The New Raith Rovers Thread

[Crawford Baptie]

Which press reports and what has Yogi said?

http://bbc.in/2mpvt2m

[The Moonster]

16 minutes ago, Crawford Baptie said:

http://bbc.in/2mpvt2m

Interesting. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Rovers don't have any more cash to pay for a 'keeper and thought they'd chance their arm with a postponement. It's the only reasonable explanation, if they've genuinely ignored all of those options (after having them explained by the SPFL board) then it screams "amateurs".  Your right that Yogi looks like a fud there. Saying that an U21 keeper wouldn't have done any better than Stevo is neither here nor there, he had the chance to get a keeper and knocked it back and then moaned about having to use the squad he's got. That's before you get to his "they've never played futba" pish.

[squeezeboxson]

Said the same last night, but everyone was getting on at Gary Locke about the situation you were in with goalkeepers. After reading more into things today, I'd be putting more blame on Yogi for having no 'keeper to play last night.

The SPFL have basically stated what more people thought. There were many options to bring someone in but Yogi has chanced it to get the game postponed rather than field someone who wasn't up to 'his standards'. It doesn't really matter whether Stevo being in goal made a difference to the result at all.

In this day and age, a championship side should not have to play an outfield player in goals. Apart from that, even if Stevo being in goal didn't make a difference, he could quite easily have scored an equaliser at the other end which would have been the difference then.

Edited March 1, 2017 by squeezeboxson

[Nairney]

The statement, put out by the club, was a clear attempt to whip up sympathy and paint the SPFL as the bad guys in this scenario - implying unnecessary red tape and lack of cooperation had got us into this situation and that the club only had 72 hours in which to find a replacement. Nonsense. The moment it became clear that Cuthbert required an op, we should've been looking to bring in another keeper (u21 loan or a free agent) or at the very least have an agreement with a club / player to draft a loanee / signing in, at the last minute, should they be required. Contrary to the way the board have tried to make things look, this situation didn't manifest over 72 hours, we've been playing without a keeper on the bench, for the past few weeks - this was a calculated risk.

We all appreciate budget constraints and regulations surrounding loans, but the situation is so frustrating when you consider the huge squad we have and signings the board have sanctioned, which have added nothing and made little sense - Robbie Crawford, Rudi Skacel and Scott Roberts spring to mind, but I could go on... I'll give Stevenson a break though, after yesterday! Losing three keepers to injury is incredibly unlucky, but it didn't happen overnight. There were a couple of weeks to make arrangements before the situation became desperate. The club took the risk not to do that - that was their gamble. 

Superb job by Stevenson last night. Shame his efforts were so badly let down by his teammates failing to score. 

Hughes is doing his best, and I genuinely think he will manage to pull us to safety, but he's been handed a team of players who just seem to be devoid of confidence and even the most basic of skills at times. We know that most of them are better than this, but this season just seems to have sucked it all out of them. With the best will in the world, Hughes can't instill it all back into them overnight - but he's going to have to if we're going to avoid the drop. 

Edited March 1, 2017 by Nairney
Spelling!

[Paco]

I'm not sure there are many Rovers fans out there who don't blame the board/Hughes/Locke entirely. Completely amateur and we genuinely deserve to go down for the pathetic way we've ran ourselves this season. The list of errors we've made since McKinnon left is pretty long, and somehow not having a fit goalkeeper might not even be top of it.

In terms of moving forward, if Hardie/Barr were capable of finishing exceptionally easy chances we'd probably be having a different discussion this morning. Ultimately a manager can't put the ball in the net for them, and we did create more chances than we have in a long, long time. However what does concern me is the new manager has tried three different systems in three matches. To me, it seems pretty obvious (and has done for a long time) that we need to do the following:

• As discussed, keep Davidson from the midfield, especially if it's a two-man job. In a match against Hibs or Dundee United, if we're playing three in the centre I could get over it. But not in a four man midfield. Matthews does a similar job far more effectively. 
• Declan McManus should be reduced to an impact sub, at the very best. One goal in sixteen (off the bench), or two in 22 for the bold Declan. Or, if you prefer, one goal in his last 23 league appearances. He isn't good enough, he's not going to get any better, why are constantly playing him? 
• Full-backs. It seems kind of obvious, but if we have our only two full-backs fit, pick them.
• I can understand 5 at the back last night, but moving forward Hughes needs to make a call between Barr/M'Voto/Bene. Thomson isn't quick enough or good enough on the ball to play as a wing-back, meaning we're totally reliant on McHattie or a central midfielder (lol) to create. 
• Callachan could do with a couple of matches on the bench too, but I appreciate he may have to keep playing. Our options there just aren't very good.

I really do think at this stage we have all the signs of a team doomed to relegation. We deserve it entirely, and if it does happen the board need to be braced for a backlash - this whole thing is 100% their fault. But we're not there yet. Hughes was the best option out there to replace Locke, he's clearly a very good manager, and if we can grab a result from somewhere the confidence might just carry us over the line.

Ten matches left. Forty points seems a reasonable estimate of safety. Fourteen points to go, but we have some tricky fixtures. Probably need to match St Mirren in our head-to-head, beat Ayr at home, beat QoS at home, and find a couple of wins elsewhere (Dunfermline/Dumbarton away, Morton at home look the most achievable). Pressure is well and truly on.

 

[Black and White Tragic]

Losing only one goal, it doesn't sound like keeping was your problem. Are all your strikers out injured?

Making out it is the SPFLs fault is pretty poor. How about the fact that Rovers wanted to have postponement at the last minute, is it fair on Ayr's support (guys that have taken time off work etc) to cancel with minimal notice?

I knew Farid going to Ayrsia was going to cause us a problem. If St Mirren now beat Hibs we could have a 5 way relegation battle going on.

[Nairney]

12 minutes ago, The Moonster said:

Interesting. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Rovers don't have any more cash to pay for a 'keeper and thought they'd chance their arm with a postponement. It's the only reasonable explanation, if they've genuinely ignored all of those options (after having them explained by the SPFL board) then it screams "amateurs". 

Think you're spot on here.

I've seen quite a bit of online outrage (mainly on FB) from fans of other teams, saying it's a disgrace that the game wasn't called off... I think it would've been a disgrace if it was called off! Why should Ayr have had to take a financial hit (stewarding, catering, hospitality, sponsorship etc) over a last minute cancellation due to the opposition failing to have adequate cover for a playing position. Never mind the 100 or so Rovers fans who probably had to leave work early and fork out petrol money to get down there. Last minute call offs due to weather are just one of those things unfortunately, but this situation was entirely preventable. 

I cant believe the Rovers have driven me to agree with the SPFL.

[Michael W]

10 minutes ago, squeezeboxson said:

Said the same last night, but everyone was getting on at Gary Locke about the situation you were in with goalkeepers. After reading more into things today, I'd be putting more blame on Yogi for having no 'keeper to play last night.

The SPFL have basically stated what more people thought. There were many options to bring someone in but Yogi has chanced it to get the game postponed rather than field someone who wasn't up to 'his standards'. It doesn't really matter whether Stevo being in goal made a difference to the result at all.

In this day and age, a championship side should not have to play an outfield player in goals. Apart from that, even if Stevo being in goal didn't make a difference, he could quite easily have scored an equaliser at the other end which would have been the difference then.

It is indirectly Gary Locke's fault - spunked our budget, including his last act of signing a defender (which we didn't need) just before he was binned. Said defender hasn't even made the bench yet. 

By signing a 'keeper on loan to play in the development league (who is now injured) we didn't get a permanent one and resort to playing trialists. Therefore, there was no one to step up. 

Last night isn't Locke's fault but he created the conditions that led to what was, undoubtedly, a farce. He's a fucking bellend. 

[Nairney]

And I suppose we also have to accept that Locke's strange decision to sign Stevenson oddly paid off, in an unexpected manner, last night.

[Ebanda's Handyman Services]

Obviously it's not ideal and you'd avoid it if you can but...

Stevenson is obviously comfortable enough playing in goals. If we were bereft of attackers and say, Craig Barr was a competent striker nobody would bat an eyelid if he played up top and had a good game.

The goalkeeping situation wasn't the problem last night, our strikers inability to put away chances was.

The circus around the goalie is working as a great smokescreen to us not being able to take chances against a pretty shite side.

 

Back to basics in our next game.

Get Barr in front of Bene and M'Voto so we at least have a chance of winning second balls and having a base to begin attacks from rather than the constant pressure we seem to be under. Has to be Hardie and Stewart up front as well. As much as I want McManus to succeed I feel he'd be better coming off the bench. Throwing Yaw in at the deep end might show that he can swim with the big boys.

What harm will it do right now?

[foreverarover]

Losing only one goal, it doesn't sound like keeping was your problem. Are all your strikers out injured?

Making out it is the SPFLs fault is pretty poor. How about the fact that Rovers wanted to have postponement at the last minute, is it fair on Ayr's support (guys that have taken time off work etc) to cancel with minimal notice?

I knew Farid going to Ayrsia was going to cause us a problem. If St Mirren now beat Hibs we could have a 5 way relegation battle going on.

Ayr' s support. I ready the club's statement whist sitting having food in Wotherspoon Ayr. I'd be certainly peeved if it was off.

[Shadwell Dog]

Typical Hughes. Its never his fault. I'd have thought signing a goalie would've been his no1 priority when he came in if they didnt have one fit enough to sit on the bench. Could easily have had to stick an outfield player in the goal before now.

[squeezeboxson]

16 minutes ago, Michael W said:

It is indirectly Gary Locke's fault - spunked our budget, including his last act of signing a defender (which we didn't need) just before he was binned. Said defender hasn't even made the bench yet. 

By signing a 'keeper on loan to play in the development league (who is now injured) we didn't get a permanent one and resort to playing trialists. Therefore, there was no one to step up. 

Last night isn't Locke's fault but he created the conditions that led to what was, undoubtedly, a farce. He's a fucking bellend. 

You couldn't afford an amateur 'keeper or an out of contract player for a game or two? It has been mentioned somewhere that he tried to sign a 'keeper from Celtic and also approached Rab Douglas (would've be great to see again!) So I don't buy that you couldn't afford one. I think Yogi has refused to sign a 'keeper who isn't up to Championship quality in the off chance he could just ask for a postponement. Which didn't work.

[Grangemouth Bairn]

I don't fully understand the emergency loan system?  Why was this not applicable here ? Ambrose/Commons are deemed emergency loans ? Is it only applicable if teams have an official 'feeder' relationship such as Celtic/Jobs or Celtic/Morton ?

[squeezeboxson]

1 minute ago, Grangemouth Bairn said:

I don't fully understand the emergency loan system?  Why was this not applicable here ? Ambrose/Commons are deemed emergency loans ? Is it only applicable if teams have an official 'feeder' relationship such as Celtic/Jobs or Celtic/Morton ?

I believe it is also to do with age and having your quota of loans at one time. Someone else will explain it better. But basically Commons and Ambrose couldn't have signed at the same time for Hibs.

[Grangemouth Bairn]

Thanks mate. And I meant Celtic/Hibs not Jobs lol. Bloody spell check.

[McGuigan1978]

Rab Douglas tweeted that he could have played last night, which suggests to me he wasn't asked.

Edited March 1, 2017 by McGuigan1978

[Shadwell Dog]

12 minutes ago, squeezeboxson said:

You couldn't afford an amateur 'keeper or an out of contract player for a game or two? It has been mentioned somewhere that he tried to sign a 'keeper from Celtic and also approached Rab Douglas (would've be great to see again!) So I don't buy that you couldn't afford one. I think Yogi has refused to sign a 'keeper who isn't up to Championship quality in the off chance he could just ask for a postponement. Which didn't work.

Hughes will do anything to try and keep his own reputation intact. Thats why he jumped ship at ICT when he found out they wouldn't splash the cash any more. He knew that they would probably be in a relegation battle this season and didnt want to risk being seen as the manager who took them down. Thus dashing the memory of his Scottish Cup final win. He's taken the Raith job to get his name back in the papers as he's obviously scared that people will forget about him.  I think he felt he could take the Raith job and steady the ship before getting a bigger offer in the close season. Last nights shenanigans have now given him a great excuse to drag out should things take a further turn for the worse at Raith. He must be gutted that the Motherwell job has come up so quickly after him joining raith.

Edited March 1, 2017 by Shadwell Dog

[Broken Algorithms]

13 minutes ago, squeezeboxson said:

You couldn't afford an amateur 'keeper or an out of contract player for a game or two? It has been mentioned somewhere that he tried to sign a 'keeper from Celtic and also approached Rab Douglas (would've be great to see again!) So I don't buy that you couldn't afford one. I think Yogi has refused to sign a 'keeper who isn't up to Championship quality in the off chance he could just ask for a postponement. Which didn't work.

We signed an amateur keeper from Kelty Hearts who I think was Greg Flemings brother before. We've done it before, so I'm not sure why we've not done it again. Again, think it's the club and the way we're operating. 

[gav-ffc]

Have had since the 4th of Feb when Cuthbert got injured to get someone else in. If the club thought having one fit goalkeeper for 3+ weeks was acceptable then it is the clubs fault they couldn't sign one in 3 days since the queens game.