[Fudge]

Thought I'd start a completely fresh topic on it with a new poll.

Lets hear your views

[dave258]

Not again...

[lzreid]

Voted.

Early lead for the snooker though.

[Skyline Drifter]

Fudge, on Oct 16 2008, 17:15, said:

Thought I'd start a completely fresh topic on it with a new poll.

Lets hear your views

Dangles hook for Hebridean and Skyline Drifter then reaches for popcorn.

[gav-ffc]

Hard to choose, but 147 i say.

[MTJ]

Hmm while I think the 147 seems harder because it requires more shots it has been done way more on live TV compared to a 9 dart finish, and Phil Taylor has done more than half of the 9 dart finishes on Live TV. Only 12 times in history has a 9 darter been done on Live TV, Phil Taylor has done half of them, whereas the 147 has been done countless times on TV.

I'd imagine excluding tv the numbers for 147s against 9 darters would be even more in favour of the 147.

This post has been edited by MTJ: 16 October 2008 - 16:24

[Raving On]

147 by miles.

[DarkBlue62]

9 Darter!

[keyser_soze]

Raving On, on Oct 16 2008, 17:25, said:

147 by miles.

even further than that!!

9 darts = 9 direct hits, 147 = 36 direct hits + pinpoint position, no brainer really.

[Ad Lib]

My mates and I play both regularly. I can assure you, having seen one of my mates make a 9 darter, whilst never having seen any of us get a break above 50, that 147 is harder.

[Cowden til i die]

147 without a doubt! Although a 155...

[mid-table]

keyser_soze, on Oct 16 2008, 17:29, said:

even further than that!!

9 darts = 9 direct hits, 147 = 36 direct hits + pinpoint position, no brainer really.

Far more margin for error in snooker than darts, plus option of several reds to go for, plus you generally need one shot that involves an element of luck when splitting the pack.
Even if you get 2 x 180s in a row in darts, the standard 141 finish of T20, T19 D12 is monumentally hard.

9 darter by a country mile.

[Gaz]

Exuberant, on Oct 16 2008, 17:32, said:

My mates and I play both regularly. I can assure you, having seen one of my mates make a 9 darter, whilst never having seen any of us get a break above 50, that 147 is harder.

When me and my mates are playing snooker, if one of us goes over thirty points ahead of the other, we just re-rack. Never going to catch them.

[Ad Lib]

Gaz, on Oct 16 2008, 17:38, said:

When me and my mates are playing snooker, if one of us goes over thirty points ahead of the other, we just re-rack. Never going to catch them.

We never do that

In fact, we usually find that someone will open up an early lead of about 20-40 and it will still end up being a black ball game because of fouls!

[MTJ]

Infact the first 9 darter by a professional on TV wasn't done till 2002.

[the jambo-rocker]

i would actually find a nine dart finish harder for me

This post has been edited by the jambo-rocker: 16 October 2008 - 17:35

[The Naitch]

mid-table, on Oct 16 2008, 17:35, said:

Far more margin for error in snooker than darts, plus option of several reds to go for, plus you generally need one shot that involves an element of luck when splitting the pack.
Even if you get 2 x 180s in a row in darts, the standard 141 finish of T20, T19 D12 is monumentally hard.

9 darter by a country mile.

Agreed.

9 darter by a mile!

[Dee4Life1893]

9 darter by a mile

Generally there are more legs of darts than frames of snooker per match. The fact therefore that 9-darters happen less often only goes to prove the fact.

[Skyline Drifter]

Exuberant, on Oct 16 2008, 17:32, said:

My mates and I play both regularly. I can assure you, having seen one of my mates make a 9 darter, whilst never having seen any of us get a break above 50, that 147 is harder.

And he plays darts for Scotland I presume?

I've played league level darts for nearly 20 years. I've never seen a 9 darter or indeed anything especially close to one (in person obviously, I've seen one on the telly). I've seen a 12 darter where the guy missed a dart at double for an 11 darter but it's not like he'd ever been on for it. In fact in the same 20 year period I've only once seen someone achieve back to back 180's never mind the finish.

It's not something one of your "mates" is just going to manage in the pub one night unless he plays the game properly and probably to at least some extent professionally.


EDITED to add: I've been over this ground before and if I start arguing the case again it'll only lead to a debate with Hebs again BUT.............

Fundamentally a 9 dart leg requires 9 almost perfectly thrown crucial throws. There's no luck involved at all. Whilst a 147 requires 36 shots it's likely that no more than half a dozen of them are truly crucial or all that difficult. Fundamentally the skill of throwing a dart into a target about an inch across from nearly 8 ft away is harder than that of knocking a snooker ball into a pocket from (mostly) less than six feet away. Having to do it more often doesn't actually make the skill involved any harder. A 147 owes a little to luck and a lot to holding your nerve. Most of the individual shots involved are not actually that difficult.

This post has been edited by Skyline Drifter: 16 October 2008 - 18:31

[The Phoenix]

Skyline Drifter, on Oct 16 2008, 19:24, said:

And he plays darts for Scotland I presume?

I've played league level darts for nearly 20 years. I've never seen a 9 darter or indeed anything especially close to one (in person obviously, I've seen one on the telly). I've seen a 12 darter where the guy missed a dart at double for an 11 darter but it's not like he'd ever been on for it. In fact in the same 20 year period I've only once seen someone achieve back to back 180's never mind the finish.

It's not something one of your "mates" is just going to manage in the pub one night unless he plays the game properly and probably to at least some extent professionally.

I suspect Exuberant was living up to his user name when he made his claim.

As an aside, I play darts for fun about once a month and a few months back I managed to hit three bulls with three darts. Even better that was what I was aiming for! We were playing cricket and each bull counts for 2 wickets.

[Steve McQueen]

keyser_soze, on Oct 16 2008, 17:29, said:

even further than that!!

9 darts = 9 direct hits, 147 = 36 direct hits + pinpoint position, no brainer really.

With the 147 you've got 15 balls with 6 targets even if your off position you should at least one red that's pottable. If the 1st dart goes in at a funny angle it could be game over.

[Ad Lib]

Skyline Drifter, on Oct 16 2008, 19:24, said:

And he plays darts for Scotland I presume?

I've played league level darts for nearly 20 years. I've never seen a 9 darter or indeed anything especially close to one (in person obviously, I've seen one on the telly). I've seen a 12 darter where the guy missed a dart at double for an 11 darter but it's not like he'd ever been on for it. In fact in the same 20 year period I've only once seen someone achieve back to back 180's never mind the finish.

It's not something one of your "mates" is just going to manage in the pub one night unless he plays the game properly and probably to at least some extent professionally.

He plays in his garage. He's only ever made 4 or 5 180s, but he was pretty lucky to get a couple in a row to set up his 9 darter.

It was pretty lucky to be frank.

[SaltyTON]

All the practise in the world won't make you able to achieve a 147 unless you are a great player, the fact that is only been officially achieved 67 times tells you that.

That and there is three different ways to make the out-shot to achieve a 9 darter, you have to pot the THIRTY SIX balls in an exact order to ever achieve a 147 break.

* treble 20 (60), treble 19 (57) and double 12 (24) (the most common)
* treble 18 (54), treble 17 (51) and double 18 (36)
* treble 20 (60), treble 15 (45) and double 18 (36)

[StewartyMac]

Skyline Drifter, on Oct 16 2008, 19:24, said:

Fundamentally the skill of throwing a dart into a target about an inch across from nearly 8 ft away is harder than that of knocking a snooker ball into a pocket from (mostly) less than six feet away.

Yeah, but the margin for error when you consider the size of a dart tip compared to its target and a snooker ball compared to its target is also different.

In theory, you could be aiming for the left hand side of the treble 20, and it goes in the right side, which for professional top level players is a fair distance away, especially given how much of a shocking miss it would look if it went the same distance the other way. If that makes any sense

Whereas in professional snooker, the pockets aren't that much wider than the balls themselves. You also have potential kicks, runs on the table, playing against the nap, and many more external variables than throwing an arrow unhibited from point A to point B.

I find it incredible that there hasn't been more 9 darters among the top professionals in competition, given the large amount of 180's the players get nowadays. Bear in mind, you only need two 180's in the sequence, the final 3 darts all go into a separate bed, and the 9th one is into one with a larger area than the preceeding eight.

Besides, a hole in one in golf is miles more difficult than either scenario.

[StewartyMac]

SaltyTON, on Oct 16 2008, 22:57, said:

you have to pot the THIRTY SIX balls in an exact order to ever achieve a 147 break.

Thats not true, you can pot the reds in any order you want. If the reds were all different colours, and you DID have to pot them in a certain order, I don't think there would be any debate on what is more skilful.