That's the context within which, such noises are made.

I've not used the term "bigotry" in this, so why are you so desperate to have me define it?

The bit about good reasons to dislike you was actually a wee joke Tony.  As it happens, you may in fact be a top bloke, but insofar as I do know you, via your persona on here, I don't think we'd agree on much.

[SilverWolfe]

I've told you why I consider it offensive.  It's because it's meant to be.  That's the context within which, such noises are made.
I've not used the term "bigotry" in this, so why are you so desperate to have me define it?
The bit about good reasons to dislike you was actually a wee joke Tony.  As it happens, you may in fact be a top bloke, but insofar as I do know you, via your persona on here, I don't think we'd agree on much.

I know you haven't used the term "bigotry" but that was the topic of the conversation when you joined in and stated that crap thoroughly offends you so naturally I assumed that you meant the bigotry stuff offends you.

So it offends you because it's designed to offend? Thats your answer? I don't know why I bother trying to have a discussion with you tbh it's exceptionally frustrating.

[The OP]

4 hours ago, Jacksgranda said:

Your post is worthy of a tedious, snidey character. Well done!

I seem to have touched a nerve. 

[Drew Brees]

^ says only bigots argue with bigots, admits arguing with bigots...

Correct, the argument I had with him was when I pointed out that the bigots shout the loudest when offended by bigotry.

Am I not allowed to argue with bigots?

[Monkey Tennis]

34 minutes ago, Tartantony said:

 

I know you haven't used the term "bigotry" but that was the topic of the conversation when you joined in and stated that crap thoroughly offends you so naturally I assumed that you meant the bigotry stuff offends you.

So it offends you because it's designed to offend? Thats your answer? I don't know why I bother trying to have a discussion with you tbh it's exceptionally frustrating.
 

 

Yes, it must be frustrating.

It would be for me too, if rings were being run round me.

[SilverWolfe]

Yes, it must be frustrating.
It would be for me too, if rings were being run round me.

Haha I'll remember to use this one the next time I can't answer a straight forward question [emoji106]

[The OP]

I'm not sure if a lot of the songs are actually designed to offend. Most of them are pretty fucking maudlin. 

[Monkey Tennis]

39 minutes ago, Tartantony said:

 

Haha I'll remember to use this one the next time I can't answer a straight forward question

 

What question can't I answer?

The one about what I meant when I used a term I didn't use?  You got me.  Guilty as charged.

[SilverWolfe]

What question can't I answer?
The one about what I meant when I used a term I didn't use?  You got me.  Guilty as charged.

Who said you couldn't answer a question?

[JamieThomas]

Well this thread certainly delivers.

Wait, do I need to end my point with a stupid rhetorical question?

[williemillersmoustache]

LET SPL LOSERS SNEER AT OUR DEFEAT. IT PROVES WE OWE THESE PEOPLE NOTHING.

Quote

 James Forrest

22 hours ago

Categories: Articles, Articles & Features, Blogs, Celtic, Celtic F.C., Media, News, Opinions & Rants, SFA, SPL, SPL In Crisis

Tags: bayern munich, Celtic, Champions League, Clowns, disrespect, european competitions, losers, loyalty, scotland, solidarity, SPL, stephen craigan

So some of our SPL “rivals” are sneering at our defeat at the hands of Bayern Munich, one of the great clubs in world football, in an environment we are the only club in this country even remotely qualified to play in, in a competition none of the also-rans can ever hope to reach.

Their sneering is pure jealousy.

It is also phenomenally ignorant and staggeringly counter-productive. How are we supposed to respond to this?

Simple; double our efforts. Wipe the floor with every team we meet here.

 

 

The truth is, I loved every second I just spent in Germany. It reaffirmed everything I’ve heard about the respect in which we’re held across world football; that’s something these people and their clubs can only dream about. They don’t have the magic, they don’t have the things that make us great. The things Europe values us for are what these people hate us for.

That is not lost on me. It hits home today like never before.

Celtic has done right by Scottish football; Scottish football acts like this. Celtic has tried to lead Scottish football into a better future. Scottish football would rather stay mired in filth and corruption, with incompetent leaders and out of date thinking. We are a forward thinking club in a backward looking country, and that’s never been so clear.

This weekend is the Scottish League Cup semi-finals. It will be the first game at Hampden my old man has missed in my living memory. He says he will never attend a game there again, no matter the importance, no matter the occasion, and I believe him. More and more of our fans will come to that conclusion and about more than just Hampden.

 

 

Put simply, we owe the rest of Scottish football exactly nothing.

I am fully aware of how many people here weren’t wishing us well last night. Their ingratitude and narrow mindedness, their bitterness, appals me after having seen the way perfect strangers in a foreign country where we were the opposition made us welcome.

Scottish football is stuck in the mud because of this, because of this stinking attitude. Had any other club raised the idea of an SFA inquiry I think it would have found support; the gutless wonders or self interested climbers on the boards at Aberdeen and Hibs and elsewhere couldn’t see past that it was us asking for it, and that has nothing to do with hate. These people are so stuck in their ridiculous Old Firm mindset that they still see the world through that prism.

Look at Motherwell, who have meekly allowed their cup semi at a “neutral venue” to turn into a home game for Sevco. Pitiful. Pathetic.

Not one of them possesses the imagination to be more than they are, and unable to rise all they wish for is that we fall to their level.

They will wait until Hell freezes over, and in the meantime any residual loyalty many of us Celtic fans feel to the game here will die. Because we really have nothing in common with these clubs any longer, and I say that as someone who has the hugest respect for a lot of their fans, those guys and gals who know this game stinks and want to see it change.

I have written in this blog that I wish Scottish clubs – but one – well in their continental endeavours. I still wish their supporters enjoyable trips and the making of new friends, but I feel no sense of unity with the leaders of those clubs or some of those within their ranks.

They can go straight to Hell.

I repeat, we owe them nothing and from this moment on our only focus should be on sticking it to them every chance we get.

 

[Joey Jo Jo Junior Shabadoo]

9 minutes ago, williemillersmoustache said:

The truth is, I loved every second I just spent in Germany

As demonstrated by your article, James. Not upset. Not upset at all.